DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum

DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum (http://www.diychatroom.com/)
-   Roofing/Siding (http://www.diychatroom.com/f9/)
-   -   Installing Vinyl Siding (http://www.diychatroom.com/f9/installing-vinyl-siding-64941/)

ptarmigan61 02-20-2010 10:57 AM

Installing Vinyl Siding
 
I will be installing siding on our cottage project starting this spring. I have never installed the vinyl before. We have picked a Kaycan product mostly because of the colours available, but it is not the lighter builders grade. We will be using a brick red siding and using the white corner boards and accent pieces for contrast.
I read an article from Fine Homebuilding where the author recommends using "super J" channel (wider) at the top of the walls to mimic the look of frieze boards for a better look.
My question is what is the best or recommended for finishing the vinyl siding install at the top of walls and gable ends under the eaves? I have read contradictory instructions; some say to use an undersill strip, some say use J channel.
Any tips or observations would be appreciated, bot on this question as well as any advice generally on installing this stuff.
Thanks.

jlhaslip 02-20-2010 11:04 AM

J channel works fine, but requires closer cuts.
Don't nail it hard. let the pieces slid. check your nailing by slipping your finger nail between the nail head and the siding. nail in the middle of the slots.

the wider strip is most a design consideration and your call...

Gary in WA 02-20-2010 11:06 AM

http://www.vinylsiding.org/publicati...2007Manual.pdf

http://www.fourseasonsroofingandsidi...nnel.leaks.htm

It all looks like vinyl to me.....

Be safe, Gary

Mark Harvey 02-20-2010 11:07 AM

Siding
 
I would suggest "J" channel. I do various jobs and siding is one of them. The J channel can be used for most areas - around windows, doors, and under the eaves. Do the soffits first, if you are putting soffits on, then run the channel along the underside of the soffit. The top edge of the highest piece of siding will be hiden by the J channel. Make sense. Remember, it a cabin and you don't have to go overboard on fancy trims or items you may not need

rpostss 02-23-2010 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ptarmigan61 (Post 403171)
I will be installing siding on our cottage project starting this spring. I have never installed the vinyl before. We have picked a Kaycan product mostly because of the colours available, but it is not the lighter builders grade. We will be using a brick red siding and using the white corner boards and accent pieces for contrast.
I read an article from Fine Homebuilding where the author recommends using "super J" channel (wider) at the top of the walls to mimic the look of frieze boards for a better look.
My question is what is the best or recommended for finishing the vinyl siding install at the top of walls and gable ends under the eaves? I have read contradictory instructions; some say to use an undersill strip, some say use J channel.
Any tips or observations would be appreciated, bot on this question as well as any advice generally on installing this stuff.
Thanks.

"Super J" (2.5") wide is best used around window and door openings, and in gable ends where you do not have to attach a nail through the siding behind the 2.5" wide flange - not at the top of a wall to mimic frieze boards. Fine Homebuilding is a great magazine but they are not vinyl siding installers.

The last course of horizontal (not gable ends) siding is best attached using an undersill strip nailed at the top, then use a crimper tool to punch tabs in the top edge of the siding that then snaps into the sill trim for a nail-less install of that last course.

You can use regular J-channel (3/4" wide) combined with the sill trim.

Tom Struble 02-23-2010 10:34 PM

you can use any of those products they are all a form of j channel

HomeSealed 02-23-2010 11:09 PM

Undersill strip AKA, utiltity strip, is usually used inside j-channel in your application to insure a nice, tight fit at the top of a wall.

Tom Struble 02-24-2010 06:17 AM

the utiliy trim can also be used inside the 2.5'' j if thats the look you like

Maintenance 6 02-24-2010 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HomeSealed (Post 405054)
Undersill strip AKA, utiltity strip, is usually used inside j-channel in your application to insure a nice, tight fit at the top of a wall.

