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Old 03-05-2012, 04:35 PM   #16
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Hardibacker board vs Cement Durock board


Chris,

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I am just curious why you snap upwards, that seems counter intuitive. My hunch is going down causes tear-out on the backside of the hardie - is this correct?
That is absolutely correct. When you score with the carbide tool, you will remove some material creating a void. Snapping/bending up shears the backside fairly clean. If you snap down, you'll make a mess. It's not drywall.

Are you using Hardie 500? Did you really need the backer at all?

Jaz

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Old 03-05-2012, 04:39 PM   #17
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Thanks for the reply.

I am using 1/4" Hardie; could not tell you if it is 500 or not. I went back and forth about simply applying the stone directly to the sheet rock, but opted for the Hardie just to be safe. Its a small area; 42" wide x 9' tall, so the cost was a not a real big deal. And it gives me a chance to play with the different material.
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Old 03-05-2012, 06:54 PM   #18
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Chris,

Cost has nothing to do with it, they're both about the same price but we don't chose products because of the cost.

For anyone else reading this, do NOT use 1/4" on walls. It's only for floors and counter where it can be set into thin set mortar and fastened every 6-8".

When used on walls, the 16" o.c. studs do not supply any support between them and 1/4" is too flexible. There's a reason for everything.

Jaz
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Old 03-09-2012, 08:25 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMan
Chris,

Cost has nothing to do with it, they're both about the same price but we don't chose products because of the cost.

For anyone else reading this, do NOT use 1/4" on walls. It's only for floors and counter where it can be set into thin set mortar and fastened every 6-8".

When used on walls, the 16" o.c. studs do not supply any support between them and 1/4" is too flexible. There's a reason for everything.

Jaz
Jaz, what should some one do in the case were there walls are 1/4" in the bathroom can one put cats between the 2x4s for back support then they could use the 1/4 cbu? I have never heard of this issue happening but I'm shore it has to some one, I'm just trying to think you will never be able to mud and feather the difference out if used 1/2.
On a 1/4 wall.
Thanks!
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:23 AM   #20
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Hey guys. You should really try out this product called Green EBoard. Hands down it is the best backer board on the market.

Scores and snaps like drywall and is strong like cement board.

Fire rated.

Bug resistant.

Can be drywalled with drywall compound.

Check it out.

Green EBoard
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:11 PM   #21
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Hardibacker board vs Cement Durock board


Nothing wrong with denshield. I also rec'd something from Maynards about some polystyrene tilebacker with a coating on it. Haven't seen it yet. It was expensive.

I think I'm sold on denshield and waterproofing the seams and screw heads. A gallon of hydro ban will go a long way.

If you are using cement board without waterproofing, I would switch to denshield as well. I hate spreading mortar on the board and having it skin up so quickly. It is a pain to sponge a wall. I do mop or sponge a concrete floor.
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Old 03-17-2012, 04:01 PM   #22
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I stay far, far away from Hardi Backer... This is my 5th tearout where I noticed that it absorbs mold and mildew, although, realizing that they weren't the best installations... I prefer Durrock or National Gypsum's PermaBase
Every time I tear out Hardie, it is very brittle :sad:

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Old 03-17-2012, 08:34 PM   #23
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Wow! Not cool, I haven't ever seem backer board that moldy? Interesting.
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Old 03-30-2012, 12:27 AM   #24
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Best product for tiling in wet areas by far is Denshield. Seal joints with tape and waterproofing and crack prevention membrane.

Durock and other concrete boards allow moisture to pass through and have to be sealed completely with membrane if used. I have opened walls and literally seen water dripping off the back side of durock used in a shower.
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Old 03-30-2012, 01:19 PM   #25
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Best product for tiling in wet areas by far is Denshield.
You'll likely get an argument from many pros with that statement, specially for a shower stall. Might be one of the worst for showers.

Jaz
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Old 03-31-2012, 01:11 AM   #26
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You'll likely get an argument from many pros with that statement, specially for a shower stall. Might be one of the worst for showers.

