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Old 02-16-2011, 11:08 PM   #31
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Diy,
I have used the tru color grout on the last two showers and three floors I have done. I like working with it and have had good results. The biggest thing I can tell you is to follow the instructions to a t. I do about a 9 square foot area and then lightly sponge off with the sponge squeezed out and patted on a towel. Light circular motion to shape the grout lines and then leave it alone. Once it dries overnight, I check for any grit or residue on the tile. If there is I use a white scotchbrite pad dipped in a bucket of water and lightly scrub the affected area. The grit comes right off. I don't use any grout release or sealer before grouting. I like the product and plan on using it more, especially in wet areas.
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Old 02-16-2011, 11:49 PM   #32
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Julianne hasn't posted since then, Sept. '10.....

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Old 02-17-2011, 04:57 AM   #33
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


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Julianne hasn't posted since then, Sept. '10.....

Gary
Yes, but forums like this serve an archival purpose in addition to the immediate conversation. Someone else may happen by months later looking for information.
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Old 02-17-2011, 09:35 PM   #34
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


You got me Gary. I didn't look at the date on Juliannes. These threads show up in my email every time somebody posts to one. I remember it being an old thread. I think I looked at the date on Diy's post and thought hers was among the new ones.
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Old 02-25-2011, 12:50 PM   #35
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


My wife and I had this grout installed in our master bath's shower floor. The flooring is a pebble tiles (they are sheets of pebbles). So the grout seams are huge. After a considerable amount of curing time, we began using the shower and after about 2 weeks we noticed water was getting under the pebbles and some areas of grout began lifting up.

The grout in some areas didn't seem to adhere to the pebbles and the water leaked underneath. I began removing the "bad" grout but i'm not sure where/when to stop.

Does anyone know if I need to remove all the grout to fix this or just the areas that were lifting?

We had a general contractor install the tile and grout and he was in over his head in more than just the tile/grout installation.

Thanks everyone!
Brian
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Old 06-21-2011, 06:44 PM   #36
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Hello everyone, I guess I didn't get all the notices that folks had posted.

Thanks for the comments. Yes, I know that the Bostik propaganda sheet says that you shouldn't have to seal the tile (matte finish porcelain) to prevent grout haze, but Krud cutter and a doodle pad didn't get it to come off. So the tilers used 511 sealer and there wasn't any haze problem.

The nightmare continues I had a Bostik rep come to my house and inspect the grout problem. Basically, they said all of my cleaniong products were fine to use and they had no explanation as to why mold was growing in the shouwer or how the discoloration occurred. He blamed it on poor installation.

Just before Christmas 2010, the rep a a tiler guy came and removed then regrouted 1/2 of my house; only to have the discoloration reappear within 24 hrs. Of course after that, no one was returning my calls or emails. I had to escalate to the referral service that recommended the tiling contractor. Then I got a response!

I have also learned that Bostik/starquartz had made a formulation change and that there were a lot of problems with the new formulation. So much so that one of the tile contractors confided in me that they will no longer use it because they have had so many problems with it.

At this point in time, I've had additional consultations with other tilers and the concensus is that the grout didn't properly cure, thus leading to the discoloration (and probably the mold and pull out issues). Now I'm gathering pricing info to remove the grout and replace it with epoxy (I have pets). I'm considering Laticrete spectraLOCK Pro due to the numerous positive reviews over the years. Anyone care to comment???

Cheers,
Julianne
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Old 06-22-2011, 05:44 AM   #37
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Based on my own experience with the urethane grout on both porcelain and ceramic tile, there is no need to seal the tile beforehand because the haze comes off easily, even long after (i.e. months after) the grout has cured, using the orange liquid propertly diluted in 5 gallons of water and a gentle white scrubby pad and just a bit of elbow grease, not much.

I repeat that sealing the tile before using urethane grout is likely to do nothing but harm because it could prevent a proper urethane bond from forming against the tile if the sealant gets into the joints, and that could lead to mold and mildew, to loose grout, etc. 511 sealer instructions specifically say

Quote:
"Be careful not to saturate the open grout joints".
Did the installer make sure not to allow the sealant to get into the open grout joints?


The 511 instructions say further:

Quote:
Allow 511 Impregnator to cure for 6 - 12 hours before continuing with the grouting procedure.
Did your installer allow the 511 to cure for 6-12 hours before the urethane grout was applied?

The discoloration could be the result of a chemical interraction, but I'm just speculating about that. There are petroleum distillates in the 511 product. Was the 511 sealant by any chance brush-applied to the grout afterwards, as is often done to seal standard cement grout? It would not be unheard of for an installer to do what he's always done, because it's "tried and true", even when using a new product that requires him to abandon the old ways.

