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Old 01-30-2011, 01:27 PM   #16
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


You never put the flange on the finished floor. I have done countless bathrooms. Put it on the subfloor tile or hardwood around it then add the correct wax ring and you will have no issue ever. IF the toilet doesn't sit level or rocks use plumbers putty under the entire toilet and then tighten it back down. That will level your toilet. Don't forget to caulk around the lower edges.

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Old 01-30-2011, 06:50 PM   #17
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


ProRemodel...
I researched this topic of correct height of the toilet flange extensively online and through some building inspectors and they all said code-wise the height of flange bottom lip needs to be at the finished floor height. Many inspectors will not even allow the plumbers to rough-in a toilet flange until the finished floor is installed. Many a toilet installation has been completed by using extra or over-sized wax rings...One inspector told me "The oversized wax rings are not code compliant and just by having a thicker wax surface you actually have a much greater risk of wax ring failure down the road." You are not the first to disagree with the installation...many plumbers and apprentices have been doing it your way for decades...many times they would prop up the toilet flange with wood shims or copper pipe, prior to tile, not really knowing what the finished floor height would ultimately be...so basically if the tile/flooring people did not put their flooring under the toilet flange lip...it would just be standing there with what support? I am just telling you...go check out this set-rite toilet flange website they even sell just the spacers.....since you are a remodeler you'll like the snap-in-half feature of the spacers...I have used them myself...nice touch.
Tom
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:06 AM   #18
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


Quote:
Originally Posted by how2do View Post
ProRemodel...
I researched this topic of correct height of the toilet flange extensively online and through some building inspectors and they all said code-wise the height of flange bottom lip needs to be at the finished floor height. Many inspectors will not even allow the plumbers to rough-in a toilet flange until the finished floor is installed. Many a toilet installation has been completed by using extra or over-sized wax rings...One inspector told me "The oversized wax rings are not code compliant and just by having a thicker wax surface you actually have a much greater risk of wax ring failure down the road." You are not the first to disagree with the installation...many plumbers and apprentices have been doing it your way for decades...many times they would prop up the toilet flange with wood shims or copper pipe, prior to tile, not really knowing what the finished floor height would ultimately be...so basically if the tile/flooring people did not put their flooring under the toilet flange lip...it would just be standing there with what support? I am just telling you...go check out this set-rite toilet flange website they even sell just the spacers.....since you are a remodeler you'll like the snap-in-half feature of the spacers...I have used them myself...nice touch.
Tom

Hey Tom,

I hope you do not mind me pointing out that you have been a member since 5-7-09 and you have made 4 post.... All 4 you have patched this company.

Toilet Flange Too High
Antique Toilet
Toilet Flange Height
ProRemodel... I researched this topic of...

Now some People come on here and pitch there company... I do not do that personally but, it is everyone's option. In fact... I have never Pitched my Company and if I supply a video it is usually one not even from my company but, a similar video. Now since you want to Pitch these Extenders so much let me ask you a few questions


1- How will buying a kit that provides spacers "Save time and money" compared to installing the flange on the Subfloor (Concrete board in Tile installations) and allowing the thickness of the flange to compensate for Linoleum Or as I do the washers that I use under the screws to raise it to the height of the tile? Please do a cost of your material... Mine is about $4.75.. My guess is you are between $25 and 30.

2- You state that it is against code- are you a Plumber? I have never failed an inspection because of the hieght of my flange ESPECIALLY when you consider that the wax ring is not crushed completely flat and will fill in any voids . That is was it is for.

3- What makes this any better that installing the flange as I described? either way the flange will not be sitting on the floor and the weight of the water closet is not carried on the flange so the added support is not a factor... So please explain the benefit.

4- This is directly from you-many times they would prop up the toilet flange with wood shims or copper pipe, prior to tile, not really knowing what the finished floor height would ultimately be...so basically if the tile/flooring people did not put their flooring under the toilet flange lip- I could be wrong here... BUT THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU SYSTEM DOES! The only difference is that instead of washers or a piece of pipe... you are wasting money on the spacer??? Please explain again how the $20 is less expensive and cheaper than the washers or the scrap 1 1/2 inch of pipe!

Last but not least if you have a vested interest in this company and you are just going to stop in to pitch it now and then... maybe you should let the posters all know
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:43 AM   #19
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


Hey Doc...
All valid points....
A) I do not have any vested interest in this company Set-Rite, although I did meet the owner in 2008 at a trade show in Atlanta.
B) Pitching?? There's no pitching in Plumbing...or was it crying or maybe sweating...I forget...I just like the product and I think it is great.
C) The Spacer alone is worth the price of the kit I use it to cut the perfect hole for the flange on a wood subfloor...then I screw the 3/4" spacer in place so the tile guy tiles right up to the spacer. On concrete floors I tapcon the spacer down until floor is finished. I like them and buy just the spacers by the box. Plus..I can let my workers use them and I don't have any headaches with too big a hole etc. BTW I am a general contractor.
C) I gather that money is more important to you and actually with your $4.75 my price for a 3/4" spacer is Less @ $4.50 with Free Shipping. If you buy the Extender Kit which is used for really low existing flanges then it does cost close to $30.00 with Shipping.
D) Code....I am just telling you what the code is now...they have changed it and that is not to say some inspectors are not going to enforce it...In the Northeast they are...and the code to not allow a flange to be installed prior to the installation of a finished floor was instituted because there were so many poorly or incorrectly mounted flanges and subsequent floor damage to homes.
E) Most of the plumbers I have met over the past 30 years all have done flange installations similar to the way you describe...being a builder I personally like good foundations...the spacers work for me over some left over copper pipe, wood shims or washers...even if nobody ever sees it I will ...in my dreams...

