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Old 06-23-2010, 12:49 AM   #1
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1st time shower build, please take a look


I am so grateful for this forum, I have found out a lot of great info so far. Still need some help. Please take a look at these pictures. I am trying to build this shower in the little space I have in order to use this expensive shower glass my girlfriend bought. For it to work, I need to go around this corner, shown in the image. Here are my questions.

1.) It does not appear that there is a stud on the wall (see arrow, image 2), will this be a problem? The wall turns a quick corner and then there is a stud. Not sure what to do.

2.) Is it okay to build the curb with 2X4s? I was thinking about stacking up three 2x4s to get 6 inches in height. I plan on folding over the membrane, and then tacking on lathe and muding it over.

3.) how do you properly cut the membrane to drape over around the corner onto the curb? I have seen plastic corner pieces, I could not find them at Lowes. Are they needed for corners?

4.) I have been reading about putting hardibacker onto green board and was going to to put up the tar paper over the green board, then put up the hardibacker. Sound okay?

5.) do you butt one piece of hardibacker right up to the other at corners? or leave a gap? do you seal the borders?

A lot of questions, I know.

Thanks so much!

IMAGE #1

IMAGE #2

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Old 06-23-2010, 05:48 AM   #2
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1st time shower build, please take a look


You seriously need to get a Kerdi Shower kit. It'll be a lot easier and a lot better system. You'll get all your membranes, shower pan, curb, drain, etc. go to http://www.schluter.com and check into one.

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Old 06-23-2010, 08:59 AM   #3
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1st time shower build, please take a look


Yeah, I have heard of them. Only problem, is that I already have my preslope poured and I don't have the $$$ to buy Kerdi.

Okay, since there is not a lot of structure in that corner, what if I take down the greenboard and drywall and install plywood? I could hang the plywood on the studs that are there and at least there would be something to drill the hardiback into? What do you think??
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Old 06-23-2010, 01:17 PM   #4
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1st time shower build, please take a look


Quote:
1.) It does not appear that there is a stud on the wall, will this be a problem? The wall turns a quick corner and then there is a stud. Not sure what to do.
When you remove the wallboard so that the vinyl liner can be placed behind it as it must be then you can install the needed stud at that time.

Quote:
2.) Is it okay to build the curb with 2X4s? I was thinking about stacking up three 2x4s to get 6 inches in height.
Curbs can be fashioned from 2X4's if need be but three 2X4's will not add up to six inches of curb.

Quote:
I plan on folding over the membrane, and then tacking on lathe and muding it over.
...and how will you tack on the lath without ruining the membrane with the holes you will making tacking on the lath?

Quote:
3.) how do you properly cut the membrane to drape over around the corner onto the curb? I have seen plastic corner pieces, I could not find them at Lowes. Are they needed for corners?
You never cut the membrane unless you are prepared to weld it back together. The corners can be used but they must be welded with the proper adhesive. You "fold" the membrane.


Quote:
4.) I have been reading about putting hardibacker onto green board and was going to to put up the tar paper over the green board, then put up the hardibacker. Sound okay?
No! You remove the greenboard and replace it with 1/2" Hardi.

Quote:
5.) do you butt one piece of hardibacker right up to the other at corners? or leave a gap? do you seal the borders?
Why would you need a gap? All seams and changes-in-plane must be taped with alkali resistant mesh tape and bedded with thinset.

vgoose, you are heading for trouble. I'm not sure where your information is coming from but it's not good information.

Do yourself a favor...
Use the KERDI Drain and KERDI Mat on this project. You can't afford not to. Spend the money on KERDI that you will be spending two months down the road to redo this mess if you stay on this course.

You haven't gone too far to change your mind at this point, use KERDI and keep going from here. Otherwise you already need to back up and take some things apart.
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Old 06-23-2010, 05:34 PM   #5
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1st time shower build, please take a look


Dear Bud - Thank you for the reply.