Laticrete's SpectraLOCK Pro is a high-quality product that is widely used but with that epoxy grout it IS very important to remove the haze in a timely manner because once it has cured, it would be very difficult if not impossible to remove.
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Old 06-22-2011, 10:21 AM   #38
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Hi DIY888,
No the installers did not wait 6-12 hours after 511 application before they grouted. I can't say if they saturated the grout lines with it or not. Regardless, the grout rep was aware that 511 was applied to the tiles and he said that wasn't a problem. I know that the urethane grout isn't supposed to leave a haze on tiles, but I saw it for myself. On the project just before mine, the installers had to buff off the haze on a whole house installation (the customer used the urethane grout and matte finish porcelain tiles like I did). So I hear what you're saying, but i cannot deny what I saw.

I've come to the conclusion that these people either don't have a clue what caused the problem or they know exactly what happened and are trying to make me go away by giving me band-aid solutions.

This is the first home improvement project that I've had major problems with, but it is a costly lesson to learn. But like Las Vegas, you can't winn every time.
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Old 06-22-2011, 01:19 PM   #39
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Julianne View Post
Hi DIY888,
No the installers did not wait 6-12 hours after 511 application before they grouted. I can't say if they saturated the grout lines with it or not. Regardless, the grout rep was aware that 511 was applied to the tiles and he said that wasn't a problem.
You cannot blame the product just because the rep may have been a bad detective.

The installation instructions for 511 clearly warn installers to let it cure, and the installers should follow the manufacturer's instructions, because if the sealant is still exhaling solvent when they go to apply the grout, the solvent mixes with the urethane.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Julianne View Post
I know that the urethane grout isn't supposed to leave a haze on tiles, but I saw it for myself.
The 511 instructions also say to buff the 511 out after 5 minutes because it too can leave a haze.

Given these installation issues, there is no way you can be certain that the haze you saw (I do believe you saw it) can be blamed on the urethane grout.

I've used the urethane grout from Bostik and StarQuartz, both formulations, and know that the haze comes off easily even months afterwards, I would bet good money (since you bring up Las Vegas) that the haze is either a 511 residue (it was not buffed out after 5 minutes) or a 511-complication (solvent mixing with urethane from improper cure time), or BOTH.

Quote:
On the project just before mine, the installers had to buff off the haze on a whole house installation (the customer used the urethane grout and matte finish porcelain tiles like I did). So I hear what you're saying, but i cannot deny what I saw.
Same installers? Maybe the same problem.

Quote:
I've come to the conclusion that these people either don't have a clue what caused the problem or they know exactly what happened and are trying to make me go away by giving me band-aid solutions.
Their urethane grout product works as described, even if the rep wasn't much of a detective.

Quote:
This is the first home improvement project that I've had major problems with, but it is a costly lesson to learn. But like Las Vegas, you can't winn every time.
Just as your chances of winning in Las Vegas improve when you can "read the cards" they improve in home improvement when the installers read the manufacturer's instructions and follow them. There are plenty of slapdash contractors out there who don't believe in following instructions. I believe you may have met a couple of them.
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Old 06-24-2011, 12:47 PM   #40
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Does anyone have an opinion on Prism Sure Color grout with Impregnator Pro as a sealer?

I found someone who's willing to fix my grout and this is a new recommendation for grout. She's also going to strip / acid wash the tiles (formic acid) to remove any residual 511 sealer prior to regrouting. Her recommendation is to reseal the high traffic areas once a year, eventhough convention would be to reseal every 2-3 years.

The Pros (as I see it) are: a more conventional product, a very popular product, less costly than epoxy.
The Cons are: Annual resealing, concerns about staining due to pets (bird & cat poop).

How do you keep the grout lines clean?
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Old 06-24-2011, 03:28 PM   #41
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Julianne View Post
Does anyone have an opinion on Prism Sure Color grout with Impregnator Pro as a sealer?
<snip>
Allow the grout to cure for three(3) days before applying a sealer.

And here's an FYI from the manufacturer: http://www2.dupont.com/Stone_Tech_Pr...nator_pro.html

http://www2.dupont.com/Stone_Tech_Pr...ut_sealer.html

http://www2.dupont.com/Stone_Tech_Pr...ut_sealer.html


If I had pets soiling a tiled area with feces, I'd select a grout that would be non-absorbent and would hold up under "industrial-strength" cleaning methods. An epoxy grout would be my choice.

Last edited by diy888; 06-24-2011 at 03:36 PM.
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:42 AM   #42
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Thanks for your reply DIY888.

