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Old 07-19-2013, 02:48 PM   #1
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Heated Water line


Hi Guys

I have a well about 100ft from my cottage, we just had a full foundation poured for the cottage, so, I will be relocating the water pump, pressure tank, etc. inside the cottage basement from the pump house where it was previously, where we used to draw water directly from the river

The water line from the well will be buried, but, we can only get down about 12" and then you hit solid rock, so, the line needs to be buried.

Can you guys offer opinions and suggestions on which heating system is best? There are several different styles, some heat the whole pipe, some don't, some are built into the pipe, others retrofit, thoughts??

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Old 07-19-2013, 03:10 PM   #2
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Look how they do it in Alaska.. Some areas use a steam coil around the piping, others heat tape, drpendin on how long the run is.

Basically it is pipe within a pipe for the steam or hot water circ coil to keep it from freezing.

BYW, does help to state also where you are in the post, since those of us using mobile devices cannot see it in the profile when you post.

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Old 07-19-2013, 03:17 PM   #3
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Heated Water line


I am located in Ontario,Canada, in the 1000 Islands, about 20mins North of NY State.

Climate is similar to Upstate NY, Michigan or Wisconsin, in other word winters DO get chilly! )-:

Appreciate the input, please keep it coming!

Ps: my length of heated pipe is about 100ft.
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Old 07-19-2013, 03:30 PM   #4
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Heated Water line


I should have mentioned, because its a cottage, we DON'T leave the water on year round. We plan on turning it on while we are there in the winter, then drain the system when we leave, so, the heated line will only be "on" while we are using the cottage.probably for a week or so at a time, and a few weekends if snowmobiling.

Eventually this will be a year round residence, but, I have a few years until retirement yet! )-:
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Old 07-19-2013, 03:57 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n2omichael
I am located in Ontario,Canada, in the 1000 Islands, about 20mins North of NY State.

Climate is similar to Upstate NY, Michigan or Wisconsin, in other word winters DO get chilly! )-:

Appreciate the input, please keep it coming!

Ps: my length of heated pipe is about 100ft.
Just next door to my brother, who retired from the Army in Depauville, Ny. Nice area up there.

I know what you are talking about with the bedrock. You almost have to find someone with a drilling machine to break up the stone, so you can get drep enough, or bring in a lot of fill to get the proper depth.

I would try running a under ground rated heat tape alongside it, see how that works first.
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Old 07-19-2013, 04:00 PM   #6
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Most of the plumbers are working at this time of day---have you asked this question of your well digger?

Because the well has a back flow device---draining the water line will require an air inlet at the well head---so ask them about installing a yard hydrant or hose bib out at the well so you can blow out the line---

A plumber will be along soon---Mike-----
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Old 07-19-2013, 04:14 PM   #7
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Thanks Guys!


It is a nice area, we are on Wolfe Island, due North of Millen Bay. Was your brother stationed at Fort Drum?

The well was drilled a few years ago by our neighbour, we drilled the well on the property line under the agreement that, when ready, we could hook into it (we split the cost 50/50)

I had planned to install an electric SS solenoid or mechanical valve on the well line,in the well that I could "open" to drain the water line

I have a small Shrader valve on the inlet line of my toilet that I adapted to hook a compressor to so I can open all the taps and blow out all the lines using the compressor, that just leaves the well line.

Thanks Guys!
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Old 07-19-2013, 06:17 PM   #8
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Yea he was. He decided to go back for his last three years in, so he could make 1st Sgt, before retiring.

Now just spends time working on his car and house, when not doing his job as head Malware advisor for a major software Anti-Virus co.

His wife and son work at the market up the road in Clayton.

I would have to ask him about well co's up there. He does most maint. on his system, so he may not know of a particular co.. I know that where his well is, it is almost next to the house, and they almost have 36-48" of soil, before you hit the Limestone in that part of the yard.
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Old 07-19-2013, 06:36 PM   #9
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Wow! Sounds like he has done well! Good for him, that is a huge base!

Parts of our lawn have 30-40" of dirt, others have less than 12" of dirt, then, as you mentioned its solid limestone, no wonder the locals call the Island "The Rock" LOL

I am just sniffing around to see the most practical and easiest way to heat my line and to drain it when we leave in the winter, I have done some plumbing before, but, the heat line and well are new to me. At the cottage we have always drawn from the river directly and anywhere else I worked on had "city" water
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Old 07-19-2013, 07:05 PM   #10
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Electric heat cable is going to be the easiest --I do not know one brand from another or the cost--but I have used a lot of it to heat piping for chocolate---I liked the suggestion of an outer pipe to protect the waterline and electric heat wire.

This should allow you to pull in new heat cable if the existing one fails---add a pull string just in case-----
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Old 07-21-2013, 10:12 AM   #11
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What I'd do.

Outer shell of PVC pipe large enough to hold the water line, insulation and self regulating heat tape (rated for this use).

For the water line I'd use a potable water rated PEX tubing. One that specifically states it can withstand freezing without damage. Make sure you use that manufacturer's fittings only, because they also will carry the same freeze resistant rating.

If possible make sure you slope the water line the same as you would a sewer line, back to the well at about 1/8" per foot at least.

As for the schrader valve to blow out the lines. They don't allow for much volume to pass through them. Volume of air is what is going to move water efficiently enough to make sure enough has been expelled to not recollect in low spots in sufficient quantities to cause freeze damage. Maybe a hose bib and make up an air hose connection and get yourself a pressure rated air tank large enough so you can sustain air volume long enough to clear your longest line.

Just some thoughts.
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Old 11-01-2013, 02:57 PM   #12
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Heated Water line


Great idea!

I just had the trench from the cottage to well dug, got Down 3 feet! Which was an added bonus, I am getting some rigid foam now to line the trench with (I did the same with the Big O I used for weepers) to help prevent freezing.

Plan to cut the foam in 1 foot widths and then sandwich the ABS pipe between it, running the water pipe and power lines thru them then back filling with dirt.

I am hoping that getting down 3 feet instead of the 12" I figured I would have should make heating the lines to prevent freezing MUCH easier and cheaper.

Any other thoughts or input would be appreciated!

Thanks guys!

Michael
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Old 11-01-2013, 03:25 PM   #13
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Heated Water line


Good luck Michael - sounds like you have it under control. I'm originally from Kingston, spent a lot of time (years ago) sailing in the west Wolfe Island/Horseshoe Island area (out of Collins Bay). We just recently moved to our renovated cottage in the Perth/Lanark area.
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Old 11-01-2013, 08:45 PM   #14
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Where I work here in BC.... when we don't have the depth, we use the pink rigid polystyrene. The old timer tells me that 2" of the insulation equals 1' of fill.
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Old 11-02-2013, 01:46 PM   #15
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Heated Water line


Thanks Orange and Burnt, I appreciate the input!!

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