1.) So the green board at the bottom there was removed for a period of time. There is no stud in that corner, or any way I can think of to install one. Let me say that I am in a 100+ old home and sometimes is a FREAK show about how it was constructed. There is no runner below that area, it just drops down to the dirt. They literally made that corner out by butting up two pieces of drywall. The other side of that corner is a closet! Ahhh! So, I am not real sure how I will be able to install a stud. I was planing on putting liner over greenboard, then hardiback over liner. I have read this is okay..

2.) Hmm, I guess that is true about the height, so maybe 4 then? I keep getting referred to this link, http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html
It looks like (3) 2x4s stacked on top of each other? no?

3.) I was hoping to go around the corner with the membrane and lathe like this link, but where do you get those cool blue corner pieces?

4.) So, I am okay with removing the greenboard and installing 1/2 hardi, but I still have the problem of structure in that corner, which is why I was thinking of putting up horizontal 1/4 inches of plywood, membrane, then 1/4 inch hardiback. That way the hardy can be screwed into something in that corner??

5.) I would like to avoid the Kerdi, since from what I have read it is technically challenging to install, since I am already challenged I was hoping to go the more traditional build route.
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Old 06-24-2010, 10:48 AM   #6
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Quote:
1.) So the green board at the bottom there was removed for a period of time. There is no stud in that corner, or any way I can think of to install one. Let me say that I am in a 100+ old home and sometimes is a FREAK show about how it was constructed. There is no runner below that area, it just drops down to the dirt. They literally made that corner out by butting up two pieces of drywall. The other side of that corner is a closet! Ahhh! So, I am not real sure how I will be able to install a stud. I was planing on putting liner over greenboard, then hardiback over liner.
The wallboard needs to be attached solidly to something. Flying corners don't get it when it comes to tile installations. I can't believe that by removing the wallboard there is still no way to get a stud or some kind of substantial support in that wall.

Quote:
2.) Hmm, I guess that is true about the height, so maybe 4 then? I keep getting referred to this link, http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html
It looks like (3) 2x4s stacked on top of each other? no?
In that illustration you are seeing only three 2X4's but I don't think it claims the dimensions equal six inches. Harry's website is full of good information but what you are seeing there is a dated method and five times more complicated than Schluter's KERDI System.

Quote:
3.) I was hoping to go around the corner with the membrane and lathe like this link, but where do you get those cool blue corner pieces?
Here's one source for the preformed corners.

http://www.noblecompany.com/Portals/...20lo%20res.pdf

The mesh on the curb is fine but you CAN NOT nail it to the 2X4's without damaging the liner. You never penetrate the liner with anything anywhere lower than three inches above the highest point of the finished curb. The liner must be buried under the curb mud and that can get tricky.


Quote:
4.) So, I am okay with removing the greenboard and installing 1/2 hardi, but I still have the problem of structure in that corner, which is why I was thinking of putting up horizontal 1/4 inches of plywood, membrane, then 1/4 inch hardiback. That way the hardy can be screwed into something in that corner??
I just can not follow this. See #1. above.

Quote:
5.) I would like to avoid the Kerdi, since from what I have read it is technically challenging to install, since I am already challenged I was hoping to go the more traditional build route.
BALONEY!!! It's a helluva lot easier than what you are trying to do.
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Old 06-24-2010, 11:59 AM   #7
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1st time shower build, please take a look


Yeah, I was baffled by that corner too. Basically I would need to run a stud down onto a paver on top of the dirt in crawlspace below.

Sorry, what I was thinking about doing was hanging 3/4 inch plywood horizontally so that the studs that are there will support it just fine and then the plywood would extend into that corner, creating something to drill into. I have read a couple threads so far where some folks have used the plywood to add structure. What do you think? Then I would hang 6 mil plolysheet over the plywood, then hang the hardiback, probably using the 1/4 inch stuff.

Thanks,

Jay

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