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-   -   roof leak question (http://www.diychatroom.com/f9/roof-leak-question-19040/)

joshm 03-26-2008 03:31 PM

roof leak question
 
We bought our house in 2006 and I believe a new roof had been put on within the last 5-6 years. A few months ago we noticed some water on the mantle about 3 feet to the left of our fireplace during a heavy storm. There is a small gap between the all brick wall around the fireplace and where the ceiling buts up to it. We have continued to check in but have never noticed any additonal water. However, I was checking it out during the last heavy rain we had and notice that the ceiling around that area looked a little different then the rest. When I pressed on it, it seemed to give ever so slightly compared othe rest of the ceiling around it. I also accidently poke my finger through in one spot but it did not feel wet when I felt around in the hole or on the underside of the ceiling. It was finally nice enough to climb up on the roof today and visually I did not see anything that appeared wrong. All the shingles look to be in great shape. I did however notice what I woud describe as a soft spot about 1-2 feet away from the chimney on the same side that we had noticed the leak. There was a difinitive amount of give in the roof here compared to all of the surrounding areas and the rest of the roof. The area was maybe 12x12 or so. What do you think is going on and how would I go about fixing it if it does need fixing?

oldfrt 03-26-2008 03:37 PM

You may be better off calling a reputable Roofer who can inspect your flashing and chimney.
If you post some pics here ,we may be able to give you some guidance as to what it will entail.

joshm 03-26-2008 03:54 PM

Here are some pics as requested. not sure you will see much. Is the soft spot a concern? Does it mean the wood below the roof is likely rotted?http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4349/img00088uw8.jpg[/URL][/IMG]

oldfrt 03-26-2008 05:12 PM

That flashing is not done the right way.It has probably been leaking for some time so there will be some rot.
You'll need to repair the plywood sheathing as well as the flashing.

BTW,what is the chimney made of?

joshm 03-26-2008 06:21 PM

not sure what the chimney material is at the top. There is metal flashing under that rubber piece that you cannot see. What is wrong about it? Just likely have to replace the 1 piece of plywood and then put the shingles back over it?

Ed the Roofer 03-26-2008 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshm (Post 111094)
Here are some pics as requested. not sure you will see much. Is the soft spot a concern? Does it mean the wood below the roof is likely rotted?http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/4349/img00088uw8.jpg[/url][/IMG]

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshm (Post 111130)
not sure what the chimney material is at the top. There is metal flashing under that rubber piece that you cannot see. What is wrong about it? Just likely have to replace the 1 piece of plywood and then put the shingles back over it?

Josh,

Something must have been very wrong with the metal flashing for them to completely cover it up in this manner.

Since I can not see through the Rubber EPDM, I have to rely on what you say about metal flashing behind/underneath it.

That Dry-Vit or Stucco textured surface, does not lend itself to a smooth compression seal. Did they use a foam backer rod behind the compression termination bar, or alternatively, did they apply a heavy bead of tri-polymer sealant "Behind" the rubber, which is held on with the termination bar?

A textured surface like that only needs a pin hole sized gap in the compression gasket seal to allow water to migrate into the structure.

I am also concerned about how close to the top side of the chimney that the shingles are installed. Did they count on EPDM rubber to resist leaks from nail holes?

Also, that corner detail looks quite baggy. There may be some voids in the turning around the corner with that membrane.

The existing flashings, if that is what someone wants to call them, need to be completely removed and then a proper step base flashing, (baby tins under the shingles), and a properly mounted sheet metal counter flashing needs to be installed, as well as the removal of the shingles so that the rotted and soft sheet of decking can be replaced.

Is this a masonry interior behind that textured exterior surface?

Is it wood framed instead?

What does the top cap or sill splash look like? Please post some more photos.

Ed

joshm 03-27-2008 08:31 AM

It is likely masonary below that textured surfaced as the whole house is brick and the wall along the inside and outside of the fireplace is brick. Not really sure how to go about answering your other questions unfortunately as I am not familliar with all of the terms you used. How major of a repair do you think this will be? Any idea what to expect in terms of costs if we have someone come out to fix it?

Ed the Roofer 03-27-2008 02:31 PM

Please list which words or terms that you need an explanation about and I will get you up to par.

Ed

joshm 03-27-2008 02:37 PM

EPDM
Did they use a foam backer rod behind the compression termination bar not sure on either of those

top cap or sill splash

thanks for the help.

what about costs of repair? How big of a deal is this? Just a minor type of repair? Need to be done soon?

Ed the Roofer 03-27-2008 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshm (Post 111358)

EPDM
The chemical acronym for what is commonly referred to as a ruuber roof membrane. Ethylene Propolene Dionomere (sp) Membrane


Did they use a foam backer rod behind the compression termination bar not sure on either of those
They probably did not. It is only a true architectural sheet metal contractor who has experience with SMACNA (Sheet Metal and Air Conditioning Contractors National Association, I think), guidelines. A foam backer rod is a flexible round tube of compressible foam material, which when installed behind the termination bar or surface mounted counter flashing, provides a tightly compressed seal, even though caulking is also to be applied. It alows for building movement through expansion and contraction, without distrupting the adhesion and weather-tight seal.

top cap or sill splash
The top of the chimney, usually made of concrete if it is a clay flue pipe penetrationg the top for exhaust. It should extend approximately 1 1/2" to 2" beyond the exterior sides of the walls of the chimney. It also should be tapered from the ceter flue pipe to the outward perimeters to shed water. It can get cracked and have open voids near the flue pipe allowing moisture entry.

thanks for the help.

what about costs of repair? How big of a deal is this? Just a minor type of repair? Need to be done soon?
That depends on exactly what needs to be done. From where I am, this could range from about $ 900.00 to nearly $ 2,000.00

I answered your questions above. Could you please post some additional photos of the areas I mentioned?

Ed

joshm 03-27-2008 04:25 PM

Thank your for your help. It has been lightly raining most of the day so I dont know if I can get on the roof when I get home or not. I have a few more pics I took yesterday that may show some of the areas you mentioned. I will try to post tonight. May take more pics tomorrow. Thank you again.

Ed the Roofer 03-27-2008 04:30 PM

Don't be in a hurry. Be safe and do not go up there when it is wet. Hopefuly, I will still be around tomorrow and for quite some time. If you can get a good view, also take a photo of the interior where the water staining is occurring.

Also, optionally, the top of the chimney may have a sheet metal cap instead of a concrete crown. If so, it too shoud have been cross-breaked, with an X pattern, from corner to corner, to create a pitch from the center to the outside perimeters, with a 1 1/2" to 2" flange folding down on the sides.

Take the photos tomorrow or the next day.

Ed

joshm 03-27-2008 08:25 PM

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/f...7/IMG00089.jpgHere http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/f...7/IMG00090.jpg

joshm 03-27-2008 08:26 PM

These are the others I took yesterday. Will they work?

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/f...7/IMG00087.jpg

tinner666 03-28-2008 07:31 AM

I finally realized that among other things, that detail on the back of the chimney will actually run water 'up the roof' and under the shingles.
Look at that thing Ed. It's not even level, it reverses the flow. I agree with you on the cost. $1,200. to 2,200.
The whole thing needs re-doing and hopefully it won't become an issue that the chimney itself is to blame. That would be bad.


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