That's how I do it. The "J" channel will lay straighter and flatter for apearance and the Utility strip gives you a place to snap the last run of siding into.

milliken23 02-24-2010 08:22 PM

If you are going to be doing the soffit as well as the siding then the best material to use at the top is a recessed crown molding (RCM). You do the siding first and rip the top piece so that it ends one quarter of an inch below the soffit. Be sure to cut nail holes for expansion at the top of this rip piece. Then the RCM goes over the top of your final course of siding to cover the nails. The soffit then goes into the channel designed into the top of the RCM. You will need a special tool called a trim nail punch to install the RCM though. (Only about $10 at any siding supplier.) Very simple to do and it looks much better than J-channel at the top. BUT ... if you are not doing the soffit than use J-channel along with U.T. :thumbsup:

markore 07-09-2015 12:30 PM

Residing with Vinyl around Windows
 
The "jump casing method" of cutting the existing trim flush and using standard j contributes to the cheaply installed look that gives vinyl siding a bad name.

In my area, the most promising material I have found so far for windows without existing casing is a 1.25x3" prefinished brickmold from menards, in 17', 10' and 8' lengths.
Using this molding all around the windows will work for our current residing project on a modern house but is not a complete solution for colonial houses where a sill detail is desired.

Many people discuss the use of coil stock as a complete solution for residing over existing trim but some customers do not want to cut the sills flush with the side casings to allow the J to box around the windows and some do not want to see the J at all, as this still contributes to the cheap vinyl siding look. Crane does have a window casing lineal for $56 for 20 ft sections and a windowsill lineal kit for $65 for 10 foot sections. This option requires the lineal starter ($18 for 12') and sill end caps ($3).

DS trim was used on Ask This Old House (I can't post links yet) when the siding is placed around the sill they notched it (about 9:30 on the video)
The double snap trim option in white runs between $75 - $125 per opening PLUS shipping of $25 per piece. The double snap trim would be much more attractive if it was sold a a local retailer or amazon and if they would add an integral J channel to the sill kit. For picky customers like my wife the lack of integral J channel in the sill kit is a dealbreaker.

I am still investingating other potential options for finish details using dual undersill trim, flanged j-channel, h-channel, cove and corner mold, and coil stock. The inventor of the double snap trim displays considerable skill and forthought in the tips and tricks videos. One of the most promising concepts he introduces is the clip method which combines field bent trim coil and the double snap casing.

Certainteed has lineal corner pieces and lineal header options but no sill.

Ron6519 07-09-2015 01:07 PM

Whatever siding detail you choose, remember to properly flash the doors and windows properly or you will cause water intrusion, sheathing, window and framing rot.

markore 07-09-2015 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron6519 (Post 2243898)
Whatever siding detail you choose, remember to properly flash the doors and windows properly or you will cause water intrusion, sheathing, window and framing rot.

Yes, thanks for this public reminder and props on your Franklin quote. I suspect flashing is more often than not omitted during low bid residing jobs over original wood cladding. They cover the two drip leg counter flashing that lap over the previous siding course in the fine homebuilding article. As someone mentions in the youtube comments to the double snap trim casing installation video, the entire window perimeter should also be flashed before starting the trim detail course, so that the old wood and spacers around the openings are all flashed over.

When the original wood trim is retained and wrapped with metal, do you still recommend L-flashing around the window before the wrap goes on? And drip cap flashing between the top coil stock and the j-channel?

Ron6519 07-09-2015 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markore (Post 2244018)
When the original wood trim is retained and wrapped with metal, do you still recommend L-flashing around the window before the wrap goes on? And drip cap flashing between the top coil stock and the j-channel?

By proper flashing I mean using a rubberized flashing tape that adheres to the sheathing.
What are you starting with? What is the house covered with now?
Just realized you're not the OP.

markore 07-09-2015 02:53 PM

I resurrected this topic because I think it is an important discussion. Given how popular vinyl cladding has become it is a shame most re-siders and manufacturers don't give more consideration to these flashing and trim details. It looks like most products either go for the high or low side of the market with few options in the middle. There are few options for residing around existing window sills without jump casing or cutting the sills flush with the casing before running J.

I am an electrical contractor but often end up the site forman/project manager for a GC. I also have a personal residing project in progress - old cedar board and batten with the batten's removed. About half the windows/doors have been replaced and currently are without trim, and the other half have the original wood trim which have been wrapped-poorly. I am going with the 17', 10' and 8' 1.25x3" prefinished brickmold from menards for around the new windows and doors and to transition to stone.
http://www.menards.com/main/moulding...780-c-9561.htm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:52 PM.


User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2015 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.