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Old 01-26-2007, 12:44 AM   #1
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


Somone I know is having work done on their bathroom by a company and the contractor moved the drain and supply lines for the sink.

He ran the new drain pipe sort of creating a second trap. I think I remember reading somewhere that this was against code. I wanted to know if it was ok or not.



They're already going to call and demand that some real shoddy work he did on copper pipe be fixed by someone who knows what they're doing but should they say somthing about this drain pipe?

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Old 01-26-2007, 04:43 AM   #2
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


Not sure about the code, but It will be a constant source for stoppages

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Old 01-26-2007, 07:14 AM   #3
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


Totally against code. Tear it out, never let this person do that kind of work again.
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Old 01-26-2007, 07:49 AM   #4
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


Why was the pipe moved?

Is the new pipe connecting to the lower section of the main drain line or does it connect to the top section of the main drain?

The picture shows it to be at the bottom.
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Old 01-26-2007, 08:25 AM   #5
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


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Originally Posted by redline View Post
Why was the pipe moved?

Is the new pipe connecting to the lower section of the main drain line or does it connect to the top section of the main drain?

The picture shows it to be at the bottom.
The pipe was moved because the sink was moved. It does connect to the top of the main drain, I'm just kind of lousy with MS paint.

I know no one can say without a picture but what I think would have been the best option was to leave the yellow pipe where it drops down and goes the the right and run the vent down to the yellow pipe (at this point the red pipe could just be removed since nothing is draining into it). Their is a 2.5in galvanized pipe comming out of the stack capped off which was for an old kitchen and this drain happens to aling almost perfectly with it so I would think it could be easially run right into that pipe. This would eliminate the U shape and create somthing that looks like a set of two steps, the bottom platform being very short, just a 90 degree piece.

His copper job is even worse, instead of running a straight leangth then an elbow and a short leangth he stuck a bunch of pieces together with couplers without soldering, forced it into place so it would come out of the couplers at angles then soldered it. This made the hot and cold lines cross and they're putting a lot of pressure on one another. Additionally his sweats look lousy, burnt, and one of them leaks.


Thank you for the advice though, I will let them know. They're planning on moving, so I'd rather them find out now when they can more easially force these guys to do somthing about it than from a home inspector a couple years from now.

Arn't you supposed to be licensed to do this type of work, because the contractor certanly apears to have issued himself a plumbing and electrical license. Even if he isn't licensed and can get away with it by having a plumber on staff isn't the plumber supposed to inspect these jobs before signing off on them?

Last edited by Tmb9862; 01-26-2007 at 08:32 AM.
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Old 01-26-2007, 08:39 AM   #6
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


This is the direct result of anyone being able to purchase plumbing supplies. I bet there is a home center close by. Send that guy to McDonalds to flip burgers until he learns a skill.
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Old 01-26-2007, 08:48 AM   #7
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


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Originally Posted by Tmb9862 View Post
Arn't you supposed to be licensed to do this type of work, because the contractor certanly apears to have issued himself a plumbing and electrical license. Even if he isn't licensed and can get away with it by having a plumber on staff isn't the plumber supposed to inspect these jobs before signing off on them?
A plumbing inspector should be one to oversee that job.

Where do you live anyways?

Tell them to fire that contractor and get a well known contractor, or a plumber that runs his own business.

Document it all, take picture, notes, what was said, keep a good record.
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Old 01-26-2007, 10:09 AM   #8
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


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Originally Posted by Ron The Plumber View Post
A plumbing inspector should be one to oversee that job.

Where do you live anyways?

Tell them to fire that contractor and get a well known contractor, or a plumber that runs his own business.

Document it all, take picture, notes, what was said, keep a good record.
they live in Bayville, NY.
They can't really fire the contractor, they hired a big company and signed a contract which would probably be hard to get out of. It's almost done at this point, just some caulking, trim, and grout to go up yet.

I guess they can withhold the final payment until they send a licensed plumber there to fix it or inform the company they're hiring a plumber and taking the cost out of the total for that job. Unfortunatly the company probably has a lawyer on retainer or a collection agency for such instances. A couple threats to call the building inspector might do well too since I would assume they’d be in some kind of trouble for doing this work incorrectly and without a license. I really hope for them that it doesn't come down to taking these guys to court in order to get everything fixed properly because that rarely ends well (I know from my grandmother being scammed out of 350k by a contractor).

