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Old 09-20-2014, 04:46 PM   #1
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Ceiling Fan Wiring - No neutral?


Hi all,

Just trying to put my ceiling fan back in and I forgot how it was connected originally - I should have taken a picture.

But, the confusing thing is that there is no neutral (white) coming from the ceiling. Just a Black and Blue. Green is screwed to the fan mount on the ceiling.

Here are two pictures to help. If I could get your help on wiring these two together, that would be great. Thanks!



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Old 09-20-2014, 05:41 PM   #2
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Go to the switch and see which one is connected to the switch and which one is not. I am guessing you have conduit in this place. But with the plate for the fan covering the box, it is hard for us to see anything inside the box.



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Old 09-20-2014, 05:44 PM   #3
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Someone has used a hot color for neutral and didn't mark it. Turn the power on and use a tester to determine what's hot.
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Old 09-20-2014, 05:59 PM   #4
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Update:

I removed the fan box to see if there was a hidden neutral, but no luck. Went to the attic and it looks like Black and Blue wires are run directly from a junction box.

Opened the junction box to see a rats nest of wires. Not sure what can be made of all this but it looks like blue connects to neutral and black to hot. I'll do my best to include helpful pictures with commentary. See below:



Based on these pictures, I think blue is my neutral. So if that is the case, I think I should wrap black and blue from fan together and connect to black from ceiling. Then connect White from fan to blue in ceiling. Green from fan goes to green on fan mount.

Aside from the super old wiring, am I doing anything dangerously erroneous here?
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Old 09-20-2014, 06:38 PM   #5
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Another hack job.
You have a real problem there. You can't run those black and blue conductors like that. You need to install a proper connector in the knockout and run a proper cable with black, white, ground to the fan box.
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Old 09-20-2014, 06:55 PM   #6
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Thats scary, definitely need to have that redone

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Old 09-20-2014, 07:02 PM   #7
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From your history with that place. It appears that it is has been full of headaches.



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Old 09-21-2014, 05:57 AM   #8
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Seriously though, the worst part is not that it's a hack job, it's that I don't know who did the hack job. Also, it's spliced in with the two way switch for the hallway light. So not only is it poorly wired, but it's inconvenient to turn on and it turns on an unnecessary light when in operation.

The more I find behind these walls the more I want to hire someone to come rewire the whole damn place.
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Old 09-21-2014, 07:10 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triathalan
Seriously though, the worst part is not that it's a hack job, it's that I don't know who did the hack job.
I disagree.

It is a serious safety risk as wired. Worst case house fire.

Knowing who did it us immaterial. Unless you want to send uncle Guido after him. Either way that won't make your house safer.

Focus on what instead of who and you'll be safer.
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Old 09-21-2014, 07:30 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triathalan View Post
Seriously though, the worst part is not that it's a hack job, it's that I don't know who did the hack job. Also, it's spliced in with the two way switch for the hallway light. So not only is it poorly wired, but it's inconvenient to turn on and it turns on an unnecessary light when in operation.

The more I find behind these walls the more I want to hire someone to come rewire the whole damn place.
I can't determine the wiring scheme entirely but it looks like you may be able to correct the problem with another light coming on when you operate the fan/light.
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Old 09-21-2014, 02:26 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triathalan View Post
Update:

I removed the fan box to see if there was a hidden neutral, but no luck. Went to the attic and it looks like Black and Blue wires are run directly from a junction box.

Opened the junction box to see a rats nest of wires. Not sure what can be made of all this but it looks like blue connects to neutral and black to hot. I'll do my best to include helpful pictures with commentary. See below:



Based on these pictures, I think blue is my neutral. So if that is the case, I think I should wrap black and blue from fan together and connect to black from ceiling. Then connect White from fan to blue in ceiling. Green from fan goes to green on fan mount.

Aside from the super old wiring, am I doing anything dangerously erroneous here?

You need to run new cabling over to the fan. That's one giant code violation. And honestly, you might want to get an electrician, that wiring is far off.
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Old 09-22-2014, 08:42 AM   #12
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Yea, I have an electrician coming today to take a look at a variety of things in the house (new outlets in kitchen and bathroom plus switches etc.) So rather than trying to do a better hack job myself I'm going to let the professionals handle it.

I'm comfortable enough with replacing outlets, but this is a bit above my amateur skills and it is my opinion that electricity should not be an amateur hobby.

Will update after to show what improvements were made.
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Old 09-22-2014, 08:51 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stubbie View Post
I can't determine the wiring scheme entirely but it looks like you may be able to correct the problem with another light coming on when you operate the fan/light.
That's what I'm thinking. The small wirenut in the middle may be part of a switch loop.
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