With the epoxy grout, would I run into needing to have the grout cleaned every few years in the high traffic areas due to not getting all the dirt out? This seems to be the case with cement grout.

My pets don't make messes often and if they do it's usually on the tile and not in the grout. Although there have been a few instanced where the birds did hit the grout dead on. Last year when I had the tile laid in the whole house, I had an elderly cat who had "issues". He's passed on and the new cat is younger and healthier. Does it really make sense to use epoxy throughout the whole house if the pet messes are infrequent? I don't have the volume of issues as a vet office would.
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Old 06-28-2011, 07:50 PM   #43
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Julianne View Post
Thanks for your reply DIY888.

With the epoxy grout, would I run into needing to have the grout cleaned every few years in the high traffic areas due to not getting all the dirt out? This seems to be the case with cement grout.

My pets don't make messes often and if they do it's usually on the tile and not in the grout. Although there have been a few instanced where the birds did hit the grout dead on. Last year when I had the tile laid in the whole house, I had an elderly cat who had "issues". He's passed on and the new cat is younger and healthier. Does it really make sense to use epoxy throughout the whole house if the pet messes are infrequent? I don't have the volume of issues as a vet office would.
With only a couple of pets making infrequent messes, you wouldn't have to use any "industrial strength" cleaning methods on a regular basis if you used epoxy grout and porcelain tile. Simple disinfectant cleaning products would do.
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Old 11-06-2011, 01:12 AM   #44
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


I had two bathrooms done with QuartzLock2 Urethane Grout. The tiler insisted it was great and better than Laticrete which I loved. He said it was easier for him and I would be really happy. Well, it looked great when he was done. Then the cabinets went in, then the mirrors. Then came the electricians. They made a mess. They didn't clean up. I didn't think much about it. There was drywall dust all over the floor from them putting in the can lights and other lighting. When everything was finally finished, touch up paint, all the little details, like towel rods, etc. and it was time to clean up and move in I could not get my floors clean. When the electricians had come in and made this mess it had been at least three weeks or more after the tiler had finished. Surely it was enough time for the grout to set and dry. But the drywall dust has adhered not only to the grout but also to some of the tile. NO ONE wants to take responsability and help me. The tiler said "it looked good when I left and I don't know what was happening in that bathroom." The electrician has lied and said they cleaned up. The grout manufacturer gave me two different answers. I talked to one guy at Bostik who implied I should sue the electrician and try Krud Kutter which has not made a dent in cleaning the grout and has helped nominally in cleaning the porcelain tile. The other guy did not want to talk to me and said I would probably have to have it regrouted and maybe I should call another company and find a product to clean it but they don't have anything to clean it so he couldn't help me! I find this completely disgusting on the part of Bostik and would never recommend this product. Stay away from this stuff. Can anyone please help me? My bathrooms look like crap, my grout is horrible. I don't want to end up tearing out my bathroom. For anyone else use Laticrete.

Last edited by Shanah; 11-06-2011 at 03:26 AM.
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Old 11-06-2011, 06:07 AM   #45
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Bostik TruColor premixed urethane grout: opinions?


Epoxy grout is the most robust but it, too, has installation issues. There are plenty of postings from people who could not remove the epoxy grout haze from their tiles.

Urethane grout is easy to clean up after application and is stain resistant if allowed to cure properly. But silica and gypsum dust is not a stain. The dust is a fine powder that penetrates every microscopic fissure and adheres there. Gypsum and silica dust from drywall can also affect cementitious grout:

http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/...p/t-12926.html
http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/...p/t-16695.html

DO NOT USE ANY OF THE PRODUCTS MENTIONED ON THAT PAGE WITHOUT FIRST CONSULTING THE TECH SUPPORT AT THE MANUFACTURER OF THE URETHANE GROUT. SOME CHEMICALS WILL WEAKEN THE URETHANE SURFACE BOND THAT SEALS THE GROUT.

You need to find a method to lift the dust out of those microscopic fissures and then rinse or wet-vac them away before they settle back in and get redeposited. Again, consult with the urethane grout manufacturer's TECH SUPPORT (not sales) before applying any chemical or using any industrial cleaning method. Avoid enzymatics.

You might have a fruitful small claims lawsuit against the electricians especially if you have before/after pictures. It should be possible to prove that what is coating your floor is gypsum and silica dust. If painters spilled paint on a new carpet you wouldn't go after the carpet company, would you, even if they told you the carpet was resistant to stains? Paint is not a "stain" like grape juice; it is a coating. The drywall dust is also a coating.


Last edited by diy888; 11-06-2011 at 06:11 AM.
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