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Old 05-29-2013, 08:36 PM   #16
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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Yep. They're 2 x 4s. Very little bounce actually.

Looks like I'm in for at least a tear off the old roofing material and replacing the lower 1/2 of the OSB sheathing.

Someone mentioned EPDM. I have no idea what that is. Can someone please enlighten me ?

Is this the rubber roofing material ? I've seen that, I'm not sure how it adheres to the underlay.

Do I need felt paper over the OSB for any of these coverings ?

Remember, you're dealing with a layman here. Come to my job (Medical Technologist) and I'm sure folks wouldn't know much about it either! LOL!

Any help is appreciated!
You are right. Every trade has its language. Go to Firestone Building Products/Roofing/EPDM/ Fully Adhered. REad some of the past posts re EPDM installation, Im sure we have covered this application. You are going to want a cover board over plywood/OSB with EPDM. I think the most recent fellow we helped was doing his shed. Tinner and I discussed this one quite a bit. Other experts helped a lot too, These guys know their stuff.

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Old 05-29-2013, 09:15 PM   #17
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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How much would you figure (ballpark).

What is EPDM ???
Ok, searching YouTube and found this. Looks doable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UllBo...layer_embedded
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Old 05-29-2013, 09:20 PM   #18
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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You are right. Every trade has its language. Go to Firestone Building Products/Roofing/EPDM/ Fully Adhered. REad some of the past posts re EPDM installation, Im sure we have covered this application.

You are going to want a cover board over plywood/OSB with EPDM. I think the most recent fellow we helped was doing his shed. Tinner and I discussed this one quite a bit. Other experts helped a lot too, These guys know their stuff.
Yea, I'm sure no one here knows how to explain the Heamostasis Endothelium and Protein flow chart! LOL! Google it! :>)

Anyways, I did find that thread (and read it) VERY informative!

Jagans - Help - Low Slope Shed Roof - LDPM

That said, I'm not sure what a cover board is that goes over the OSB.

Does HD sell the EDPM and related materials ?

Thank you for your help!

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Old 05-29-2013, 09:43 PM   #19
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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Yea, I'm sure no one here knows how to explain the Heamostasis Endothelium and Protein flow chart! LOL! Google it! :>)

Anyways, I did find that thread (and read it) VERY informative!

Jagans - Help - Low Slope Shed Roof - LDPM

That said, I'm not sure what a cover board is that goes over the OSB.

Does HD sell the EDPM and related materials ?

Thank you for your help!
HD will not be your best resource for EPDM. Go to a local roofing supply house.

Cover Board is used in conjunction with overdeck insulation systems.

You don't need it in this case.
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Old 05-29-2013, 10:12 PM   #20
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


OP, you posted in that other thread in which I mentioned that I was reroofing the patio. Well, I've finished the job today, so I have a few advises to give.

Don't go to HD. It took them two weeks to deliver the stuff I could buy from the supplier, and the base sheet was the wrong one. You are better off going to the supplier. I'm not sure about the rules of this game: the supplier I went to had a "wholesale only" sign on the door, and it seemed like all customers except for me were roofers. But they did serve me. You have to know what you want though.

I used GAF Liberty, and originally I though I would do it for $300 total (my roof is 12x24 ft), but I went over budget quite a bit. It was probably closer to $500, though that includes a bunch of tools I had to buy.

I did it all by myself, and I have to tell you: this is very hard work. Just bringing those very heavy rolls of cap sheet to the roof is quite a challenge. I had to replace 3 pieces of 8x4 plywood decking as well. That was definitely the easy part. I finished the decking on one day, did the roofing on another. The roofing took from morning to evening, and it has been my hardest work day for a long time.

It is not perfect (as for looks), but if it won't leak for 10 years, it was worth it.
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Old 05-29-2013, 10:59 PM   #21
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


OSB should never be used on that deck in the first place. 5/8" cdx minimum. Then again neither should 2x4's spanning 14 feet so it's obvious why the osb is there.

From your second picture it appears you have a lot more deck replacement than the first three or four feet. Every sheet in that picture is delaminating and I'm guessing the roofing is the only thing keeping it from caving in.

We understand your dilemma but $2-300 will not come close to repairing that. You are better off not throwing that money away at this time.

Save your $300 until you can save another 4 or 500 and, with some guidance and research (and lots of backbreaking work) will be able to get the proper sheeting and roofing material and you will have a roof you will be proud of and happy with. Not a big fan of epdm on that roof but it will do on a budget.

Trust us, there is a lot more damage there that you are thinking.
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Old 05-30-2013, 09:14 AM   #22
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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HD will not be your best resource for EPDM. Go to a local roofing supply house.

Cover Board is used in conjunction with overdeck insulation systems.

You don't need it in this case.
I disagree.

1. Wood moves too much. Nails to attach sheathing will back out due to rapid temperature change. There is also the very real chance of transmission cracking at joints in sheathing without a cover board. Ive seen it.

2. Down the road, you don't want to have to tear off the deck to replace the roof.

3. A cover board allows you to have a break down at the drip edge.

Just my Opinion, as usual.
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Old 05-30-2013, 09:35 AM   #23
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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I disagree.

1. Wood moves too much. Nails to attach sheathing will back out due to rapid temperature change. There is also the very real chance of transmission cracking at joints in sheathing without a cover board. Ive seen it.

