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-   -   Toilet installation on raised tile floor (http://www.diychatroom.com/f7/toilet-installation-raised-tile-floor-175020/)

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 09:48 AM

Toilet installation on raised tile floor
 
Hello
I just had a tile floor installed in my laundry room. The room is raised so it is off the slab
Now I have a plumber installing a toilet
He tells me there is nothing to screw into to mount the toilet
Do I really have to rip up tile and have place some wood around the toilet so he can screw into that?
The toilet sits between 2 of the 2x6x10.
If I didn't call a plumber I would've just mounted the toilet into the tile, concrete board, and plywood. Wouldn't this have been enough?

Thank you

I hate to rip up more tile that I just paid to put in but will if it's not done right

joecaption 03-20-2013 09:53 AM

2 X 6 floor joist and a tile floor:eek:
Post a picture so we can see what your seeing.
Any reason why no one installed a flange?
What's going to hold the pipe up without a flange?
Is this a slab floor?

wkearney99 03-20-2013 09:55 AM

There should have been a toilet flange installed on the drain pipe. The toilet gets held down onto the flange using what are called "closet bolts", as in the term 'water closet' to describe a toilet location. Was a flange not installed on the pipe? If not, then yes, you're going to need one installed. It's also where the 'wax ring' will sit in order to make an effective seal. I believe building code requires this sort of thing. Who did the pipe install?

jagans 03-20-2013 10:02 AM

Well, first of all, I hope you don't have a front load washer with a 2 x 6's on a ten foot span. Your tile will vibrate right off the floor.

Secondly, who is this plumber, and why did he not tell you that he needs to install a flange, because there isn't one there? Or did we only get the abridged version of the story?

I second Joe, Please post some photos, topside and underneath.

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 11:01 AM

Thanks for the responses
No. The toilet pipe and flange were there. Coming up.
The plumber said that there needs to be like 2x4 or 2x6x10 wood to go around the main pipe. Under the tile I mean. Mainly for support he says. And to screw the whole toilet into. I have all the pipes or flanges and that ring part.
The main reason he said was due to the wait of the toilet. The piping is fine
He said he needed to drill and bolt the toilet into the wood bracket

My question is do I really need a wooden bracket or is the tile, concrete board and plywood sturdy enough? Or will the weight of the toilet start to mess up the tile

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 11:19 AM

Thanks for the responses
No. The toilet pipe and flange were there. Coming up.
The plumber said that there needs to be like 2x4 or 2x6x10 wood to go around the main pipe. Under the tile I mean. Mainly for support he says. And to screw the whole toilet into. I have all the pipes or flanges and that ring part.
The main reason he said was due to the wait of the toilet. The piping is fine
He said he needed to drill and bolt the toilet into the wood bracket

My question is do I really need a wooden bracket or is the tile, concrete board and plywood sturdy enough? Or will the weight of the toilet start to mess up the tile

joecaption 03-20-2013 11:30 AM

What a toilet weighs has nothing to do with it unless your trying to get by with a 1/2 subfloor.
Tile board and tile have no screw holding power and would just pull out, your going to be counting on just the subflooring to hold two screws, not a good plan.
I've had to replace many subfloor under tile floors that were only using two dowel bolts to hold it in place.

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 11:33 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Here is a pic
So everything, the pipes and all are in place

The plumber is telling me that i need to rip up some tiles and create a wooden frame to support the weight of the toilet
The toilet is a cheap one. It doesnt weigh much
Do I really need to do it this way? I dont to do it the right way, so i would rip up tile and add some more wood

joecaption 03-20-2013 11:39 AM

Why is the pipe stickiing up out of the floor?:eek:
It was suppost to be even with it.
There was also suppost to be room left around the pipe so someone could glue a flange onto the pipe.

