Forums | Home Repair | Home Improvement | Painting | Interior Decorating | Remodeling | Landscaping


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Flooring > Tiling, ceramics, marble

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 09-09-2013, 11:59 PM   #1
Novice Handi-schmuck
 
gabrielpanoussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: America
Posts: 11
Share |
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Hello, I am installing a tub and am planning on tiling the area above and surrounding the tub. I am in the process of installing the dura-rock cement board and I have a few questions and concerns.

When I installed the durarock closest to the tubs lips (the bottom panels) I gave a slight gap between the lower edge of cement board and the tub. I do have the durarock board going into the tub past the tub lip. This is were the durarock kinda bows into the the tub. (the lip on this steel tub was nailed int the studs after the stringer was put on) the lip of the tub is not entirely flush with the studs, so there is a little bit of bowing into the tub.

Is this ok? When I tile will the tiles also be bowed? Or will the plaster behind the tiles help with the appearance. I want straight tiles not bowed into the tub.

Also, do I need a vapor barrier? Something to waterproof on the durarock before I tile?
gabrielpanoussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2013, 04:23 AM   #2
DIY staff
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kane county,Illinois
Posts: 20,375
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Sorry,but you need to remove that rock and raise it up.

The Durrock should stop at the top of the tub flange--not cover the flange.

The gap is filled with thinset when you tile---or before tiling if you will be adding a waterproof coating.

Paint on waterproofing is highly recommended--Redguard is a good product for that.

Use powdered modified thinset to install the tiles--never use a premixed product in a wet area---Mike------
__________________
New members: Adding your location to your profile helps in many ways.--M--
oh'mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to oh'mike For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-11-2013), JazMan (09-10-2013)
Old 09-10-2013, 09:45 AM   #3
Bill Kearney
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 1,655
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


What Mike says, and be sure you've got a drill that has enough torque to handle mixing up the thinset. A cordless one won't.

Tile doesn't bow. Nor should it be laid on anything that can move. The substrate under the tile has to be completely stiff. Otherwise the thinset, tile or grout WILL crack. Be sure to consider that the tub will be a lot heavier when loaded. Make sure it isn't going to shift and cause your tile work to fail.

Is this a typical 3-sided tub/shower alcove kind of tub? Or a drop-in? If it's an alcove, yeah, you only bring the backer down TO the top of the tub flange, not in and over it. If the flange isn't flush with the studs then you typically need to add furring strips to the studs to bring the backer out to that level.

I had to do that for a whole wall in a 6x11' bath, as the tub was just a wee bit shy of the full rough width. It was better to bring out the whole wall by a little and keep a flat surface across the whole wall. Otherwise I'd have had to do a lot more tile work bumping out a tiny bit of corner, and that would've looked crappy.
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to wkearney99 For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-11-2013)
Old 09-11-2013, 04:03 AM   #4
Novice Handi-schmuck
 
gabrielpanoussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: America
Posts: 11
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


thank you for the replies, and yes it is an alcove style in a small 2 bedroom cape cod.

I have heard of the red paint on tyoe sealer not sure but as i remember it was a bit pricey. I'll give it another look.

Looks like I have my work cut out of for me. I have another question though how many screws do I put into a 3x5 of durock? I try just enough to keep it from moving?
gabrielpanoussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-11-2013, 05:18 AM   #5
DIY staff
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kane county,Illinois
Posts: 20,375
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Attact with screws--rock screws---about 9" apart on the studs.
__________________
New members: Adding your location to your profile helps in many ways.--M--
oh'mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to oh'mike For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-11-2013)
Old 09-11-2013, 06:47 AM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: North Carolina, USA
Posts: 2,206
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


You put 30 screws minimum in a 3x5 sheet of Durock, assuming 16" stud spacing.
jeffnc is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to jeffnc For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-11-2013)
Old 09-11-2013, 07:19 AM   #7
Bill Kearney
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 1,655
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Quote:
Originally Posted by gabrielpanoussi View Post
I have heard of the red paint on type sealer not sure but as i remember it was a bit pricey. I'll give it another look.
It's certainly cheaper than the cost of water damage. I used it in a bathroom job, one that we demolished 7 years later. The bond between the tile, thinset, RedGuard and the backer was incredibly strong. I wanted to save a piece of the marble listelllo I'd put around the room. But the bond was so tight as to make it impossible to separate the layers without destroying the tile. That and the areas behind it were totally free of any signs of moisture.

Yeah, it costs a bit and takes some effort to apply, but peace of mind is worth it.
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to wkearney99 For This Useful Post:
oh'mike (09-11-2013)
Old 09-15-2013, 02:06 AM   #8
Novice Handi-schmuck
 
gabrielpanoussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: America
Posts: 11
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Here is an update with photos I need advice on how to fill the gaps in pictures the durock is where i plan to tile the old construction is lathe and plaster.

How can i fill the gaps? do I use bits of lathe and plaster to the durock? fiberglass tape as a backing and fill with plaster? I'm lost here.

I know I will need tape at the seams. I plan on removing all the blue tile at some point and hanging drywall. transitioning from the plaster (what is seen as the white part of the wall) to drywall will prob need shims under the drywall as the lath is thicker than drywall.

I also looked at redgaurd as a safety measure 46 dollars a gallon. I don't think I can do it as I'm not even sure how this will turn out.






