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Old 04-27-2006, 01:30 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJW
Well, put it under then. And let the ice backup under the metal and drip down into the metal fascia and soffit.
On the I&W boxes it specifically says to put the drip edge on first. It is required by all the building inspectors and is considered code in MN.

Youre not really telling me that felt over the drip/apron is going to keep ice out are you? Same with IWS over the apron with a gutter on....what is going to keep the ice from backing up under the apron? I go to the fascia cladding or the board ifthere is no fasica cladding. If you have to repalce the fascia, then your roof wasnt right, either, allowing the water onto the fascia board instead of dripping past.

If that is the code in MN, then maybe someone that knows roofing should contact the code people and let them know.

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Old 04-27-2006, 03:54 PM   #17
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We may be talking about two different roof edges. If sider edge is put on after the metal fascia, then yes, we run the ice shield 1" over the edge and it is to be sealed down on to the fascia then the drip edge is installed.
I'm sure we have just as much or more ice dams as anyone here. Most of the bad ones are on older houses with heat loss. I have seen where ice has gone up under the shingles and into the soffit when the ice shield is put on first and not hung over, this is obvious. We have fixed many of them on reroofs when we put the drip edge on first and the I&W seals to it. Never had a problem. I see no way that ice can push out the drip edge from the fascia and get under the iceshield. If so, you have way bigger problems.
I see how your system can work, but it makes no sense for future replacement of fascia's or gutters because then you have no protection.
I would like to see someone get a dented fascia off when iceshield, especially grace is sealed to it under the drip edge. Our system, the drip edge and fascia can be replaced easily.
For instance, we are doing a job now, roofing and siding, new fascias and gutters. We do the roof first obviously. Now, if we put the I&W on and hang it over the subfascia(before replacing the metal fascia, like in the picture) and seal it down, it won't be on the outside of the metal. We have to get the drip edge on first to do the roof, then the metal soffit and fascia are put in. It only makes sense. Maybe you guys just go roof to roof and have no repairs or repeat customers, so it doesn't matter. We have been having repeat customers after 1 year, 2 years, 5 years, and so on because of wind and hail.
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Old 04-27-2006, 04:15 PM   #18
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most roofing specifications"at least intelligent ones" call for underlayment then drip edge,if you want to go overkill you could also strip the drip edge in but I dont think thats needed. since when do building bureaucrats know anything about roofing anyway.
Think like a rain drop and you wont go wrong

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Old 04-27-2006, 05:43 PM   #19
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I do almost all referral work.

I have seen ice break concrete, wood, bend steel, etc. I do not think it has a problem displacing aluminum or even thin steel drip edge.

The situation you speak of without the IWS over the fascia and getting into the soffit is eactly why I run it down onto the fascia cladding or board if no cladding is present.
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Old 04-28-2006, 08:00 AM   #20
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I did msay how I thought your system will wqork, but you can't answer my question. How is your system replacable piece by piece. It does not work. I have had no problems with the way I do it and it works for replacing fascia and gutters or installing afterwards. I keep hearing specialist, specialist,(not knocking anyone) but the thinking only goes one way.....for your part of the job and thats it.
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Old 04-28-2006, 10:32 AM   #21
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I see your point about replacement of other building compnenets that tie into mine.

Now, on the other hand, am I to leave myself open to the elements?

If you need to replace fascia later on, you can patch in the IWS with a heat gun if needed and a water-stop.
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Old 04-28-2006, 12:24 PM   #22
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The only problem I see you could have is if the house has gutters, otherwise the ice can't really build up on the very edge of the roof. Most of the gutters I have seen are nailed right through the roof edge or gutter flashing, which I don't like, but it will keep ice from getting behind the drip edge and behind the fascia.
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Old 04-28-2006, 02:22 PM   #23
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I agree that the ice infiltration isnt a problem at the roof edge if there isnt a gutter. I do not agree that ice cannot build up without a gutter.

That being said, I would hae to guesstimate that 80% of the homes in my area have gutters.
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Old 05-03-2006, 07:57 PM   #24
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Arron and RooferJim are right. At the eave only, the Grace Ice & Water Shield should go UNDER the drip edge. This is because we have had (In ski areas) snow blow behind and under the drip edge...this snow melts into the facia/subfacia joint and refreezes, eventually ruining the facia board or popping it off.
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Old 05-03-2006, 08:30 PM   #25
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reread what I said in earlier posts.

I find it hard to believe snow can get under your drip edge, unless there is a gutter, but then it is frozen and on the outside of the house. What does that hurt?
What do you do, hang the I&W over and then push it onto the fascia before installing drip edge? How do you do it on a new house with no metal fascia installed yet?
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Old 05-03-2006, 10:04 PM   #26
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You must be talking new construction. Around here, all the jacks that do new construction seem to forget the ice barrier, but you could hang it and hope for the best. The fascia cladding, if there is to be one, would have to go on before the gutter, and therefore could be stuck before the apron, but not likely if you use Grace. That stuff sticks like you know what.
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Old 05-04-2006, 04:28 PM   #27
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Ive seen eave ice dam leaks with no gutters, it can and does happen. wind blown snow and rain is another issue. common method we use is to overhang I&W and terminate it with a 3/4" cedar ground then put the drip edge on. works great. Massachusetts code calls for a min of 24" past interior wall line.This makes a three foot pass not enough to be complient in most cases.
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Old 05-04-2006, 05:30 PM   #28
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24" past warm wall line here also. We use two rows on everything. So what you are saying is you use a wood (cedar) fascia board?
Everything here is all metal. There is some wood on old houses. In that case your method would work.
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Old 05-04-2006, 08:50 PM   #29
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The cedar ground that anchors the I&W is only 3/4" x 3/4" and you cant see it cause the drip edge covers it. its just used to seal the void between the top of the facia and the roof sheathing.

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Old 05-04-2006, 10:09 PM   #30
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You must be able to see it from the ground. Is there a wood fascia? I posted a pic, now I want to see your method.

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