Jaz
I have been using DensShield since 2007. Lots of showers - no failures.
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Old 03-31-2012, 12:31 PM   #27
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If you build the bottom of the stall shower the way they show in the sketch, it'l work fine.
But how are you gonna do that? I think most will be built wrong and some will fail. Although a bad shower can fail within a few years, 8 years is not a test that proves it was done right.

Go to their website, gp.com then find sketch DS002. See if you understand what I'm talking about.

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Old 03-31-2012, 08:14 PM   #28
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If you build the bottom of the stall shower the way they show in the sketch, it'l work fine.
But how are you gonna do that? I think most will be built wrong and some will fail. Although a bad shower can fail within a few years, 8 years is not a test that proves it was done right.

Go to their website, gp.com then find sketch DS002. See if you understand what I'm talking about.

Jaz
I was looking at that last night before I replied. The weep hole thing is interesting, especially in the event of a stopped drain. I should add to this conversation that I live southern Arizona and 98% of what we do is on concrete and all of the new construction has a depressed slab for showers. We of course do not use DensShield or any other backer material on the floor - that we do with a liner and deck mud. I am not suggesting that I am 100% correct , but I am sold on DensShield for walls. Having said that the reason that I joined this chatroom is to pick up new or different ideas from other professionals. I am an old guy but still learning.

I have taken out many old showers of the style that was described in an older post in which there is a second layer of drywall over the wallboard up to the tile level with a bullnose wrapping the top of the overlaid piece. These are almost always in perfect condition behind the tile. I have begun to think that most leak failures are because of poorly mixed grout.
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Old 03-31-2012, 10:46 PM   #29
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Grout or tiles have nothing to do with waterproofing a shower. You should be able to remove all the grout and tiles too, and a properly built shower will not leak or rot. You can not depend on grout to keep things dry, one little crack and you're toast.

Drywall should not be used in a shower unless it's covered with a waterproofing membrane such as Kerdi. Drywall was never intended as a tile substrate for wet areas, including green board. Although it was used in many cases, it was expressly removed for that use by IRC code as of Jan 1, 2006. Of course it is still used by those who may not know better or don't care.

Of course you would never use a backer for a shower floor, what I meant was for the walls where the wall and shower pan meet. Take a look at the sketch again and read the text again and think about it.
Quote:
Do not install DensShield in the shower pan
Also, what questions might you have concerning the weep holes? Has nothing to do with a stopped drain. Every standard shower drain has weep holes and the membrane should be installed over a pre-slope so that you'll have a way to drain any shower water that gets to the membrane.

Jaz
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Old 04-09-2012, 01:30 PM   #30
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I hope someone here can give me feedback about this situation: Our wall-mounted toilet needed to be reset. The plumbers removed the greenboard and put on a new bracket. They recommended a water-resistant wall rather than greenboard. I considered these three products: Durock cement board, Hardiebacker tile backer and Denshield tile backer.

On two other forums I saw reports that some Denshield boards have terrible odors. Georgia-Pacific knows about the problems and will replace the boards, but I don't want the hassle of this potential problem.

I purchased a 3/5 Hardiebacker 500 board, but we discovered after having the board in the bathroom overnight that IT has a strong and strange odor, like a cross between toothpaste and a solvent. After moving the board to the garage, we found that the smell came from various areas on the board. I called Hardie, and they said they'd never heard of that problem before. They wondered if those areas of the board had gotten wet. Well, if we're buying the board because the area might get wet if the toilet leaks, we don't want a board that smells when wet! The seller hasn't heard of an odor problem, either. They're willing to return or exchange the board, but now I'm reluctant to exchange it. I have no idea if the problem was caused by the manufacturer or the seller (the way it was stored.)

Have any of you heard of an odor problem with Hardibacker?

So I either take another chance on Hardibacker (maybe buying it at Home Depot instead of the tile warehouse?) or use Durock. Has anyone heard of a strong odor coming from Durock?

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