I usually spend more time golfing than forumng but until the weather breaks...my wife cannot wait!
You do it your way Doc and I'll do it mine...i am sure you wouldn't have it any other way...
Tom
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:27 AM   #20
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


Quote:
Originally Posted by how2do View Post
Hey Doc...
All valid points....
A) I do not have any vested interest in this company Set-Rite, although I did meet the owner in 2008 at a trade show in Atlanta.
B) Pitching?? There's no pitching in Plumbing...or was it crying or maybe sweating...I forget...I just like the product and I think it is great.
C) The Spacer alone is worth the price of the kit I use it to cut the perfect hole for the flange on a wood subfloor...then I screw the 3/4" spacer in place so the tile guy tiles right up to the spacer. On concrete floors I tapcon the spacer down until floor is finished. I like them and buy just the spacers by the box. Plus..I can let my workers use them and I don't have any headaches with too big a hole etc. BTW I am a general contractor.
C) I gather that money is more important to you and actually with your $4.75 my price for a 3/4" spacer is Less @ $4.50 with Free Shipping. If you buy the Extender Kit which is used for really low existing flanges then it does cost close to $30.00 with Shipping.
D) Code....I am just telling you what the code is now...they have changed it and that is not to say some inspectors are not going to enforce it...In the Northeast they are...and the code to not allow a flange to be installed prior to the installation of a finished floor was instituted because there were so many poorly or incorrectly mounted flanges and subsequent floor damage to homes.
E) Most of the plumbers I have met over the past 30 years all have done flange installations similar to the way you describe...being a builder I personally like good foundations...the spacers work for me over some left over copper pipe, wood shims or washers...even if nobody ever sees it I will ...in my dreams...

I usually spend more time golfing than forumng but until the weather breaks...my wife cannot wait!
You do it your way Doc and I'll do it mine...i am sure you wouldn't have it any other way...
Tom
A- Just Seems strange that 4 out of 5 post (Including this one) supported this product. Even stranger that a General contractor has never posted in any other area... Maybe it is just me
B- I support many products and i will provide information to different techniques... Most of which I support and use but, in 176 post... i can not remember supporting the same product in almost all of my post
C- Actually customer satisfaction comes first to me and that is part of the reason i support this forum. If I can share my knowledge with a customer to help them ... I do. If money was my concern then you would see my company logo on the side and I would pitch my company in my signature. I will also add I have ads on this site for my company. Now my $4.75 included all of my material including the flange And my set up allows me to make required adjustments as needed with the flange. only difference is you have a full circle when using this product. Only addition is the cost.
D- If you want to install the flange correctly then you need to actually install it so that the flange is installed but not glued till the tile is in place. The reason for that is you do not want to guess what the proper height of the tile will be. Then after the tile is installed you come back and adjust the height accordingly. Even with your method... you are guessing the height... The same thing you are saying it will avoid.... unless you buy the kit
E- You are correct... I will do it my way as a licensed plumber. I never tell a Builder how to frame... An Electrician how to run wire... or a cabinet maker the best wood to use... But again that is just me
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Old 01-31-2011, 02:32 AM   #21
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


I don't want to fuel this fire but if you read what I wrote I said NOT ON THE FINISHED FLOOR. I never said not making it flush tho. IF I do a new install yes I make it flush. If I am just upgrading without moving plumbing I just leave the closet were it is at and use a thicker wax ring. I have also not failed a inspection for my plumbing setups.
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Old 10-15-2011, 08:52 AM   #22
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


I liked it flush. Helped that basement underneath was unfinished.
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Old 10-15-2011, 12:47 PM   #23
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


Below is a link to a new video by the owner of Set-Rite when he was out at the National Hardware Show in May 2011. I believe this really supports my position on how a toilet flange is supposed to installed on top of the finished floor. just because many plumbers may or may not do it this way...in many municipalities in the Northeast the building inspectors are requiring that the toilet flange be installed 'after' the finished floor has been completely finished...

Here is the link to the video:

http://set-rite.com/video.html




Last edited by how2do; 10-15-2011 at 01:56 PM.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:18 PM   #24
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Toilet Flange Inside or Outside Drain Pipe?


Quote:
Originally Posted by how2do View Post
Below is a link to a new video by the owner of Set-Rite when he was out at the National Hardware Show in May 2011. I believe this really supports my position on how a toilet flange is supposed to installed on top of the finished floor. just because many plumbers may or may not do it this way...in many municipalities in the Northeast the building inspectors are requiring that the toilet flange be installed 'after' the finished floor has been completely finished...

Here is the link to the video:

http://set-rite.com/video.html



Just in case others are seeing this, there are people who say it should be over finished floor--many, many people. And many, many who say no.

As I may have mentioned in another bounced thread recently the new toilet I bought from Lowes absolutely will not fit over a flange that sits upon finished floor, PERIOD.

The spacing in that picture is huge--way, way more than my new toilet has. My new toilet when sitting on the tile has only a small space below it and if the flange is on top of tile the toilet would rock, and that's before any wax is applied at all.

Thus, in its case the flange has to be below. that isn't even a matter of opinion; for this particular toilet to work the flange must absolutely not sit above finished floor.

It can project a little above flush at the most. This is a jacuzzi toilet purchased in December, 2011. Any toilet will fit if the flange is flush but not all will fit if it's on finished floor.

If the toilet has lots of room like in the above pic, it will absolutely make sense to have flange on top of floor, to reduce chances of any leaks in the future, but they are not all built like that. I bet most aren't, in fact, but I have only seen the bottom of two


Last edited by Skoorb; 01-18-2012 at 01:20 PM.
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