Could still use one like this.
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...lectedIndex=21

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 11:46 AM

toilet and front load washer question
 
No the pipe can still be cut, that flange isnt sealed or held down yet

Its just sitting there
I can remove it and u would see just the pipe, so i can still cut the pipe to get the flange level with the tile

I was mostly concerned about not having anything to bolt the toilet down to besides the subfloor.
So to do it right, i should rip up the brand new tile around and add a wooden frame somewhat, so the toilet can be screwed down into that.

yes, this is a job that some friends helped me with, so a mistake

Also, someone mentioned the frontload washer stacking

This is my laundry room. I plan on stacking the machines. Do i need extra support under there as well, besides just the 2X6X10's?

And JAGANS, you mention the vibration, how do u stop this? What can i do for that.
But mainly, will the washer and drier stacked be too much weight and should i have added a few more 2x6x10s in the area where the washer and drier are going

Thanks for all this help, im new to the site, very good responses

TheEplumber 03-20-2013 12:00 PM

The flange bolts to the plywood subfloor- solid wood blocking is not required around the flange. Then the toilet bolts to the flange- the flange holds the toilet in place.
If you have a 4 bolt toilet then you might want additional blocking for the extra holes.
You need to have 3/4 plywood/osb subfloor to anchor flange not cement board. I'm not clear on your set up

jagans 03-20-2013 12:01 PM

Just go into the basement and add 2 x 6 blocking on the flat next to the pipe. put a 1 x cleat underneath to hold the blocking in place. The plumber has to fasten the flange to a solid substrate. The correct application is for the flange to sit on top of the tile, but it will work if its flush too.

Sorry I missed your subsequent inquiry.

Sistering an additional 2 x 6 to your joists cant hurt, and notching the ends and installing 2 x 10's would help more, if you can afford the head room. If not, maybe 2 x 8's? Solid wood blocking between the joists will help a little too. To be honest with you, I have a direct drive LG front loader, and the one I have must have been made in Ireland, because the damn thing does the jig all around my laundry room. When I called LG to complain, they told me that I should have put it on a concrete floor. I asked how many USA homes have concrete floors, and what if I wanted to install it in a second story laundry room? That's the company response, concrete floor.

Lucky I have a ranch, corn beef and cabbage, and beer. Happy belated Saint Patty's Day :drink:

joecaption 03-20-2013 12:01 PM

That picture does not show what kind of clearance you have for a propper flange to fit. The best one would slip over the outside of pipe and be glued on.
Next best would be one that slides into the inside of the pipe with glue.
The last one is the one I showed in a differant post before that uses a rubber ring to seal it.
The flange get screwed to the floor with 6 screws and the toilet is held down with two brass closit bolts.
Unless the total run of those floor joist is less then 6' there way undersized for any type of flooring.
A modern home would use at least 2 X 10's

And you say a real plumber showed up and did not know how to do this?

pb_dudley 03-20-2013 05:29 PM

The floor is done properly. I'm just using the wrong terminology. That flange in the pic fits inside the pipe. It's gonna be changed out and the pipe sticking up will be cut to be level to the tile
The whole point of my post was if screwing the toilet just to the subfloor, which is, concrete board and a layer of plywood, is enough. The plumber told me I needed a wooden box around the pipe and I assume toilet to be able to screw into. For sturdiness.
I got some good answers so I assume I'll have some tile removed so extra support can be added
I don't have a basement so I can't do that. I really believe screwing the toilet to the subfloor is enough. I mean I'm sure it can support the weight. Would it be ideal to have the extra support, yes. But I don't see the floor caving in anytime soon
But Im not a contractor nor a plumber so it's only my speculation
And if the toilet weighs to much , surely a stacked washer/ dryer has to weigh to much and I don't have any extra support there either
I do have the right amount of 2 x10's or whatever the correct size of the wood is. That part was done right. So I'll see. Thanks for the help.

oh'mike 03-20-2013 06:00 PM

In a nutshell---I think you are fine----cut the pipe----glue on the flange and screw it to the floor--

Then add a wax ring and closet bolts and set the toilet---hook up the water and try it.

Before you glue and screw---do a test fit with the toilet and make sure the flange doesnt hit the bottom of the toilet---

Inside glued plastic flanges do that a lot---outside glued stainless steel ones are the best choice---
but see if the one you have will work---


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