I looked at it today more thoroughly and saw the contractor there. I didn't say anything to him since it's not my house and I don't want to get in-between. Their are other non-plumbing issues which defiantly need to be addressed (for example the bottom of the plastic tub surround looks as if it were cut by a drunk guy with a chainsaw). What really gets me though is this guy’s attitude.
Homeowner to contractor: "The contract says three shelves in the tub, why are this only two?"
Contractor: "You think that contract means anything? The two shelf has been in the box in your dining room for two days now. You should have said something if their was a problem. We can't come back just to put another shelf in. If you have a problem call the office."

Or his comment to his helper about the toilet being un-level and the tank partially overlapping into the tub surround. "It's not our problem, it's the homeowner’s problem". Seems like a totally un-professional remark to make especially within earshot of the homeowner.

Last edited by Tmb9862; 01-26-2007 at 10:16 AM.
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Old 01-26-2007, 07:05 PM   #9
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


Time for them to get a permit and get inspections.
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Old 01-27-2007, 10:01 PM   #10
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


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they live in Bayville, NY.
They can't really fire the contractor, they hired a big company and signed a contract which would probably be hard to get out of. It's almost done at this point, just some caulking, trim, and grout to go up yet.

I guess they can withhold the final payment until they send a licensed plumber there to fix it or inform the company they're hiring a plumber and taking the cost out of the total for that job. Unfortunatly the company probably has a lawyer on retainer or a collection agency for such instances. A couple threats to call the building inspector might do well too since I would assume they’d be in some kind of trouble for doing this work incorrectly and without a license. I really hope for them that it doesn't come down to taking these guys to court in order to get everything fixed properly because that rarely ends well (I know from my grandmother being scammed out of 350k by a contractor).

I looked at it today more thoroughly and saw the contractor there. I didn't say anything to him since it's not my house and I don't want to get in-between. Their are other non-plumbing issues which defiantly need to be addressed (for example the bottom of the plastic tub surround looks as if it were cut by a drunk guy with a chainsaw). What really gets me though is this guy’s attitude.
Homeowner to contractor: "The contract says three shelves in the tub, why are this only two?"
Contractor: "You think that contract means anything? The two shelf has been in the box in your dining room for two days now. You should have said something if their was a problem. We can't come back just to put another shelf in. If you have a problem call the office."

Or his comment to his helper about the toilet being un-level and the tank partially overlapping into the tub surround. "It's not our problem, it's the homeowner’s problem". Seems like a totally un-professional remark to make especially within earshot of the homeowner.
If they "hired a big company an signed a contract" why isn't the job permitted. If it is, the plumbing inspector will solve the drain issue when he refuses the job (it is illegal). Sounds like the toilet will have clearance violations also. Unfortunatley, no inspectors can regulate poor asthetics and poor attitude, both of which seem to be plentiful here. Do not give final payment until work is satisfactory. Good luck. You will need it. If the guy tells you to call the office , that tells you there mindset at ethe office also.
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Old 01-27-2007, 10:39 PM   #11
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Is it ok/legal to run drain pipes like this? (sort of a 2nd trap)


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Originally Posted by troubleseeker View Post
If they "hired a big company an signed a contract" why isn't the job permitted. If it is, the plumbing inspector will solve the drain issue when he refuses the job (it is illegal). Sounds like the toilet will have clearance violations also. Unfortunatley, no inspectors can regulate poor asthetics and poor attitude, both of which seem to be plentiful here. Do not give final payment until work is satisfactory. Good luck. You will need it. If the guy tells you to call the office , that tells you there mindset at ethe office also.
Thanks for the advice.
They didn't get permits for the job because:
1. The homeowners didn't know you needed them
2. The company told them they didn't have to
Unfortunatly the contract says the homeowners are responsible for obtianing any permits. If they go get permits now will the inspector make them rip out the tub surround and walls so he can see the plumbing?

They did fix the copper pipes. The guy convinced them the drain was legal because of the length before going back up. Seems that's a load of B.S. because doing it the right way is a lot more work and he doesn't want to do it.

I think withholding payment and threatening to call the inspector will make them change their mind. Unfortunatly it's not my house and if they want to just live with it all I can do is give them advice.

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