Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Remodeling > Kitchen & Bath Remodeling

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 05-24-2012, 10:25 AM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Share |
Default

Shower floor repair


The Master bath shower in a 20 yr old house I recently purchased had a major water leak. The shower is 4 ft by 8 ft and is lined with what appears to be cultured marble including the floor.

The floor had several cracks that had been caulked to stop the leak. After checking the floor from the crawl space and seeing the rotted wood, I removed the floor with hammer and chisel/crowbar. Underneath the floor was about 2 1/2 inch thick circles of what appeared to be Quickrete.

After removing this I was down to the rotted sub-floor. There was no pan liner, membrane or any thing else between the concrete and sub-floor. I removed the rotted portion.

Along the walls at the original floor level are one inch thick trim pieces of the cultured marble that I left in place. So the sub-floor is 2 3/4 in below the trim. There is considerable rotted wood under the wall with the shower door; however, all other walls and wood appear to be solid. I will replace all rotted wood from the crawl space beneath the floor.

My question is how to replace the floor. Videos on the web show in new construction installing sub-floor, tar-paper, pre-pan mix w/slope to drain, liner and pan w/slope to drain and finally tile.

Cement board is used on the walls. I don't want to remove the cultured marble on the walls but will probably have to remove the bottom 6 inches of the wall along with the trim. Will probably have to remove the C/M at the door to insure pan and liner are correctly installed.

Should I replace the bottom 6 inches with cement board over the membrane liner? Then same tile on floor goes up backer board? Can I tile over the cultured marble?

Do I need to attach cement board or some other backer board over the C/M first before the tile? Or do I need to remove the C/M if I want to add tile on walls? This may be necessary for the shower door wall if the rotted wood goes up the studs. Haven't seen that yet.
Any comments are welcome.


Last edited by oh'mike; 06-21-2012 at 06:01 PM. Reason: added spaces
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2012, 12:12 PM   #2
Stuck in the 70's
 
Blondesense's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: south central Missouri
Posts: 2,133
Default

Shower floor repair


Tiling on the c/m is a bad idea. It won't stick.
It sounds like someone who didn't know better expected it to stop all the water. You found out that was wrong. You don't know what else they did wrong.
Your safest bet is to tear it down to the studs and start fresh.
This site may help with the pan.

http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html


Last edited by Blondesense; 05-24-2012 at 12:17 PM.
Blondesense is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2012, 01:23 PM   #3
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1
Default

Shower floor repair


Laticrete makes preformed shower systems for quick installation: http://www.stonetooling.com/Laticret...stem-s/658.htm
Fallling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2012, 05:17 PM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


Having trouble finding someone who will do the repair work on my 4'x8' shower. May have to do it my self. The walls of the shower are cultured onyx rather than marble

. Found one place in Maryland that will make a 4'x8' shower pan but it weighs 350 lb and costs $1700.

I broke one wall piece getting to the rotted wood. It will cost $400. Plus $180 shipping. Soooo I dont think I will put onyx back in. Must find solution using pre pan, membrane and pan built on site and ceramic tile for floor and for the area where the broken onyx was.

I think I can match tile color to the onyx color. The floor will go in ok; however I will have to make a tile trim border around the floor to cover the 6 in rise for the membrane. Will have to cut the onyx and install cement board and then tile. I will have to somehow attach the trim tile to the existing onyx at the top of the cement board. the guy in Maryland with the onyx said they use silicone to attach trim to the onyx walls and pans.

I know there are some holes in my thinking and plan. Can anyone help with advice? And no I do not want to tear out all the onyx down to the studs and start over. At least not yet.

Last edited by oh'mike; 06-21-2012 at 06:03 PM. Reason: added spaces
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-21-2012, 06:07 PM   #5
DIY staff
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kane county,Illinois
Posts: 21,412
Default

Shower floor repair


Your goose is cooked---Unless you can remove and reinstall the onyx sheets after you rebuild the pan and waterproof the walls --nothing pretty can be done---

Post a picture--but I believe that enclosure can not be made waterproof without extending the pan liner up behind the wall sheets.
__________________
New members: Adding your location to your profile helps in many ways.--M--
oh'mike is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 08:40 AM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


I know the goose is getting warm. I do plan on cutting the onyx wall sheets and green board about 6-12 inches up from the bottom to be able to install the membrane up the wall studs. I hope this will stop any leaks if I do it properly. Then I will install the pan, cement board over the membrane on the wall, waterproof it, and install the tile on the cement bd. A problem is the joint between the tile and onyx.

I believe I can not remove the onyx without breaking some of them. They are too expensive to replace. I will post some pictures later today or tomorrow. And a diagram of the wall section where the pan, membrane, onyx and tile will meet. I know it may not be pretty but I hope to design a contrast kinda like different color tile in a bathroom along a border. We'll see.

I do appreciate the advice.
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 09:20 AM   #7
Renovations contractor
 
Bonzai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Squamish, BC - Canada
Posts: 324
Default

Shower floor repair


It is not just the shower pan than must be waterproofed ... The whole shower needs to be. Just waterproofing the bottom 6-12" of the walls isn't any good and is just asking for further problems.
__________________
Home Renovations & Repairs
ADVENT HOME SOLUTIONS INC
Vancouver to Whistler & beyond
Bonzai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 11:54 AM   #8
Chicago, IL
 
Michael Thomas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 1,037
Default

Shower floor repair


pinkertonpv,

Take a look here: Fixing shower pan leaks - Paragon Property Services Infrared Leak Detection Services Chicago/Northbrook
__________________
Home Inspections, Infrared (Thermal Imaging) Leak Identification and Inspection Services, Roof, Attic, Building, Basement and Foundation Moisture Intrusion and Water Leak Inspections, Troubled Building Consultations - Serving Chicago and Suburbs http://paragoninspects.com/
Michael Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 01:26 PM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


Michael, thanks for the information. I will review it thoroughly.

