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-   -   Bare Wood Behind Vinyl Siding (http://www.diychatroom.com/f9/bare-wood-behind-vinyl-siding-183985/)

eclipsis 07-21-2013 12:41 PM

Bare Wood Behind Vinyl Siding
 
2 Attachment(s)
Hello,

I recently posted a question in the window forum about replacing some rotted window trim. I wanted to post here with an additional question. When I pulled the trim boards off, I found bare wood behind (no WRB). The house was built in 2001 so perhaps before WRB wraps were mainstream but I would have thought something would have been back there. Not only is it bare wood, but there are gaps between each board so I would think water behind the siding running down would eventually enter once it reached a gap.

The suggestion, which makes sense, is to remove all the siding, install some sort of WRB and proper flashing on all the windows and re-install the siding. However, before I do that, I want to replace the rotted sheathing I found.

Question
I found printing on the sheathing which I think says "108 OSA 0325 Exterior Bond Construction Sheathing". There is also mention of strength axis and proper orientation (see image). My original plan was to cut out the rotted section, check the insulation behind it (replace if it also shows signs of water damage) and replace with new OSB.

I'm not so sure what OSA is. Can I cut a section out of a sheet and replace or will this compromise the "strength axis"?

joecaption 07-21-2013 02:14 PM

It's just regular OSB cut it out and replace with the same thickness.
With that small an Area I would not worry to much about the direction it's installed.
I would pull that window so the House wrap can be installed around the rough framing.

eclipsis 07-21-2013 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecaption (Post 1218955)
It's just regular OSB cut it out and replace with the same thickness.
With that small an Area I would not worry to much about the direction it's installed.
I would pull that window so the House wrap can be installed around the rough framing.

Every window will have to be pulled I guess when the house wrap is put up. I'm just trying to figure out what I can do myself and what I will have to contract out. It's starting to look like everything will be contracted as I imagine it would be much easier to replace the bad OSB once all the siding is off.

I guess its time to start getting quotes, perhaps I will be a bit more motivated to do more myself after that :)

eclipsis 07-21-2013 02:20 PM

Follow up question, would interior window trim need to be removed also? Or can the windows just be pulled outward?

concreteman 07-21-2013 02:23 PM

That's CSA 0325 which is the Canadian standards association. Similar to the APA in the US. Just cut out the rot and replace unless your in a high wind load area and what your replacing happens to be on a shear wall. Most likely your not in that type of area in Ohio.

concreteman 07-21-2013 02:28 PM

You do not need to remove the windows and wrap into the rough opening. Just wrap to the flange and than use 6" window tape to flash over the window flange. Anderson themselves is now recommending to not do a full wrap at their seminars.

kwikfishron 07-21-2013 02:51 PM

Even if you don't remove the windows you DO have to remove the fasteners on the lower flange of the window and tuck the wrb behind the lower flange.

Personally I would pull the windows and install a sill pan flashing. Once the siding is off pulling a window only takes a few minutes.

gregzoll 07-21-2013 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eclipsis (Post 1218958)
Every window will have to be pulled I guess when the house wrap is put up. I'm just trying to figure out what I can do myself and what I will have to contract out. It's starting to look like everything will be contracted as I imagine it would be much easier to replace the bad OSB once all the siding is off.

I guess its time to start getting quotes, perhaps I will be a bit more motivated to do more myself after that :)

No housewrap, means the contractor that built the place made as many cuts as they could, to try and pocket more money.

People then wonder why their modern homes are falling apart at the seams after five to ten years, while homes built at the turn of the 20th Century or even in the 19th Century, are still standing solid, when kept up with the proper maintenance.

If I was the OP, I would be taking down all that siding, fix any rotted panels, any studs that are rotted, then place a wrap on the house.

Makes you wonder if they even placed Felt or Ice & Rain shield on the roof, along with proper flashing.

eclipsis 07-21-2013 03:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregzoll (Post 1218988)
No housewrap, means the contractor that built the place made as many cuts as they could, to try and pocket more money.

People then wonder why their modern homes are falling apart at the seams after five to ten years, while homes built at the turn of the 20th Century or even in the 19th Century, are still standing solid, when kept up with the proper maintenance.

