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Old 04-07-2010, 10:34 AM   #1
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Another Flat roof tear off and replace post


Hi All,
I am going to rip off an entire flat roof soon and need advice if I am on the proper path. I have done 3 torch roofs before, this will be my first time applying it to bare decking.

1. Is GAF #75 base sheet a good underlayment? Can anyone recommend better, and what are your experiences with this? I would like to get this done right?

2. I have 2' high brick wall surrounding my roof, should I go up the walls with the underlayment all the way to the wall caps, or should I replace the rotten metal counter flashing that is about 1' high and go up only that high? Same thing for the BUR?

3. If I replace the metal counter flashing, is there any reason why I shouldn't use copper (I know it costs more, but I need this done right)? My local roofing supply can bend 20' lengths and deliver it

FYI, I am not your average DIYer. I have experience with torch down, as well as every other aspect of house building. I just need Pro-Advice on this subject. I cannot get a consistent answer from anyone giving me quotes. I am convinced I am dealing with retards who want to get paid the most they can get for the least amount of work. Most have said that my roof is fine and I just need another layer on top. I have 7 layers already. I can see so many issues with adding another layer that it is not even funny. I need to start checking licenses and proof of insurance, convinced most don't know isht about roofing. Done venting.

Thanks in advance.
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Old 04-07-2010, 03:41 PM   #2
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Another Flat roof tear off and replace post


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Originally Posted by slickgt1 View Post
Hi All,
I am going to rip off an entire flat roof soon and need advice if I am on the proper path. I have done 3 torch roofs before, this will be my first time applying it to bare decking.

1. Is GAF #75 base sheet a good underlayment? Can anyone recommend better, and what are your experiences with this? I would like to get this done right?

2. I have 2' high brick wall surrounding my roof, should I go up the walls with the underlayment all the way to the wall caps, or should I replace the rotten metal counter flashing that is about 1' high and go up only that high? Same thing for the BUR?

3. If I replace the metal counter flashing, is there any reason why I shouldn't use copper (I know it costs more, but I need this done right)? My local roofing supply can bend 20' lengths and deliver it

FYI, I am not your average DIYer. I have experience with torch down, as well as every other aspect of house building. I just need Pro-Advice on this subject. I cannot get a consistent answer from anyone giving me quotes. I am convinced I am dealing with retards who want to get paid the most they can get for the least amount of work. Most have said that my roof is fine and I just need another layer on top. I have 7 layers already. I can see so many issues with adding another layer that it is not even funny. I need to start checking licenses and proof of insurance, convinced most don't know isht about roofing. Done venting.

Thanks in advance.
Go to GAF/Elk and read up on torch down specs and safety suggestions.
That base sheet is as good as any.

You should have a strip of "cant strip" running along the wall and the base sheet will go just inches above that.
The base sheet has to be fastened over top the insulation, be kinda hard to do that on the brick walls and not needed.
Clean and primer the walls and you can torch directly to them.

No matter if you go to the top of the wall or stop where it is now you need to remove the old flashing.
Going all the way up and wrapping over the top would be the easiest method for detail "flashing" work.

Have a fire extinguisher on the roof with you 100% of the time.
Walk the roof before and after all breaks to look for smoldering insulation, smoke, etc.
Do not leave the roof for at least 60 minutes after you shut your torch down.
Secure your torch when/if you leave it on the roof over night.


P.S. There are entire cities, counties, etc., in the country that have outlawed the use of torch down roofing systems because of the high hazard/risk to both body and property damage related to this type of system.

BECAREFULL.
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Old 04-07-2010, 04:05 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Slyfox View Post
Go to GAF/Elk and read up on torch down specs and safety suggestions.
That base sheet is as good as any.

You should have a strip of "cant strip" running along the wall and the base sheet will go just inches above that.
The base sheet has to be fastened over top the insulation, be kinda hard to do that on the brick walls and not needed.
Clean and primer the walls and you can torch directly to them.

No matter if you go to the top of the wall or stop where it is now you need to remove the old flashing.
Going all the way up and wrapping over the top would be the easiest method for detail "flashing" work.

Have a fire extinguisher on the roof with you 100% of the time.
Walk the roof before and after all breaks to look for smoldering insulation, smoke, etc.
Do not leave the roof for at least 60 minutes after you shut your torch down.
Secure your torch when/if you leave it on the roof over night.


P.S. There are entire cities, counties, etc., in the country that have outlawed the use of torch down roofing systems because of the high hazard/risk to both body and property damage related to this type of system.

BECAREFULL.
Thanks for the reply Slyfox.

No I do not have cant stips on the roof. Yea I know I was shocked about this as well. The current roofing seems to make a 90 deg turn up the wall.
I am hoping that the supply store will have them, but if not I can cut up my own no problem. Questions about this below.

All the flashing will be removed. I just didn't go into detail about that above.

I have 3 fire extinguishers right now, always got a hose with me, and a couple of buckets of water. Usually get my hands hot when folding / applying little flashing peices, nothing better than cooling off the gloves in a bucket of water, .

I have a couple of more questions.

What wood should I use for the cant strips, and what are the recommended dimensions for them? I beleive it should be a 45 degree slant, but how wide?

What is better, going up under the wall cap, or re-installing that counter flashing metal? My logic is that going under the cap, I protect the wall from getting water saturated, but not sure if that is the best way to go about it.

Thanks again for your help. Greately appreciated.

