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Old 03-31-2013, 11:40 AM   #1
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


HI Guys. I have a 1700sf single story ranch style home over a basement and crawlspace. I am on a well and I have the issue with running more than one faucet/appliance at the same time. For example, if I run the dishwasher and then turn on the sink right next to it, the dishwasher doesn’t fill correctly and the pump starts the make noise as its straining to get enough water. If I run the clothes washer in the basement, the kitchen sink, 25 feet away (upstairs) barely trickles. In February 2008 I lost the well pump. I replaced the well pump, air tank, media filters on the water softener, had the water softener heads cleaned, etc. and I still have never been able to run adequate volume or pressure more than one thing effectively. When the softener was serviced, I noticed the former owner had bypassed the first media filter for some reason. When the heads were cleaned, the pvc lines from the air tank, thru the softener heads were 99% plugged. This was all replaced. From the softener there is ” pvc running most of the way thru the entire basement which feeds the whole house. The only exception is that the former owner ran 30 feet of ” hot and ” cold pvc to the kitchen from the main ” lines. All of the ” pvc is at ceiling level in the basement. Since I’m not sure of any other clogs or buildup in the pvc beyond the softener, I plan to replace 20 foot sections at a time to see if anything improves. Lots of valves and tees to check out in the mix. I attached a gauge to the faucet right out of the well and I have 50-55psi before the air tank. At the end of the longest ” run in the basement I have 40psi at a faucet which is at the end of approximately 50 feet of pvc lines from the well. The clothes washer is half way between that faucet and the well and the cold line get 30-35psi there. Could be crusty shutoff valves, plugged tees etc. My plans are to replace all the long runs with new ” pipe, valves, tees etc, and ONLY use ” pipe at the last 3-5 feet to each appliance/faucet. I’m looking for any other advice that I might check before I start. I do notice that when I run the basement shower and bypass the softener that I get more pressure at the shower and the kitchen sink has noticeably more water coming out. Still not what Im looking for. Will I ever be able to run the laundry and dishwasher at the same time, lol?


Last edited by wrea398; 03-31-2013 at 12:13 PM.
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Old 03-31-2013, 12:24 PM   #2
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


at what pressure does your pump kick on at?
when you measured i assume that was not with the water running. have you tried bypassing all the filters and softener and see if it improves? photos of your complete setup would be helpful.

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Old 03-31-2013, 12:37 PM   #3
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


Yes, water was not running. My pump kicks on at 40 and shuts off at 60. It's actually a 30/50 switch but I cranked up the off/on settings a few years ago. I do need to recheck the air tank pressure though. Never really improved anything when I did it. Yes.. I bypassed the softener and ran the basement shower which did have better pressure, then I ran upstairs to try the kitchen faucet and it was twice as good with the basement shower running. I already had the softener serviced and media filters changed a few years ago but when fresh, it didn't fix the issue with multiple appliances. I know that it would most likey help to have the softener serviced again as I have lots of iron. Pics are a bit hard to take due to the layout (different rooms, crawlspace, etc). I'll do my best to post something that makes sense.

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at what pressure does your pump kick on at?
when you measured i assume that was not with the water running. have you tried bypassing all the filters and softener and see if it improves? photos of your complete setup would be helpful.

Last edited by wrea398; 03-31-2013 at 01:45 PM.
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Old 03-31-2013, 01:42 PM   #4
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


Here is a drawing of what I have right now. Notice the 1/2' lines all the way around the basement bathroom and the 1/2" lines leaving the laundry area, going 20-30 feet into a crawlspace until they get to the kitchen sink and dishwasher. The distance from the softener to the end of the 3/4" pipe at the bathroom wall is about 50 foot of pipe. My opinion is 3/4" (hot and cold) pipe should circle the basement bathroom and should also go all the way to the kitchen from a 3/4" tee at the laundry room. Then 1/2" pipe should only tee off directly under each appliance/faucet, in no more than 4-5 feet sections. Correct?
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC-pvc-layout.jpg  

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Old 03-31-2013, 08:34 PM   #5
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


IS your water line PVC our CPVC PVC is usually white CPVC is a tan off white in color.
A good water line system should have a max of 2 fixtures on a 1/2 inch line as a rule of thumb.
PVC is not legal in my area beyond the well hookup from the pump.

Can you bypass your filters? Pressure of water does not mean volume... A trickle can have 60 lbs on it.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:12 PM   #6
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


Yes .... I can and have bypassed the filters. cpvc lines all the way thru. I know the 3/4 lines should be end to end. I have a bathroom at the end of the run. It has a tub, shower, a sink, a toilet. I also have a toilet, tub, shower and sink directly above the basement bathroom in my upstairs bathroom. The 3/4 feed lines are shared in the bottom and top bathrooms. One 3/4 main feed an several 1/2 inch lines off of it to the lower and upper bathroom accessories.

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Old 03-31-2013, 09:19 PM   #7
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


if i see this right feeds going to upstairs bath come off of 1/2" lines.....thats a no no ....on a well system ALL main lines should be 3/4" with 1/2" branches to keep the volume up to supply the demand of the fixtures being used....if you did any remodeling and added a bath or other water demand .....did you increase the gpm of the pump to keep up to your full load..ben sr.......looking at your drawing thats your problem to much off 1/2" lines...

Last edited by ben's plumbing; 03-31-2013 at 09:21 PM.
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:35 PM   #8
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


Yes. This is correct. The basement bath has one 3/4 hot from the water heater and one 3/4 cold coming from the laundry area but they are both reduced to 1/2 before they branch off to each appliance/ faucet. The last 10-15 feet of line is 1/2" before the verticle branches go upstairs . The upstairs is fed from 1/2 inch lines. I only added a shower to the exsting upstairs tub. Shower works but with half the pressure/flow as the downstairs tub/shower directly below it. My plan is to go 3/4 all the way from the softener to the end of the runs in all directions. Then i will plumb 1/2 to the individual utilities...no more than 5 feet each fom the 3/4 main line.



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Originally Posted by ben's plumbing View Post
if i see this right feeds going to upstairs bath come off of 1/2" lines.....thats a no no ....on a well system ALL main lines should be 3/4" with 1/2" branches to keep the volume up to supply the demand of the fixtures being used....if you did any remodeling and added a bath or other water demand .....did you increase the gpm of the pump to keep up to your full load..ben sr
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Old 03-31-2013, 09:46 PM   #9
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Water pressure/volume on a well. Replaceing PVC


Quote:
Originally Posted by wrea398 View Post
Yes. This is correct. The basement bath has one 3/4 hot from the water heater and one 3/4 cold coming from the laundry area but they are both reduced to 1/2 before they branch off to each appliance/ faucet. The last 10-15 feet of line is 1/2" before the verticle branches go upstairs . The upstairs is fed from 1/2 inch lines. I only added a shower to the exsting upstairs tub. Shower works but with half the pressure/flow as the downstairs tub/shower directly below it. My plan is to go 3/4 all the way from the softener to the end of the runs in all directions. Then i will plumb 1/2 to the individual utilities...no more than 5 feet each fom the 3/4 main line.
if you change the basement bath to 3/4" with 1/2" branches and get 3/4 as far as you can to supply 2nd floor ...it will help alot with volume which should improve your overall supply for demand...ben sr

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