Ceramic Tile Counter Top - Tiling, ceramics, marble - Page 2 - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Flooring > Tiling, ceramics, marble

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-10-2009, 07:04 PM   #16
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Appleton, Wisconsin
Posts: 942
Rewards Points: 518
Default

ceramic tile counter top


Using your thoughts that you don't need a backer on the edge of the counter why would you need one on top of the counter? As far as I know the backer is used to have a good surface for the tile to bond to and also used because wood expands and contracts and backer doesn't.

I'm not saying you are wrong because I am by no means a tile expert but it just seems like bonding tile to the edge of a piece of 3/4" plywood wouldn't provide sufficiant bonding.

Thanks

Advertisement

ponch37300 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2009, 07:08 AM   #17
Member
 
ccarlisle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,889
Rewards Points: 1,000
Default

ceramic tile counter top


"As far as I know the backer is used to have a good surface for the tile to bond to and also used because wood expands and contracts and backer doesn't."

In theory - and to some extent in practice - I guess you are right to say that "wood expands" but in this instance, you may be looking at thousandths of an inch laterally and only if the plywood gets really wet or suffers from extreme conditions. IMO there are not serious enough conditions under a layer of thinset and a tile to warrant worrying about enough expansion to pop off a nose tile. Besides, normally you put a scratch coat of thinset on both surfaces to lessen any adhesion concerns there may be...

And I go back to one of my original questions...how do you think it has been done in the past? You should be more concerned about waterproofing the top of the counter and sealing the grout - as there you have a far greater risk of e.g. spilling a pot full of water, and having the water soak down beteeen the tiles and causing the plywood some sort of harm. There you risk the whole countertop, whereas on the sides, you risk the odd tile from popping off, an occurence that is easily repaired.

By adding CBU to the sides of the countertop, you are adding another 1/2" or so of depth. You'll have to screw and then thinset these pieces to the edge and then thinset the tiles to that...doesn't that give you twice the concern? twice the liklihood of something not sticking?

IMO products like Ditra were conceived for this purpose; they are excellent waterproofing agents and therefore eliminate the problem at the source. The plywood is fully protected.

The fact is that thinset will adhere tiles to almost anything including a plastic like Ditra. 'Adhesion' isn't usually a concern. The substrate is on the other hand, but back-buttering usually takes care of that. A modified thinset especially on plywood is the optimum - and far ahead of 'mastic'. So you don't "need" a CBU on a countertop...that's my point. You thinset the Ditra to the plywood, put down the Ditra, then more thinset then tile. Now you may need a CBU on a shower wall where it rains every day, in order to give an extra grab to the thinset, but here again, another waterproofing product called Kerdi is applied on top of the CBU, so in fact you are applying your expensive granite tile to...uh... a thin sheet of plastic...!

As I said in an earlier post, the CBU has two functions: to provide a flat surface that is water-resistant and a support for the tiles in thinset.

So the thinset does the job, not the CBU. Tiles bond to the thinset then the thinset bonds to itself.

Anyway good luck.
__________________
“The average American woman is about 25 pounds heavier than she was in 1960...Recognizing obesity as a disease will help change the way the medical community tackles this complex issue that affects approximately 1 in 3 Americans,”
ccarlisle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-17-2009, 08:29 AM   #18
Member
 
ccarlisle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,889
Rewards Points: 1,000
Default

ceramic tile counter top


Ponch: I just remembered that there is a published standard for tiles on countertops and I had to go find my book to get it. It's the TTMAC standard #322C-2006/2007 and it specifies that a suitable substrate for tiles is 19mm thick plywood. That's about 5/8"...waterproof membrane is there, too.

__________________
“The average American woman is about 25 pounds heavier than she was in 1960...Recognizing obesity as a disease will help change the way the medical community tackles this complex issue that affects approximately 1 in 3 Americans,”
ccarlisle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-2009, 07:27 AM   #19
Member
 
ccarlisle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,889
Rewards Points: 1,000
Default

ceramic tile counter top


Quote:
Originally Posted by b2dap View Post
i like the pictures/diagrams. Can we use more of these in our discussions? I think i have a sink that would work great for carlisle's kitchen pic.... send me a check for $500 carlisle???


That was an sink installed from above; sometimes we use these undermounts:
Attached Images
 
__________________
“The average American woman is about 25 pounds heavier than she was in 1960...Recognizing obesity as a disease will help change the way the medical community tackles this complex issue that affects approximately 1 in 3 Americans,”
ccarlisle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-2009, 08:58 PM   #20
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 1
Rewards Points: 10
Default

ceramic tile counter top


I wanted to know if i can tile right over laminet couter tops ?
and do you use contrating groute or not?
please let me know.



thanks Jerry
campboy25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2009, 08:04 AM   #21
Member
 
ccarlisle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1,889
Rewards Points: 1,000
Default

ceramic tile counter top


No, it is not recommended to tile over a laminate countertop. Nothing would stick properly to formica (melamine)...

Contrasting grout? Sure, it depends on the look you want to achieve. Contrasting grout makes the grout line visible and stand out more whereas a similar grout makes the lines almost dissappear and so you get the look of just the tile.

Imagine a black-and-white tiled floor and a solid marble floor. In one case you really see the lines (looks like checkerboard) and in the other you just see a solid white floor - looks like one slab of marble...depends on the effect you want to create.
__________________
“The average American woman is about 25 pounds heavier than she was in 1960...Recognizing obesity as a disease will help change the way the medical community tackles this complex issue that affects approximately 1 in 3 Americans,”
ccarlisle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2013, 10:55 PM   #22
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1
Rewards Points: 10
Default

ceramic tile counter top


Hi CCarlisle,
I love the Rondec edging. Where did you buy it and approx. how much $ did it cost. I am in the Ottawa/Gatineau area. Must have the same retailers as in Montreal... Thanks you for sharing your knowledge

Advertisement

dubuc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ceramic tile over subfloor in Kitchen pinkertonpv Flooring 11 01-12-2013 01:40 PM
Ceramic tile over existing (full mud) ceramic? rjniles Flooring 7 12-24-2008 07:12 PM
Question on preparing surface for Ceramic Tile Rferret Flooring 3 07-20-2008 01:08 PM
Preping for ceramic tile install leroyme Flooring 21 11-29-2007 04:31 PM
Ceramic tile installed over resiliant tile ramsfanjeff Flooring 1 11-26-2005 03:26 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts