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Old 03-18-2011, 09:10 AM   #16
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If you place the vice grips 90 degrees to the long axis of the stem (teeth of vice grips mate with grooves of stem) then try tapping outwards on the vice grip with a hammer it might jar it loose.

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Old 03-18-2011, 12:37 PM   #17
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Thanks, yes I did try that (gripping the stem at 90deg with the visegrips trying to get the grooves in the visegrip to align with the flutes in the stem) previously. The stem is not THAT long, of course so there's not much room to "swing" the hammer between the visegrips and the wall. I also tugged at the clamped visegrips with a slide hammer.
Wouldn't budge. The vise grips just started sliding and gouging up the brass stem.
I admit that I need to return and try this again with a better pair of visegrips, the grooves on the jaws of the pair I used were a little chewed up to start with.
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Old 03-18-2011, 01:38 PM   #18
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Ok, get the shortest black pipe nipple you can find and two pipe caps. Drill a hole in each cap large enough for the valve stem to pass thru. Screw one cap on each end. One cap will protect the valve body. Clamp the vise grips on the stem. Clamp and lock as tight as you can. It shouldn't matter if you scar the stem a little. Hold the pipe nipple with one pair pliers and unscrew the cap with another. You could eliminate one cap if the pipe it self is the same diameter as the valve body. It only protects the threads of the valve body.

On the theory that it is swollen O rings or washers that is preventing removal of the valve stem, you could try heating the inside of the valve body with a torch but I would try the pipe nipple first. Heat until the washers are softened.

Last edited by hkstroud; 03-18-2011 at 01:49 PM.
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Old 03-19-2011, 04:47 PM   #19
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hmm... that's another good idea. A really good idea.
It's gonna be a couple - three weeks or more before I can get around to trying this -
but I will certainly post an update here with the results.
Thanks!
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:30 AM   #20
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I have the same problem


Did anyone that posted here get the Harden diverter valve removed?

I have the same diverter valve for my shower as pictured, but have not been able to remove it so far.

Thanks!
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:35 AM   #21
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If it has O ring seals and pulls out, momentarily turn the water supply back on for 60#? psi pressure assist.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:58 AM   #22
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I'm pretty sure it's a Harden diverter. It looks like the pictures in this thread, and also pictures in this thread at terrylove.com. (I can't post the link, even though I have one post will try posting link below.)

Which means it has three o-rings, you can see the removed diverter with o-rings in post #10 in the link I posted right below this post.

Other pictures make the diverter look identical to pictures posted in this thread, and mine looks identical to pictures both in this thread, and the link I posted below.

Thanks.

Last edited by ride525; 03-10-2016 at 10:01 AM.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:59 AM   #23
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Here is link``


Picture of diverter removed are at post #10 here:

http://terrylove.com/forums/index.ph...iverter.45716/
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Old 03-10-2016, 01:56 PM   #24
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@ride525
yes I was able to remove my stuck Harden diverter stem back in 2011 using a variant of the very clever technique described above by hkstroud.

one key was using a good quality vise grips (plural) - i.e. my first attempts failed as the locking pliers slipped along the splined stem. I later obtained new visegrips with better (newer, sharper, not so chewed up) teeth. I also DOUBLED UP the visegrips - clamping two visegrips next to each other on the shaft.

After removal - I replaced the orings, and lubed and reassembled. The owner was instructed to operate the diverter valve at least once per week. No problems so far.

My stem was short , so I only used a quite short section of threaded pipe and one pipe cap, the unthreaded pipe end just resting against the valve body IIRC. I was not able to get heat on this valve safely and did not use heat.

PM me for more details if you wish
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Old 03-12-2016, 09:19 AM   #25
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Can't PM until 15 posts


Hi hauch, (can't PM you until I have 15 posts.)

Thanks for posting. I would appreciate any details you have on what worked, or what did not work on removal of the Harden diverter.

I've tried sqirting WD40 into where the round diverter and body meet, but I think it does not go in very far.

Also, I've tried (with pretty new and unsused vise grips) outside the "nut" that holds the diverter in place. But the Vise Grips just slip, even though they are clamped down pretty hard. Even with two pairs of vice grips. Not sure how the pipe/nipple trick would work different than just with the vise grips.

Next to try,
1. Put some notches in the stem, so the vise grips don't slip.
2. Or applying some heat, hard to get heat from the front, but the back goes to a closet, so should fairly easily be able to apply heat from the back by making a neat hole in the drywall.
3. Maybe even try three vise grips?

Thanks for any help, and suggestions.

Jef
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Old 03-13-2016, 11:24 PM   #26
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Re: Harden faucet stem removal


@ride525

Harden diverter stem removal using hkstroud's suggested puller:

Ok - I have placed pics and comments in the captions in an album in my account album, I guess. Click on "View hauch's album" Let me know if folks have access to this.

Unfortunately the pics got placed in the album in reverse order and I can't see a simple way to change the order in the album - it's pretty obvious -just start with the last pic #13 , and hit "prev" instead of "next"...

IF you are suggesting that you placed the visegrips next to the bonnet nut - and then tried to force outward by unthreading the bonnet net - well then you're right that, in theory, would work as well - but as you will see, my valve assembly laid well behind the finished stone tile surface and I did not have access to place the visegrips against the bonnet nut in their proper perpendicular orientation; even using some sort of spacer, there would not be enough access to turn the bonnet nut with force while such visegrips were in place.

1. I don't see how notches would help - and you certainly don't want to cobber up the flutes on the end of the stem that fits into the handle.

2. I don't think heat is the answer as the problem is orings - not the usual seized metal on metal threads that can sometimes be unloosed by the differential expansion of heating. I did not have access to the backside of the valve (old home lathe plaster finished wall etc. - If I did have access then I would have just cut the whole valve out and plumbed in a new, modern, safety shower valve.

3. sure - if you have room clamp away.

Feel free to ask for clarifications. I can provide higher resolution pics directly if you provide an e-addr.

Good luck!!
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Old 03-14-2016, 03:31 AM   #27
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Re: Harden faucet stem removal


Quote:
Originally Posted by hauch View Post
@ride525

1. I don't see how notches would help - and you certainly don't want to cobber up the flutes on the end of the stem that fits into the handle.

2. I don't think heat is the answer as the problem is orings - not the usual seized metal on metal threads that can sometimes be unloosed by the differential expansion of heating. I did not have access to the backside of the valve (old home lathe plaster finished wall etc. - If I did have access then I would have just cut the whole valve out and plumbed in a new, modern, safety shower valve.

Feel free to ask for clarifications. I can provide higher resolution pics directly if you provide an e-addr.

Good luck!!
Thanks for your pictures and reply.
1. I would cut some small notches in the stem, so the vise grips don't slip. My stem is longer than yours, so I can make notches without affecting the handle fit.

2. I thought if I heated up the body around the o-rings, it might expand just a bit, and allow easier removal.

Thanks again.

Jeff
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Old 03-14-2016, 11:54 AM   #28
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Re: Harden faucet stem removal


notches - yeah I thought about that too. If you've got room I suppose you could cut a slot that fits the width of the jaw of the visegrips. The material of the stem is not that strong. If you cut a shallow slot through just the splines and then use the visegrips to push against the cut face of the splines- it might - but that's not a lot of material -I think you're more likely to have material failure there.
IF you cut deeper slots into the core of the stem diameter - then of course, at some point, you start compromising the structural integrity of the stem - it may not support the torque of turning the valve during operation in the future (especially if it stiffens up again - mine was frozen solid when I started) When I looked I only found one supplier for that stem and it was > $100 and I didn't want to have to replace it.

as a DIYer I do not have the aversion to cheap tools that others have. I picked up several locking pliers at my local Harbor Freight store for < $10 total. - found ones whose teeth fit the splines well (i.e. lots of contact area) - and then set and clamped that sucker tighter than I've ever visegripped anything in my life.

heat - yeah I gave a few half hearted tries with heat and then gave up quickly. Because of the confined space the only heat I could bring was a butane pencil torch - locally very hot, but not a large quantity of heat in total. Look at the size of the cartridge end of the stem - then think about how large the valve body is. That's a lot of thermal mass to heat up, and it would have to stay hot during the pulling process. I also had concerns about safety (insulation, old wood framing) and - although really unlikely, I also didn't want to risk weakening any of the four solder joints from the valve to the supply and delivery pipes - (that would result in a leak in the walls above a finished space, a big disaster.) Actually this concern is another reason to use the puller device - you're not putting any stress whatsoever on those old solder joints.
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Old 03-14-2016, 01:40 PM   #29
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Re: Harden faucet stem removal


Consider using a tubing flare tool clamp on the stem. They're made not to slip.

Excuse the pic as it is of a drill guide for boring 90 holes with a portable drill and the only pic I had at the moment.
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Old 03-14-2016, 01:57 PM   #30
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Re: Harden faucet stem removal


Thanks again for your reply.

I've found a couple of suppliers online that sell the diverter for about $60.

This project started when the Hot side valve sort of froze up, and I broke the ceramic disks, which course let hot water flow like crazy out the tub spout. Had to turn things off at front of house, since I could not at first turn off the water at the water heater.

Senior Sitizen, could you explain more about how the "tubing flare tool clamp" could be used, what it is, and how it could be used in this instance. I'm just not familar with it.

Thanks,

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