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Old 01-18-2012, 11:17 AM   #1
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Hi guys,

I just bought that hot water recirculation pump
http://www.amazon.com/Watts-500800-P...rch_res_rtr_21

Water heater is located in the basement and it is usually takes very long to get hot water on the 2nd floor.

Since my gas water heater will be replaced next week, I planned to install the recirculation pump at the same time.

It seems to be a wonderful system even though I know it will cost me a little more on gas.

My plumber isn't aware of that product.
He is a little scared that hot water returns to the heater by the cold line.
(no return line)

He told me that it might be dangerous to drink that water since it stays in the water heater for some time.

He also told me it might cause "stomach aches" or even "colics".

Our daughter is 16 months and we drink water from the cold pipe.
There is also a line that goes to my samsung refrigerator, but in that case, there is a filter in the fridge.


Is he taking drugs or might his suspicions be founded ?

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Last edited by slingky; 01-18-2012 at 12:34 PM.
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Old 01-18-2012, 11:21 AM   #2
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


And how would it be any differant if the pump was not on there? You still would have water sitting in the tank.
I think he has no idea how it works and is just making things up.

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Old 01-18-2012, 11:25 AM   #3
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Maybe I did not explain correctly. English is not my primary language. :-(

I think he means that it is not recommanded to drink water from the hot pipe.

He says that if you cook, you may take hot water since you will boil it but it might be a problem if that water returned to cold pipe then you drink it.

For what I understand, it is the control valve at remote end of piping (bathroom 2nd floor in my case) that will trigger at 98 degrees F.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:02 PM   #4
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by slingky View Post
My plumber isn't aware of that product.
He is a little scared that hot water returns to the heater by the cold line.
(no return line)
Well, you *shouldn't* drink water from the hot tap.
It won't kill you, but...

If the circulator pump is done right... the COLD line isn't touched.
Show him some pictures.
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Last edited by TarheelTerp; 01-18-2012 at 01:04 PM.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:30 PM   #5
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post
Well, you *shouldn't* drink water from the hot tap.
It won't kill you, but...

If the circulator pump is done right... the COLD line isn't touched.
Show him some pictures.

In my case, there is no return line.

It is more like this:
http://www.affordablewaterheatersaz.com/pumps.html

You might take a look at the actual product I received today.
http://www.watts.com/pages/whatsnew/IHWRS.asp

Last edited by slingky; 01-18-2012 at 01:34 PM.
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Old 01-18-2012, 01:44 PM   #6
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


I wouldn't install that either---we call that 'cross over' --

it's done by mistake when a shower mixer is installed and the plumber forgets to turn the valve to the off possition after test plugs are installed in the shower head opening.

If you do that--you will never have cold water---only warm---

look for some reviews on that---sounds like a dumb idea---
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Old 01-18-2012, 02:05 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slingky View Post
In my case, there is no return line.
The "return line" is really an extension of the hot water manifold pipe that's running through the house (from that farthest fixture).

I don't like the idea shown in your example either.
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Old 01-18-2012, 02:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post
The "return line" is really an extension of the hot water manifold pipe that's running through the house (from that farthest fixture).

I don't like the idea shown in your example either.
Thanks guys for all your help, it is very appreciated.

I don't think I will run the return line cause it would emply new piping from the second floor to the basement. Pain in the ass ! :-(

I presume the end of the line is in the bathroom on the 2nd floor.
I will ask the plumber what they usually do cause it was done 12 years ago.

Since I need to replace my water heater, my other option is to put a tankless one but my searches on this forum point me to stay with a conventional 50gallon gas water heater. Am I wrong ?
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Old 01-18-2012, 03:02 PM   #9
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by slingky View Post
I presume the end of the line is in the bathroom on the 2nd floor.
Is that a full bathroom... with shower or tub that get used regularly?
Is the insufficient hot water noticed there alone?