2. Down the road, you don't want to have to tear off the deck to replace the roof.

3. A cover board allows you to have a break down at the drip edge.

Just my Opinion, as usual.
I agree with you in this application but the typical deployment of coverboard is designed to protect the insulation and give it some additional stability.

I think if the OP screws down the decking in this case as compared to just nailing off the few sheets, that should mitigate that walking and push back risk.
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Old 05-30-2013, 10:16 AM   #24
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


Great advice guys.

I've learned more in this thread that I would have imagined.

I also found many videos on YouTube about laying down EDPM that were extremely informative as well.

Looks like I have more research (and more saving $$ for the job) do to before I tackle this task.

The upper 1/2 of the roof (OSB) is actually very solid and the underlaying 2 x 6"s are in good shape as well. Yea.... I know. Whomever built this in the first place never should have built it that way. But it is what it is and that's what I have to work with.

Who knows how in past Code/Inspection. As ya'll know and I know, money does funny thing to people (and their morals). Just sayin'!

Anyways, for those that care to know..... Here's that flow chart from my job!

Getting studying kids! Test at the end of class today!

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Old 05-30-2013, 10:36 AM   #25
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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I agree with you in this application but the typical deployment of coverboard is designed to protect the insulation and give it some additional stability.

I think if the OP screws down the decking in this case as compared to just nailing off the few sheets, that should mitigate that walking and push back risk.
Thanks Eric, Hope you are well.

I am, and always have been a believer of the nail one, mop one method, to mitigate thermal bridging and mechanical damage to the membrane.

With wood decks, it is my experience that you absolutely need a shear plane between the deck and the membrane. I doubt that he is going to screw down all of his sheathing, but even if he does there is the distinct possibility that sharps and fines will stick up which could damage the membrane, should it be directly attached to the deck.

Think about how many old wood decks you have seen where the nails, and even screws have backed out. Now place a black membrane over top of these and see what happens to the Delta T re temperature change from full sun to night time, or a thunder shower.

Eeeks!

I guess he would be OK without a cover board, but for this size roof, at like 20 cents a square foot, why do without it? He would also be very wise to coat the finished membrane with white Acryltop to reduce the temperature also.

Again, just my opinion. You could be right considering his budget, though. I try to do what works best, then worry the price, not the other way around, but that is not always best in the short run.
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Old 05-30-2013, 10:39 AM   #26
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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Great advice guys.

I've learned more in this thread that I would have imagined.

I also found many videos on YouTube about laying down EDPM that were extremely informative as well.

Looks like I have more research (and more saving $$ for the job) do to before I tackle this task.

The upper 1/2 of the roof (OSB) is actually very solid and the underlaying 2 x 6"s are in good shape as well. Yea.... I know. Whomever built this in the first place never should have built it that way. But it is what it is and that's what I have to work with.

Who knows how in past Code/Inspection. As ya'll know and I know, money does funny thing to people (and their morals). Just sayin'!

Anyways, for those that care to know..... Here's that flow chart from my job!

Getting studying kids! Test at the end of class today!

OK, so where does the ice cold beer come out?
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Old 05-30-2013, 12:06 PM   #27
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


Tear off old, including "decking". Install new 5/8" plywood, 1/2 woodfiber coverboard, 60 mil EPDM. Associated flashings ect.

I would also say try your local commercial contractor, they may sell you the materials and it will be cheaper then a supply house. As far as I know a supply house will not sell you a 20X15-16 chunk of EPDM. They would sell you the 20 PC of wood fiber and 160 screws&plates plus build you drip edge and teh stripping material you needed, and likely will give you wonderful advise. We've done this many times for people, and really it takes nothing for a guy to gather this stuff. Sure the price per sq might be higher then if you bought a roll at a supply house but you won't have extra EPDM laying around.
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Old 05-30-2013, 02:19 PM   #28
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


gt1985 has it right. Listen to him. Get your stuff from a commercial roofer. Use 60 mil unreinforced.

The roof deck does not just support live loads, it also resists wind uplift. Most roof system manufacturers require 3/4 (23/32) plywood to resist fastener pullout. Im sure 5/8 (19/32) will work, fasted cover board at 1 fastener per 2 square feet. Fastening patterns are provided by the roof system manufacturers.

You may want to add joist hangers too as I doubt VA inspection had anything to do with how this roof was put together. Good Catch, JoeC, as usual.

JimA
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Old 05-30-2013, 03:25 PM   #29
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Repairing an Almost Flat Roof... ??


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Tear off old, including "decking". Install new 5/8" plywood, 1/2 woodfiber coverboard, 60 mil EPDM. Associated flashings ect.

I would also say try your local commercial contractor, they may sell you the materials and it will be cheaper then a supply house. As far as I know a supply house will not sell you a 20X15-16 chunk of EPDM.
Would they sell it to me if I gave them my TIN (Tax ID Number) ?



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Old 05-30-2013, 04:01 PM   #30
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Would they sell it to me if I gave them my TIN (Tax ID Number) ?



.
No you are going to want to give them those green things with the presidents picture on them. Ain't no taxes or checks where you are going. Well, at least there would not be if you asked me for a favor in my shop. Start talking Tax ID Number and they will show you the door. I know I would. What are you, a church? You never did tell us where the beer comes out.

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