P.S. Roofers around here are not allowed to use torch products, but every time we hire them, or see them, they always use it. Plus all the supply stores and big box stores cary torch products. I asked around what the deal was. Everyone tells me that the law applies to roofers only, and home ownders can still use this. What? This scares me a little. But I guess that is how roofers get around it as well.

All in all, I am glad I don't do roofs for a living. I would probably blow a disk or something by now. Really labor intensive work. Don't know how you guys to it all the time.
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Old 04-08-2010, 08:14 PM   #4
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Another Flat roof tear off and replace post


A 3-4" cant strip would be ideal.You also should strip in or flash the walls using widths cut of of the roll,make the pieces come onto the field 8-10".Do not just run field sheets right up the wall,it will seperate at the transition point.Also make sure to 45 your corners under your endlaps and degranulize any laps.Also prime any drain,pipe or other metal you are adhering to.Any other questions?
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:20 PM   #5
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Why do you 45 the corners under the end laps, John?
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Old 04-08-2010, 09:30 PM   #6
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It minimizes t-seams or joints.Help seal the lap better.Heh Aaron!!Whats up?
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:20 AM   #7
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Not much, what's shakin, John?

I am pondering this 45 cut, and am thinking it just cuts down on coverage.
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Old 04-09-2010, 02:14 AM   #8
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The 45 is hidden.The sheet on the bottom gets the cut on the lap edge(bottom) and the sheet on the top gets the 45 on the salvedge.Its standard practice out here and manufacturer specs.No coverage lost.If you don't believe me,ask Kage If you don't like the look of the 45,put an awning over it
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:38 PM   #9
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A 3-4" cant strip would be ideal.You also should strip in or flash the walls using widths cut of of the roll,make the pieces come onto the field 8-10".Do not just run field sheets right up the wall,it will seperate at the transition point.Also make sure to 45 your corners under your endlaps and degranulize any laps.Also prime any drain,pipe or other metal you are adhering to.Any other questions?
Wow thanks. I never even knew about the 45 at the corners. Gotta make sure I remember to do this on the proper side.

Other questions would be:

1. What material is best for Cant Strips?
2. My wall caps are ceramic. Can I re-use them, or should I just spend the extra $$$$ and get new ones?

Thanks again, very helpful.
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Old 04-09-2010, 03:52 PM   #10
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Another Flat roof tear off and replace post


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The 45 is hidden.The sheet on the bottom gets the cut on the lap edge(bottom) and the sheet on the top gets the 45 on the salvedge.Its standard practice out here and manufacturer specs.No coverage lost.If you don't believe me,ask Kage If you don't like the look of the 45,put an awning over it

HA! Maybe a gutter? LOL
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Old 04-09-2010, 05:55 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by slickgt1 View Post
Wow thanks. I never even knew about the 45 at the corners. Gotta make sure I remember to do this on the proper side.

Other questions would be:

1. What material is best for Cant Strips?
2. My wall caps are ceramic. Can I re-use them, or should I just spend the extra $$$$ and get new ones?

Thanks again, very helpful.
The cant strips i have worked with are made up of fiber board insulation,
you could make your own out of lumber, I doubt it matters what type.

If they are still in good shape you can, you'll need to decide that yourself.
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Old 04-12-2010, 08:48 AM   #12
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The cant strips i have worked with are made up of fiber board insulation,
you could make your own out of lumber, I doubt it matters what type.

If they are still in good shape you can, you'll need to decide that yourself.

They are in good shape. I will have pictures up today of the roof. I just took them. You will see what I am talking about. I am not too sure I want to remove the wall caps anymore. They are cemented on, and I am sure that I will break them taking them off. I might just replace the counter flashing metal that was there before, and add another strip of BUR from that to the wall caps just to protect the brick walls.

Thanks again. Glad there are people that know what they are talking about on here. I was at a loss before you guys. Thanks.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:50 PM   #13
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So that you guys can see what I am dealing with

Facing the back of the house

You can see the Drain to the gutters on the left (Square Hole)



Facing the front of the house


Another one facing the front.


Sorry about quality of pics. Iphone is not the best for this.

Yes those bubbles are suntunnels.
Yes I put them in myself
No they don't leak

No, I did not paint my roof silver, neither is most of that patching my work.
I got a roofer to inspect, and do what he recommended to prolong my roofs life. This is the result. Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't you not supposed to paint gravel roof with that silver paint. By the way, you can see in the pic facing the front, he left the paint bucket on the roof.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:58 PM   #14
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So that you guys can see what I am dealing with

Facing the back of the house

You can see the Drain to the gutters on the left (Square Hole)



Facing the front of the house


Another one facing the front.


Sorry about quality of pics. Iphone is not the best for this.

Yes those bubbles are suntunnels.
Yes I put them in myself
No they don't leak

No, I did not paint my roof silver, neither is most of that patching my work.
I got a roofer to inspect, and do what he recommended to prolong my roofs life. This is the result. Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't you not supposed to paint gravel roof with that silver paint. By the way, you can see in the pic facing the front, he left the paint bucket on the roof.
That doesn't look like a gravel roof.
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:02 PM   #15
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It is very difficult to re-use counterflashing unless it is reglet snap on kind.

How thick is your roofing, and how much does it weight per square foot?

I would be concerned with the condition of the masonry since it has been coated/covered. Many time, we end up having to have a mason point or rebuild parapet walls when we tear off this type of building/roof.
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