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Old 01-20-2009, 09:01 AM   #16
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PEX vs. Copper


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I agree, to have so many holes near each other means that either they ALL chewed it at once, or you had a BAD leak for an extended period of time (flooding) or these creatures dont care about getting wet with HOT water and kept on chewing, which seems unlikely.

Are you sure someone isnt pranking you?
I'm sure I am not being pranked. I was standing in the bathroom with the plumber when he cut a hole in the wall. We both saw the PEX at the same time.

I believe the reason for multiple holes is that we had turned off the water at the sign of the first leak. It was about 48 hours before the plumber could get there and open the wall. Our assumption is that the rat(s) kept chewing into the PEX looking for water, since he (she?) had gotten water from it the first time.

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Old 01-20-2009, 09:11 AM   #17
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PEX vs. Copper


While I believe everyone is entitled to their thoughts and opinions about a product, don't let anyone tell you that PEX hasn't been around long enough to prove itself. PEX was introduced to the European market in 1972 by Wirsbo and has been in use in the states since the 80's.
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Old 01-20-2009, 09:37 AM   #18
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PEX vs. Copper


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I'm old school and never much for being on the cutting edge of the "latest and greatest" so I still use copper. Price hasn't changed much in the last few years after it rose so steeply, and around here its actually going back down slightly. Yes its probably more expensive, but I know what copper will do over time, for me PEX hasn't been around long enough to prove itself yet. The fittings are still what bug me about PEX, not the tubing itself.
Viega pex has been around since 1980 Just how long must a proven improvement be around for the old guys to accept it? And I am 59 and used it for 8 years now with no leaks or callbacks.
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Old 01-20-2009, 09:51 AM   #19
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PEX vs. Copper


Bob, I'm sure in the early 1900's there were people that refused to ride in cars because horses were better.
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Old 01-20-2009, 10:06 AM   #20
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PEX vs. Copper


I am not a plumber (and don't even play one on TV) and I am ambivalent about copper versus PEX for the industry. I am replacing it only because of the rat problem. I am actively working with a professional exterminator to get rid of the rats, and I believe I can get rid of them. However, I don't believe I can make the house completely rodent-proof, and therefore I would always worry about a new leak and major water damage to the house if it happens while we're gone for a few days.
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Old 01-20-2009, 12:24 PM   #21
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PEX vs. Copper


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I am not a plumber (and don't even play one on TV) and I am ambivalent about copper versus PEX for the industry. I am replacing it only because of the rat problem. I am actively working with a professional exterminator to get rid of the rats, and I believe I can get rid of them. However, I don't believe I can make the house completely rodent-proof, and therefore I would always worry about a new leak and major water damage to the house if it happens while we're gone for a few days.
Do you live near a lot of fast food restaurants?

Where's the source of the rats coming from?
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Old 01-20-2009, 12:47 PM   #22
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PEX vs. Copper


I am pretty sure if you put a copper tube in the way of a rat it can chew threw it. I have seen holes in other metals from rats. I have seen holes in flat sheet metal flashing harder to chew the copper? To prevent the possibility, Solid threaded pipe would be the best in a infested building.



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Originally Posted by moneymgmt View Post
I'm old school and never much for being on the cutting edge of the "latest and greatest" so I still use copper. Price hasn't changed much in the last few years after it rose so steeply, and around here its actually going back down slightly. Yes its probably more expensive, but I know what copper will do over time, for me PEX hasn't been around long enough to prove itself yet. The fittings are still what bug me about PEX, not the tubing itself.


I would think when copper (at one time "latest and greatest" ) was introduced to the industry there were most likely many were thinking that threaded pipe was the only way to go. And this soldered together stuff just won't do the job.
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Old 01-20-2009, 12:58 PM   #23
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Do you live near a lot of fast food restaurants?

Where's the source of the rats coming from?

we are not close to fast-food restaurants. Closest one is probably a mile or more away. We are in a regular housing sub-division, with extra large lots (1 acre or bigger). I have talked with 8 other people/families in this area (suburb of Dallas) and there has been a lot of rat problems over the last 6 months. EVERYONE I have talked with has had problems, either in the attic, the house, or the garage. Our rat exterminator has indicated that this is the worst he has ever seen it (in over 15 years). We have put out bait and set traps. I think we will get ahead of them.
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Old 01-20-2009, 07:49 PM   #24
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PEX vs. Copper