Last edited by gabrielpanoussi; 09-15-2013 at 02:09 AM.
gabrielpanoussi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2013, 06:35 AM   #9
DIY staff
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kane county,Illinois
Posts: 20,375
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Will you be replacing the drywall around the rock?

Gaps are filled with thinset and tilers mesh---this mesh is alkali resistant---

The junction of rock to drywall is not considered a wet area--so the can be filled with powdered drywall mud---(Easy Sand)---

Be careful---leave the joints flat or even shallow--You do not want a hump--that would be bad---and cause the tiles to stick out---
__________________
New members: Adding your location to your profile helps in many ways.--M--
oh'mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to oh'mike For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-15-2013)
Old 09-15-2013, 11:47 AM   #10
Bill Kearney
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 1,655
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


From the looks of it the front lip of your tub is in front of the durock. Or is this an old picture before you resolved that? If not, then what's the plan? That front wall is going to get the most moisture against it, you do not want it set up wrong.

If you know you're going to be replacing the other tile with drywall, and you don't want to do it now, then how about just doing one stud-width of it? Make the transition from the tiles to the drywall, done right. And then deal with the removal of the other tile later. This won't look as pretty, but it would be better to do the tile transition right the first time and not screw around with it again later. Then when you remove the other stuff it'll be MUCH easier to feather it into the drywall work.

As for membrane material costs, do you think water damage repairs are any cheaper?
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to wkearney99 For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-15-2013)
Old 09-15-2013, 11:52 AM   #11
Bill Kearney
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 1,655
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Also, I don't really see any lathe in those pictures. Are you sure it's actual plaster layers in lathe? If it's like our old house it was a pre-drywall product, a brown looking board, and then 3 layers of plaster on it (of increasing smoothness). It was a real hassle getting that to transition to new drywall. I had to experiment a bit with using furring strips to bring up the old studs to just the right thickness to allow new drywall to match the same depth as the old board/plaster layers. I believe I eventually ended up cutting a sheet of 3/8" plywood into strips in order to get just the right thickness. What I should have done was just nuked that whole section of wall and skinned it with all new drywall. That would've been a LOT LESS WORK.
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to wkearney99 For This Useful Post:
gabrielpanoussi (09-15-2013)
Old 09-15-2013, 12:00 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: North Carolina, USA
Posts: 2,206
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Quote:
Originally Posted by wkearney99 View Post
Also, I don't really see any lathe in those pictures. Are you sure it's actual plaster layers in lathe?
He said plaster and lathe - I assumed he meant mortar and lathe. The black metal lathe is visible in the first picture.
jeffnc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2013, 12:23 PM   #13
Bill Kearney
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 1,655
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Ah, yeah, that gawd-awful stuff. Metal screen embedded in concrete. Had a devil of time taking it out. I smacked the hell out of it with a sledgehammer and it just bounced off without leaving a scratch. Had to use a prybar to lever it loose in sections and then an angle grinder to detach the eff'in metal screen. It was tough work. Damned tile was RAZOR sharp where I cracked the sections apart.
wkearney99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2013, 12:26 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: North Carolina, USA
Posts: 2,206
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Yes, you can slice yourself up if you're not very careful. Using a demo hammer to crack through the tile/mortar in 1 to 2 foot squares works, then cutting through the metal lathe with a long metal blade on a recipro saw.
jeffnc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2013, 12:45 PM   #15
Novice Handi-schmuck
 
gabrielpanoussi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: America
Posts: 11
Default

Dura-rock cement board bath tub install - bowing boards


Thank you all for your replies...

I plan on using the existing drywall/plaster that is up (the white part of the wall). I wish I could just gut the room and not worry about using the furring strips.

And ah yes the "special tape" and the "special thinset" to fill the gaps that works.

I also thought about maybe just using one stud worth of drywall or even more rock to extend out the wet area and tile around the tub.

I'll look at that lip again. so the rock must stop just above the lip as discussed earlier and also the lip must not be further out than the rock attached correct?

Looks like lathe and plaster was incorrect. its metal and plaster under the tile. the "white" area of the wall is that brown board with layers of plaster.

I used an impact wrench and crowbar to get this stuff off.

I will add more pictures as I progress and encounter more hiccups.

Eventually i will rip out all the tile remaining and tile the floor.

The home was constructed in the 50's classic starter cape cod with the bungalow (naughty pine) basement and hard wood floors in the living room with a cove living room. I like this style as well as colonial. My wife likes Victorians so that may be our next purchase. These homes require allot of maintenance. Looks like a roof might be our next project ~sigh.

Last edited by gabrielpanoussi; 09-15-2013 at 01:29 PM.
gabrielpanoussi is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to gabrielpanoussi For This Useful Post:
oh'mike (09-15-2013)
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cement board w/Green board vs. Fiberock ? Missjeanius Kitchen & Bath Remodeling 3 09-04-2012 08:45 AM
New Roof but Fascia Trim Board Rotting ein0801 Roofing/Siding 6 07-15-2012 12:21 AM
a few quick questions about shower cement board and hydro ban diy'er on LI Tiling, ceramics, marble 2 04-27-2012 10:16 PM
how to hang plastic behind shower cement board 4just1don Building & Construction 2 07-22-2011 11:34 AM
Rotten cement - skim coat or board? BradG Building & Construction 1 11-25-2007 02:25 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.