If I was the OP, I would be taking down all that siding, fix any rotted panels, any studs that are rotted, then place a wrap on the house.

Makes you wonder if they even placed Felt or Ice & Rain shield on the roof, along with proper flashing.

The house was built in 2001 by a reputable builder in the area (Dominion) in a neighborhood with quite a few houses. so I'm wondering if they are all like this. Think I would have any luck going after Dominion at this point to see if they would wrap and reside the house? I've been trying to find code for 2001 to see if WRB was required or just a common sense type of thing to do.

gregzoll 07-21-2013 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eclipsis (Post 1218990)
The house was built in 2001 by a reputable builder in the area (Dominion) in a neighborhood with quite a few houses. so I'm wondering if they are all like this. Think I would have any luck going after Dominion at this point to see if they would wrap and reside the house? I've been trying to find code for 2001 to see if WRB was required or just a common sense type of thing to do.

Reputable means nothing in this day and age. It is obvious that the sub that they had do the siding, skimped. All reputable means, is that no one has burnt their hides with the state for shoddy construction.

eclipsis 07-21-2013 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregzoll (Post 1218998)
Reputable means nothing in this day and age. It is obvious that the sub that they had do the siding, skimped. All reputable means, is that no one has burnt their hides with the state for shoddy construction.

I agree. Just trying to figure out if I'd be wasting my time trying to get them to at least help with fixing the problem. Or if WRB and flashing isn't required by local building code although common sense tells you it is.

At any rate, even if they did, would I trust them at this point to do it right this time around.

gregzoll 07-21-2013 03:44 PM

I would just at this point, rip off all the siding, fix problems, air seal around openings, flash at the windows and doors, wrap with a barrier, then reinstall the siding. Step it up with siding with insulation on the back, if you want to increase the R value for the home.

jagans 07-21-2013 03:50 PM

This is what happens when your local codes blindly follow the minimal codes like BOCA and now the IBC. Those codes are life safety, not performance codes. They are the lowest common denominator, and any builder that blindly follows them without regard to historical precedence is simply in it for the fast buck. This would be every tract builder I have ever come into contact with. It is a rotten shame that local code officials are not smarter than they are, or do not carry more weight regarding means and methods that are time proven ways to do things. The Vinyl Siding Association even states that a secondary protection is necessary, but they have been ignored. I personally do not think you have to pull the windows. Replace the sheathing under the window, then you can use Tyvec, stop it short of the window and then strip in with an ice dams type material starting at the bottom, then sides then top, and shingle everything. I would prime the window flanges with a light asphalt primer and stick the peel and stick material right to the flanges, then roll it in with a silicone roller. I'm pretty darn sure this will seal your windows in good. You have to be careful with this type of flange mount window though. I have actually run into some where the corners are not water tight. There was no sealant installed at the miters. These are trouble. I have drilled weep holes in a lot of windows. :eek:

concretemasonry 07-21-2013 03:55 PM

The home built is 2001 without WRB is just in the beginning of the downside and will continue at a greater rate. Especially with vinyl siding that is the bottom of the barrel for moisture because it has to float, have loose "joints", just buts into "channels" to hopefully move water away. With that type of product the structure it is used on must have a moisture barrier. - It does good to make a shed look good.

Do it right for water resistance of face problems later. - I enjoy working on moisture problems, but I am not after chasing disasters except when clients call.

Dick

eclipsis 07-21-2013 09:37 PM

Thanks for all the helpful information so far. I have two follow up questions:

1. After I posted the picture, I removed the bottom piece of siding from what I think is the "starter strip" or section. The siding was locked into it at the bottom. I'm wondering how any water behind the siding would escape. From my understanding, any water that gets behind the siding should run down the WRB (missing in my case) and exit at the bottom. How can it exit if the siding is locked to the starter strip?

2. The picture posted is not the worst window. The next window I'm going to be working on has OSB rotted all the way through (I can see the studs under the trim board I pulled). I'm guessing the insulation will be wet and need to be replaced. What do I need to worry about in terms of mold? Would a newbie like myself be able to tell if there is an issue with a visual inspection after I cut the OSB and remove the insulation? Or do I need someone to come test this?

Thanks again!


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