Bonzai, I understand what you are saying. The existing onyx wall layers as you know are water proof. There is no evidence of water leaking around them or through the joints. I will install the waterproof membrane up to the bottom of the onyx wall layer. I will proof the proof the prepan and membrane before I install the pan and tile. The only possible point of leakage will be at the joint between the onyx and tile installed over the cement board over the membrane. If I do everything correctly. So I am concerned about the joint.
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-22-2012, 10:26 PM   #10
Renovations contractor
 
Bonzai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Squamish, BC - Canada
Posts: 324
Default

Shower floor repair


Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkertonpv View Post
Bonzai, I understand what you are saying. The existing onyx wall layers as you know are water proof.
Actually I don't know this ... I'm sure I'd remember being to your house Onyx tile itself is not waterproof (onyx is porous like marble so it does let a small amount of water penetrate over time) & I don't recall you saying there is a waterproofing membrane behind the tile unless I missed that which is perfectly possible. Cement board is also not waterproof.
__________________
Home Renovations & Repairs
ADVENT HOME SOLUTIONS INC
Vancouver to Whistler & beyond
Bonzai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2012, 09:01 AM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


Bonzai; I thought maybe you were familiar with the cultured onyx. It is manmade and similar to cultured marble. I don't know the process, but the manufacturer warrants it as 100% waterproof. They must add something to the mixture. The existing cultured onyx wall layers show no signs of water leakage and have been in place for 20+ years. The floor leaked due to the cracks formed due to lack of a pre-pan, membrane, pan and using a wall layer as the floor instead of a preformed onyx pan.

I am planning on adding a layer of waterproofing to the cement bd.

I will post some pictures and a diagram later today.
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2012, 12:23 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


Change of plans; keeping the cultured onyx walls and just rebuilding the shower pan is too difficult. The bottom 12 inches of the cultured onyx wall bd would need to be removed all the way around the shower to allow for proper installation of the prepan, membrane and pan and then replaced with tile. Would be difficult to cut the onyx and wouldn't look very good. I am considering putting cement board over the onyx and installing tile on the walls and floor(over prepan, membrane, pan). I am going to glue and screw the cement bd to the studs thru the onyx rather than removing it.

This will give a more nicer look than combining the tile with the onyx. This also allows me to install a more functional bench and several shelves built into the shower wall. Will have to cut into the onyx for the shelves. We'll see how difficult that is.

I have added some pics of the wall with the onyx removed and the subfloor. I will remove the moldings around the bottom before I install the prepan, etc.

Comments and suggestions are welcome. Please advise.
Attached Thumbnails
Shower floor repair-shower.jpg   Shower floor repair-shower-floor-2.jpg   Shower floor repair-shower-floor-3.jpg  
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2012, 01:55 PM   #13
liscenced electrician
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Oregon coast
Posts: 983
Default

Shower floor repair


I would be removing everything I can except maybe the lid.
jimmy21 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-13-2012, 07:49 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 62
Default

Shower floor repair


I am starting on building up the pan for the shower floor this week. I am using the MarkEindustries Quick pitch system. I am going to take everyone's advice and rip out all the Onyx walls and the green board behind it to get to the bare studs. After I have finished with the pre-pan, pan and tile floor, I will start on the walls. I have a few questions.
1. I should wait to install the wall backerboard until after the floor tile is in and grout set, dried and waterproofed. Right? Which is best, Lowe's brand of B/B or Home Depot brand of B/B? Do they need to be waterproofed after they are put up.
2. The floor tile should extend to the studs so the b/b and wall tile will allow the drip line to be over the tiles and not a mortar joint. If I use the two inch tile in the 12 inch mosaic sheets does the drip line still apply?
3. B/B should be set so it is 1/4 inch off the floor tile. Right?
4. When laying the wall tile at the corners, how much space should I leave at the edge? Should this apply for both walls at the corner or should one wall go to the end with the resulting joint being similar the the wall/floor joint?
5. What should be the spacing between tiles? What size spacers should I get
6. I will start at the center between the walls and floor and ceiling and measure/dry fit tiles to get the right fit. OK?

Too many questions I Guess. Watched a lot of You tube videos and just want some assurance.
pinkertonpv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2012, 05:14 AM   #15
DIY staff
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Kane county,Illinois
Posts: 21,412
Default

Shower floor repair


How to build a shower - Building a shower pan with pre-sloped mortar bed, liner and curb.

Preslope first

drain and liner next

Then Durrock or other backer for walls

Then deck mud into pan

Pan deck mud secures the board below the water line so no nails or screw needed there.

__________________
New members: Adding your location to your profile helps in many ways.--M--
oh'mike is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Complete bathroom redesign- need help with shower placement Liv Kitchen & Bath Remodeling 0 03-08-2012 12:00 PM
Shower Pan Liner in Tampa - Shower rebuild ghowmedic Building & Construction 10 12-30-2011 08:03 PM
Problem with shower pan and drain ohiogirl1965 Plumbing 1 06-07-2010 06:33 AM
Bathroom shower surround StevePax General DIY Discussions 0 11-12-2009 12:31 PM
Tile Baseboard on outside of plastic shower pan at linoleum joint? GaryS Tiling, ceramics, marble 2 07-26-2009 12:39 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.