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Old 04-16-2015, 12:29 PM   #1
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


Greetings,


Im and experienced DIYer, first time posting to this forum.


My wife and I are currently planning a remodel of the first floor bathroom in our 1941 1 story cape located in Connecticut. (Current CT building code is 2009 IBC, 2003 IPC) The plan is for a complete gut of the original bathroom and reframe to accommodate a new coat closet in the hall and a larger closet in the adjoining bedroom. All framing will be 2x4 non-load bearing construction.


Since we are dealing with a small 3/4 bathroom footprint, approximately 6x7, we would like to maximize the space in front of the toilet near the linen closet with a wall mount toilet. Our plan is to use the Geberit 111.728.00.1 wall mount toilet carrier.


Ive been running into a few plumbing design problems regarding the 3 waste pipe from the carrier and also plumbing a toilet vent. The toilet will be the last fixture on the bathroom DWV circuit before draining into the main horizontal waste line in the basement.


The first question I have regards the 3 waste pipe that runs through the 2x4 sole plate. Does this violate R602.6(2) by not leaving 5/8 between the pipe and the wall exterior? I cannot imagine Geberit would design a system for 2x4 walls and it be in violation of this code.


Second, since the toilet is <12 from the main waste pipe, I have no room for a vertical vent from the toilet before the waste line enters the main trunk. I looked into classifying the upstream pipe as a wet vent, but since the bathroom sink waste line would also carry the 2nd floor bathroom sink, it would appear a wet vent for the toilet would be in violation of IPC909.1 since the sinks are not on the same floor. I then looked into circuit venting at the wye/elbow off the drop from the toilet wall carrier but since Id have to run the vent horizontally about 15 prior to having space to run vertically up into the wall, all due to the toilet carrier framing, I would appear to be in violation of IPC905.3. Thoughts on venting this toilet?


Any suggestions or experiences would be appreciated. There seems to be a void in online knowledge of a wall mount toilet in 2x4 framing.


Id like to have a good plan in place before I walk in to the towns building department.


Regards,
DIYPILOT

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Old 04-16-2015, 05:21 PM   #2
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


Your probably not going to like what i'm going to say. But you need to build another 2 by 4 wall in front of the existing wall. The plumbing will need to go into that wall the new one.

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Old 04-21-2015, 10:22 AM   #3
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostmaker View Post
Your probably not going to like what i'm going to say. But you need to build another 2 by 4 wall in front of the existing wall. The plumbing will need to go into that wall the new one.
I've considered options such as a double wall or 2x6 framing for the wet wall. The double wall removes the advantage of the wall mount toilet space savings, and a 2x6 is again cutting into valuable space in between the toilet and the linen closet. If it comes down to it, I'll frame the wall with 2x6 as a last option.

I believe I've found a way to make the venting work in the 2x4 wall. The two sinks circuit will parallel the toilet/shower circuit. This allows me to use the run from the toilet to the shower as a wet vent. The sink circuit will have to feed into the waste run after the toilet.

I'm still waiting to hear if anyone has dealt with their local building officials on the 3" waste run of the wall mount toilet through the sole plate. Has anyone had problems? I'm planning on using a steel protection plate, but is that enough to meet R602.6(2)?

Thanks,
DIYPILOT
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Old 04-21-2015, 06:03 PM   #4
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


I inspect in Ohio for plumbing which is also 2009 IPC. It would be very helpful if you drew a isometric drawing.

Heres the problem you will have. Your planning on storing water in a tank located on an outside wall that is subject to freezing temperatures. Think about that. That is why I suggest a double wall one stuffed with insulation one for your toilet with drywall between the two.

You will need to wet vent the toilet with a lav from the 3 inch below your toilet connection. Depending on your distance out the roof the vent for both may need to be 2 inch if it exceeds 40 foot. 1.5 inch if not to the point it ties into an existing 3 inch vent.

So draw up an isometric out the roof showing me how you intend to plumb it. With all the fixtures you plan to have.

Minimum distance from side to side is 15 inches clearance from center of drain. 30 inches total. In front of the toilet you must maintain 21 inches from the bowel to any obstruction minimal.

46 inches from wall to wall from toilet wall to what ever is in front of the toilet. Using your model toilet.

Last edited by Ghostmaker; 04-21-2015 at 06:23 PM.
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Old 04-21-2015, 09:10 PM   #5
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


Thankfully, the wet wall is an interior non-load bearing wall. I won't need to worry about freezing.

Here is my isometric plumbing sketch and also a isometric of the entire bathroom that was recently done.

Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting-bathroom-proposed-5.jpg

The vent stack from the 2nd floor Lav meets in the attic and does one more jog to the main 3" vent. I spec'd the vent from the shower all the way up as 2".

Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting-bath-plumb-iso.jpg

There is a little jog sketched from both the 2nd floor lav waste pipe and 1st floor vent pipe to accommodate the two walls being offset by about 16". Both of those pipes will need to be strung through a floor joist. I need to confirm that these two walls are offset by a few more measurements though as I'm not 100%.

Let me know what you think and if I missed any gotch-yas.

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Old 04-21-2015, 10:24 PM   #6
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


That should work Your shower vent must be verticle 45 degree or better at all times. Until you are 6 inches above the flood level rim of the lav then you can go horizontal.

Usually 42 inches above the floor when you reconnect the shower vent to the lav.

Now If your using one of those Internet plastic shower units with multiple heads you may need to increase your shower drain to 3 inch.
Each body spray and shower head counts as 2.5 GPM at 12.3 GPM the shower trap must be 3 inch.
Basically 5 heads your sunk.

GPM is Gallons per minute flow rate.

The valve on that shower unit absolutely must meet this standard below. There is no work around.

424.3 Individual shower valves. Individual shower and tub-shower combination valves shall be balanced-pressure, thermostatic or combination balanced-pressure/thermostatic valves that conform to the requirements of ASSE 1016 or ASME A112.18.1/CSA B 125.1 and shall be installed at the point of use. Shower and tub-shower combination valves required by this section shall be equipped with a means to limit the maximum setting of the valve to 120F (49C), which shall be field adjusted in accordance with the manufacturer's instructions. In-line thermostatic valves shall not be utilized for compliance with this section.

If the seller cannot prove the ASSE 1016 certification DO NOT BUY IT.

Your inspector might not care if someone gets scalded. I do and have stopped installations of the Chinese sub standard crap from the net.

Again this is how we read the code in my area your inspector may or may not do the same. I'm an Ohio state certified plumbing inspector with over 28 years of plumbing experience. But what ever your inspector says it is his turf and you will do it his way.

You will also have to test it.... 5 lb air or water out the roof.

Last edited by Ghostmaker; 04-21-2015 at 10:39 PM.
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Old 04-22-2015, 07:10 AM   #7
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


Thanks for looking this over Ghostmaker! We start the project in June and I hope to post a few updates then when the pipes start to be fit.

How should I expect my inspector to test for the 5lbs as you stated on the vents?

The shower in the iso is more just a filler for the space. We do plan to go neo-angle, but we will be using the Schluter Kerdi shower tray with build up curbs. Also, we'll be going with the standard Kohler shower head setup.

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Old 04-22-2015, 06:34 PM   #8
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Wall Mount Toilet in 2x4 framing - code & venting


You have to have the test on when inspector arrives. So plan on some isolation clean out tees.

And some test balls so only the new stuff is tested.

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