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Originally Posted by moneymgmt View Post
I'm old school and never much for being on the cutting edge of the "latest and greatest" so I still use copper. Price hasn't changed much in the last few years after it rose so steeply, and around here its actually going back down slightly. Yes its probably more expensive, but I know what copper will do over time, for me PEX hasn't been around long enough to prove itself yet. The fittings are still what bug me about PEX, not the tubing itself.
What about PEX fittings bugs you? Such a variety options exists, that I'm sure we could find one that suits your fancy. The ProPex expansion fittings from Wirsbo-Uponor seem pretty resilient to me. They also seem to restrict flow less because the ID of the fitting can match that of the tubing. Most of the pros who use PEX on a regular basis seem to favor the expansion approach. I believe that QPex (Zurn?) had a Chinese supplier provide brass fittings of inferior quality (excessive zinc?) that caused some major problems. I have several of those fittings in my shower, but they are soon to be replaced with ProPex.

On a different note, I believe peppermint oil or Shake Away in close proximity to the PEX might be good a deterrant to rodents if you can't eradicate them.
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Old 01-20-2009, 08:34 PM   #25
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we are not close to fast-food restaurants. Closest one is probably a mile or more away. We are in a regular housing sub-division, with extra large lots (1 acre or bigger). I have talked with 8 other people/families in this area (suburb of Dallas) and there has been a lot of rat problems over the last 6 months. EVERYONE I have talked with has had problems, either in the attic, the house, or the garage. Our rat exterminator has indicated that this is the worst he has ever seen it (in over 15 years). We have put out bait and set traps. I think we will get ahead of them.
You might want to get a cat then.
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Old 01-20-2009, 08:35 PM   #26
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PEX vs. Copper


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Originally Posted by MgMopar View Post
I am pretty sure if you put a copper tube in the way of a rat it can chew threw it. I have seen holes in other metals from rats. I have seen holes in flat sheet metal flashing harder to chew the copper? To prevent the possibility, Solid threaded pipe would be the best in a infested building.
Rats can chew through not only copper, but galvanized steel as well. As stated before, do whatever is needed to eradicate the rats. If needed, give them a better option, such as a water source outside next to a nice healthy bowl of rat poison. Of course not a good option if you have pets or children outside as well. But beware that they might probably return to their nest in the home to die... another problem altogether.
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Old 02-08-2010, 01:41 PM   #27
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Rats can chew through not only copper, but galvanized steel as well. As stated before, do whatever is needed to eradicate the rats. If needed, give them a better option, such as a water source outside next to a nice healthy bowl of rat poison. Of course not a good option if you have pets or children outside as well. But beware that they might probably return to their nest in the home to die... another problem altogether.
Most commercial rat poisons will cause them to dehydrate, minimizing any potential for bad odors. I know the thought of dead rats inside walls and in the attic is not pleasant, but if bones are all that's left, I could deal with it.

For those of you with a rat or mouse problem:

Rats don't just magically appear inside the walls, they have to have a way to get in. Check for holes in foundation vent screens and basement or crawl space access doors.

They can access the roof via tree limbs, vegetation on walls, or overhead electrical lines, and can get into the attic through small openings between roof tiles and shakes. (Composition shingle roofs are harder for them to get past)
If you limit the ways they can get in, you will solve the problem without having to use poison or traps.
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Old 02-11-2010, 11:24 AM   #28
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PEX vs. Copper


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Originally Posted by Brickkicker View Post
Most commercial rat poisons will cause them to dehydrate, minimizing any potential for bad odors. I know the thought of dead rats inside walls and in the attic is not pleasant, but if bones are all that's left, I could deal with it.

For those of you with a rat or mouse problem:

Rats don't just magically appear inside the walls, they have to have a way to get in. Check for holes in foundation vent screens and basement or crawl space access doors.

They can access the roof via tree limbs, vegetation on walls, or overhead electrical lines, and can get into the attic through small openings between roof tiles and shakes. (Composition shingle roofs are harder for them to get past)
If you limit the ways they can get in, you will solve the problem without having to use poison or traps.
I agree go into attic and crawlspace during midday and turn the lights off. Anywhere you see light is a possible path of entry. Not going to find all but I found a hole in my foundation behind foam insulation that way.

--Chris
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Old 02-12-2010, 08:10 AM   #29
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Something to think about...and I know its a bathroom. BUT, if you had two glasses of water in your fridge, and one was made of copper, and the other was plastic, what would you drink out of first?
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Old 02-12-2010, 08:39 AM   #30
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Something to think about...and I know its a bathroom. BUT, if you had two glasses of water in your fridge, and one was made of copper, and the other was plastic, what would you drink out of first?
For me it would be copper, becase it kills germs
After 2 years I think the OP has decided

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