Quote:
Since I need to replace my water heater, my other option is to put a tankless one but my searches on this forum point me to stay with a conventional... Am I wrong ?
Nope; you're not wrong.

The utility requirements (gas or electric) for a Tankless to work are at least as much of a cost and bother factor as the equipment costs are.

The question still remains of whether you need another 50gal or not...
or to maybe to use a small *additional* (regular electric) water heater on the second floor to meet the need there and with that in place being able to have a smaller unit downstairs.

Last edited by TarheelTerp; 01-18-2012 at 03:06 PM.
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Old 01-18-2012, 03:24 PM   #10
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post
Is that a full bathroom... with shower or tub that get used regularly?
this is the main one and the most used : shower + tub + sink + toilet

Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post
Is the insufficient hot water noticed there alone?
yes, only bathroom on 2nd floor.

there is a water room + kitchen on 1st floor
kitchen is the nearest from the water heater so hot water arrives fast.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post
The question still remains of whether you need another 50gal or not...
or to maybe to use a small *additional* (regular electric) water heater on the second floor to meet the need there and with that in place being able to have a smaller unit downstairs.
Ok, but I think it would cost more to add another electric one on 2nd floor.
Electricien, plumber. And mostly, not too much space for that !

I need to replace my current water heater.
It leaks, is 12 years old and I came to that conclusion after reviewing posts to my thread here:
Gas Water Heater : fix or replace ?
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Old 01-18-2012, 05:24 PM   #11
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by slingky View Post
Ok, but I think it would cost more to add another electric one on 2nd floor.
Electricien, plumber. And mostly, not too much space for that !
no solution is perfect ... all choices have costs.

you shouldn't need to have more than a 20Amp circuit up there...
perhaps even 120; and the plumbing will be isolated the immediate area.

get it priced out if you can't DIY
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Old 01-18-2012, 06:24 PM   #12
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


I have installed 7 or 8 of those units here in Florida, I didn’t care too much for them but the customers love them. No one has complained to date, it has a timer on it so you set it at the peak shower use time then it shuts down. Takes a little adjusting on the mixing bridge to get it working just right, but it’s not a bad deal if you don’t have the third line.
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Old 01-18-2012, 07:13 PM   #13
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


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Originally Posted by Javiles View Post
I have installed 7 or 8 of those units here in Florida, I didnít care too much for them but the customers love them. No one has complained to date, it has a timer on it so you set it at the peak shower use time then it shuts down. Takes a little adjusting on the mixing bridge to get it working just right, but itís not a bad deal if you donít have the third line.
I've installed them too - an economical retro pump. I've also installed a similar pump that ties across the angle stops at a remote fixture such as a lav near the end of the run, works good. Having cold water at the faucet is not a problem
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Old 01-20-2012, 03:07 PM   #14
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Hot Water Recirculation Pump, can it be dangerous ?


Your best solution is to go with an "on-demand" recirculation pump, such as the Metlund D'MAND system. This pump activates only when you are actually using hot water and then will shut off based on a 6 degree temp rise, so that you get hot water quickly but you don't have hot water crossing over into your cold water line. It's also the only pump that you can use with a tankless water heater that won't completely void the 15-year warranty of the heat exchanger, which tend to fail quickly when you circulating hot water through it excessively. I've had one in my house for the past 8 years and it works like a champ.
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Old 01-20-2012, 07:20 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdayala View Post
Your best solution is to go with an "on-demand" recirculation pump, such as the Metlund D'MAND system. This pump activates only when you are actually using hot water and then will shut off based on a 6 degree temp rise, so that you get hot water quickly but you don't have hot water crossing over into your cold water line. It's also the only pump that you can use with a tankless water heater that won't completely void the 15-year warranty of the heat exchanger, which tend to fail quickly when you circulating hot water through it excessively. I've had one in my house for the past 8 years and it works like a champ.
Thanks but if you take a look at this diagram, you will see that the system still use the cold water line as a "return line" if you don't have one like me.


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