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MB1 01-30-2012 11:33 PM

Need Opinions ASAP - Roofer causes expensive problem with furnace
 
Is my roofer incompetent? I am trying to understand what a roofer should be reasonably expected to know about replacing vent caps during a re-roof. Around time of my mobilehome re-roof, my furnace stopped working. The roofer came back to assure me he didn't create blockage and that he has never created a problem with furnaces not working.

1 month later without heat, tons of my time invested, 8 hours of HVAC repairman time, and $400 in parts, the repairman determined the wrong crown/cap was put on on the venting. Here's what it should look like: http://www.mobilehomerepair.com/medi...yne/903656.jpg The top cap allows hot exhaust out (with Carbon Monoxide) and the bottom is the intake in with oxygen. The cap installed was sharing intake with outgas, causing the flame to go out.

-Should a roofer take an "inventory" of all the different types of caps on a home? Just looking at this cap, I would think would make someone wonder if the engineers had something special in mind for it during design!

-Should he be familiar with all the different types and their applications? For example, I noticed that my wate heater also has a very different style vent cap now and is not mobilehome specific like others I see in my neighborhood. The vent caps for bathroom exhaust fans have 360 degree access to intake/outake whereas old ones were for exhaust only, including a damper, insect/pest screen, and pointed only down the sloped roof (which I assume is to minimize the risk of water getting in to this electric device)

-My roofer said he just uses the vent caps the roofing supplier gives him for bathroom fans, water heater, and furnace vents. He has never heard of a furnace needing a special cap to handle intake/outake.

Appreciate your opinions ASAP.

Thank you,
Marcum

MB1 01-30-2012 11:41 PM

Correct vent cap/crown that should have been used
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's a picture of the correct vent cap/crown that should have been installed

tinner666 01-31-2012 06:20 AM

Interesting to say the least. I've always been at the mercy of my supplier when it came to requesting vent caps. We roofers know how to install them, but generally, we go to the HVAC supply warehouse and describe the apparent system that needs a vent and install what they give us.
As a side note, if we deferred to a HVAC gut and say we were roofing a house,a nd he needed to come and install our vents, we'd then have to correct their installation at the roof as often as not.Some jnow how to flash the vent, some don't.

Windows on Wash 01-31-2012 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinner666 (Post 840032)
Interesting to say the least. I've always been at the mercy of my supplier when it came to requesting vent caps. We roofers know how to install them, but generally, we go to the HVAC supply warehouse and describe the apparent system that needs a vent and install what they give us.
As a side note, if we deferred to a HVAC gut and say we were roofing a house,a nd he needed to come and install our vents, we'd then have to correct their installation at the roof as often as not.Some jnow how to flash the vent, some don't.

+1

I have seen about 10X as many instances of HVAC contractors ruining roofs than the other way around.

That is an odd vent and may have easily been missed and especially if whomever was doing the tear off was fast and not paying attention.

Roofmaster417 01-31-2012 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windows on Wash (Post 840041)
+1

I have seen about 10X as many instances of HVAC contractors ruining roofs than the other way around.

That is an odd vent and may have easily been missed and especially if whomever was doing the tear off was fast and not paying attention.

Add one for for me.I have had many call backs on new construction after plumbers and Hvac played roofer.

But at any rate a furnace cap should be matched.Carbon monoxide is a serious issue.It does not take skill to pick out a furnace cap true but a standard cap is much different than a regulated one.

MB1 01-31-2012 12:31 PM

Thanks for the feedback. From the research I've done since this problem occurred, I've learned there are many vent cap types for different applications, climates, etc so it seems to me it would make sense to take a look for anything unusual prior to bidding the job (in this case the business owner did the bid) given this comes out of his pocket, but maybe it is just customary to pad the price for the unexpected. In this case, he depended not on the HVAC supplier but his roofing material supplier.

MB1 02-01-2012 10:50 PM

27 Deaths Due to faulty vent cap...
 
This is from 1987 and is no longer an issue, but I think makes a good point. Also, even with electrical appliances you are dealing with potential sparks which you do not want to end up venting back into the insulation kicking off a fire.

http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml87/87005.html


WASHINGTON, DC -- Roof vent caps on certain HOME or MILLER brand gas-fired furnaces installed in mobile homes are being replaced free of charge by Lear Siegler, Inc., as a precaution against accidental carbon monoxide poisoning.

Snikosnitzo 05-04-2012 05:18 AM

Early Worm Gets the Bird
 
I do not mean to be sarcastic
It is really up to the home owner to make sure things of a mechanical nature and such are checked as to what should be dune prior to having some one messing it up I think this is a foe-paw on the contractors part as well on your part because you should do your home work There are times when there is no avoiding a situation because there is no or not enough information


I think to be fair your contractor should cover Ĺ your expenses to be fair
You may not like what I said Thatís ok
Quote:

Originally Posted by MB1 (Post 839926)
Is my roofer incompetent? I am trying to understand what a roofer should be reasonably expected to know about replacing vent caps during a re-roof. Around time of my mobilehome re-roof, my furnace stopped working. The roofer came back to assure me he didn't create blockage and that he has never created a problem with furnaces not working.

1 month later without heat, tons of my time invested, 8 hours of HVAC repairman time, and $400 in parts, the repairman determined the wrong crown/cap was put on on the venting. Here's what it should look like: http://www.mobilehomerepair.com/medi...yne/903656.jpg The top cap allows hot exhaust out (with Carbon Monoxide) and the bottom is the intake in with oxygen. The cap installed was sharing intake with outgas, causing the flame to go out.

-Should a roofer take an "inventory" of all the different types of caps on a home? Just looking at this cap, I would think would make someone wonder if the engineers had something special in mind for it during design!

-Should he be familiar with all the different types and their applications? For example, I noticed that my wate heater also has a very different style vent cap now and is not mobilehome specific like others I see in my neighborhood. The vent caps for bathroom exhaust fans have 360 degree access to intake/outake whereas old ones were for exhaust only, including a damper, insect/pest screen, and pointed only down the sloped roof (which I assume is to minimize the risk of water getting in to this electric device)

-My roofer said he just uses the vent caps the roofing supplier gives him for bathroom fans, water heater, and furnace vents. He has never heard of a furnace needing a special cap to handle intake/outake.

Appreciate your opinions ASAP.

Thank you,
Marcum


bcdemon 05-05-2012 07:44 AM

Generally speaking, common sense should have kicked in when he took the old cap off and saw 2 separate chambers in the pipe, but how much HVAC knowledge is a roofer supposed to have?

Technically it was the roofers actions that caused your furnace to fail. But you also asked a roofer to do an HVAC job. I would say that's about a 50-50 split.

pardonme2711 06-20-2012 09:04 PM

you are in a mobile home. Mobile homes require special furnaces that use all combustion air from the outside, even 90+ furnaces are unacceptable according to code. A roofer is just that a roofer not an HVAC guy not to mention a mobile home is a whole different set of combustion standards. I think the truly incompetant one is the HVAC tech who took eight hours to figure this out.


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