HELP :) 4" Sewer Line/broken Collar / Insert 3" ?? - Plumbing - DIY Home Improvement | DIYChatroom


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Old 12-26-2009, 07:24 PM   #1
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HELP :) 4" sewer line/broken collar / Insert 3" ??


Hi All,

Just as the sewer line, which remains under backflow pressure, leaves our concrete septic vault (lift station more or less), about half of the female collar on 4 inch sewer line has broken away. As this line does remain under pressure as the fluid is pumped upwards, the entire contents of the line is running back into the vault. What I would like to do is convert to 3" schedule 40 pvc. I have thought about sliding the 3" inside the 4" sewer line and using either an epoxy or some other filller to finalize a pressure resililient connections. We are in the Dead of winter here and will continue to be so for months.

So, need something I can do from inside the vault rather than attempting to pound through frozen tundra.. I don't know if a doulbe dose of some kind of donut would overcome the pressure in the system or not..If there's a superadhesive/filler for such things that might work too?

thanks for all your constructive feedback.

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Old 12-28-2009, 01:41 AM   #2
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HELP :) 4" sewer line/broken collar / Insert 3" ??


How do you know that the collar is broken? Did you camera it?

Do you know why the collar has broken? There is no reason to try to fix the collar without fixing the reason that the collar broke. Was the soil that is under the pipe after the collar not compacted properly? If the soil gave way, then it will give way again.

I don't understand how you are going to try to slip a 3" pipe (with some kind of epoxy) into a 4" pipe (and seal it). If you are going to try to do this through the broken fitting (and through the leaking effluent) how are you going to keep the other end (first part of pipe through the effluent) clean?

How are you planning on sealing the other end of the pipe?

You might want to go with sleeving the pipe from the inside, but that is done by the pro's

or...
Dig. Rent a hammer drill with spade bit or an electric jack hammer and do it right.

Don't forget - it you have obstructions inside the pipe, things will hang up, slow the flow and clog. A 3" pipe inside of a smooth bore 4" pipe will cause an obstruction over time.

Mick

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Old 12-28-2009, 07:19 PM   #3
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HELP :) 4" sewer line/broken collar / Insert 3" ??


Mick, good questions, hopefully i have provided more clarification that will result in a better understanding and more suggetions. See my replies in blue..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Water Guy View Post
How do you know that the collar is broken? Did you camera it? the collar is broken about 12" from the inside wall of the septic vault.

Do you know why the collar has broken? The collar was broken by the the last "professional" I hired and paid $400 ... I watched him reef on the 4 inch that was connected too it while attempting to connect two pieces of pipe where he should have used a slip joint or fernco boot.. There is no reason to try to fix the collar without fixing the reason that the collar broke. Was the soil that is under the pipe after the collar not compacted properly? If the soil gave way, then it will give way again. Nothing to do with the soil....

I don't understand how you are going to try to slip a 3" pipe (with some kind of epoxy) into a 4" pipe (and seal it). If you are going to try to do this through the broken fitting (and through the leaking effluent) how are you going to keep the other end (first part of pipe through the effluent) clean? I'm working from inside the septic vault.... Thankfully there is not steady pressure or effluent flow back down into the vault of this would be nearly impossilbe. there is no flow once the line is disconnected and the effluent that would normally be resting in the sewer pipe, between the septic vault and the main line, has drained out into the septic vault. So, the line is dry where I am working.... This isn't my first rodeo, just looking for some creative ideas that will get me thru until the -30 degree weather passes in a month or two.

How are you planning on sealing the other end of the pipe? Not an issue that I can see. I think there may be some misunderstanding as this is an odd situation..

You might want to go with sleeving the pipe from the inside, but that is done by the pro's I believe this is the process I would like to pursue temporarily. If you have some suggestions on how I might move this forward without investing more money with the only plumber is a 300 mile radius, who is the same one that caused the problem, I would appreciate it.

or...
Dig. Rent a hammer drill with spade bit or an electric jack hammer and do it right.

Don't forget - it you have obstructions inside the pipe, things will hang up, slow the flow and clog. A 3" pipe inside of a smooth bore 4" pipe will cause an obstruction over time. Once again, to clarify, I would be going from a pump with two inch output, to a three inch schedule 40, which I intend to then slide inside and attact to the broken end of the 4" sewer line. I don't see a potential for clog as the flow continues to pass from smaller to larger line as it progresses, I could be mistaken. Mick,Thanks for your thoughtful suggestions that do not involve attacking this from the outside...

Mick
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Old 12-29-2009, 03:06 AM   #4
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HELP :) 4" sewer line/broken collar / Insert 3" ??


Do you know why the collar has broken? The collar was broken by the the last "professional" I hired and paid $400 ... I watched him reef on the 4 inch that was connected too it while attempting to connect two pieces of pipe where he should have used a slip joint or fernco boot.. Holy Crap! I guess that there is now no way for him to repair his screw up is there? If I break something, I fix it on my dime. Is this guy an actual liscensed plumber?

I don't understand how you are going to try to slip a 3" pipe (with some kind of epoxy) into a 4" pipe (and seal it). If you are going to try to do this through the broken fitting (and through the leaking effluent) how are you going to keep the other end (first part of pipe through the effluent) clean? I'm working from inside the septic vault.... Thankfully there is not steady pressure or effluent flow back down into the vault of this would be nearly impossilbe. there is no flow once the line is disconnected and the effluent that would normally be resting in the sewer pipe, between the septic vault and the main line, has drained out into the septic vault. So, the line is dry where I am working.... This isn't my first rodeo, just looking for some creative ideas that will get me thru until the -30 degree weather passes in a month or two.
Is the collar cracked or shattered? Pics would really help. Did you or is it posssible to contact a septic contractor in your area? -not the 'plumber'


You might want to go with sleeving the pipe from the inside, but that is done by the pro's I believe this is the process I would like to pursue temporarily. If you have some suggestions on how I might move this forward without investing more money with the only plumber is a 300 mile radius, who is the same one that caused the problem, I would appreciate it.
The 'sleeving process' involves inserting an epoxy impregnated 'sleeve' (that is wrapped around an uninflated tube) into the broken pipe section. When in position the tube is pressurized (inflated) and the sleeve expands to coat and bond to the inner pipe wall to complete the repair.

or...
It might be possible - depending on the shape of the break - to cut a piece of pipe in half, lengthwise and clamp/glue it over the break for a temperary repair.

need pictures.

Mick
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