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Old 11-09-2009, 07:05 PM   #1
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A few quick questions...


We are adding a bathroom to an unfinished 3rd floor. Our builder roughed in everything and ran all the supplies and drains. I had to frame out a new wall (18") for a vanity because of head clearance. My question is 3 parts;

1. Which wall should I insulate... the existing back wall or my new wall?

2. The pex supplies and subsequent cpvc piping to bring the supplies to the new wall should be insulated, correct? If i do insulate just my wall then the pipes will be in unconditioned space. If so, the black self-sealing pipe insulation from the bix box store should be sufficient, yes!?

3. I am running sharkbite to cpvc off the copper stub outs to bring the plumbing up to the new wall. the cpvc is rather flimsy (but obviously strong) and I am wondering after it's roughed in should i worry about protecting the supplies since i don't know how rough the drywallers will be?
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Old 11-09-2009, 09:10 PM   #2
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A few quick questions...


Well, I'd insulate behind the pipes myself. Always a good idea to run pipeing in conditioned space when ever possible. Pex to copper to cpvc seems clumsy to me. Why not simply sweat extentions to your existing copper stubs? I'd not be comfortable closing Sharkbites in a wall cavity.
One other problem I see is that horizonal vent line that disappears out of site to the right in the picture. This needs to be higher than the flood level of your basin. It's hard to judge elevation in your picture but it looks close to being too low. Too easy to do it right here than to take a chance. Good luck with it.

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Old 11-09-2009, 11:40 PM   #3
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A few quick questions...


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Originally Posted by LeakyMike View Post
Well, I'd insulate behind the pipes myself. Always a good idea to run pipeing in conditioned space when ever possible. Pex to copper to cpvc seems clumsy to me. Why not simply sweat extentions to your existing copper stubs? I'd not be comfortable closing Sharkbites in a wall cavity.
One other problem I see is that horizonal vent line that disappears out of site to the right in the picture. This needs to be higher than the flood level of your basin. It's hard to judge elevation in your picture but it looks close to being too low. Too easy to do it right here than to take a chance. Good luck with it.
Thanks for your response...

First, about the horizontal vent. From what point of the vent do I need to measure? Meaning, is the hight of the vent pipe from the floor to the bottom of the horizontal piece, the top, or where the 90deg bend starts?

From the floor to the BOTTOM of the horizontal piece is 39". The vanity (with basin) is a total of 34" high so I assume that would be fine.

Also, the vent you see connects to the "main" vertical one about 1ft beyond what you can see in the picture and that leads out the roof. The builder put this drain/vent in for us so I assume that it would've passed code then.

Second, about DIY plumbing. I have researched my options with this bath for quite sometime now. The reason I didn't choose copper was that I've had limited experience with sweating pipe and the tools/material are expensive. With such few connections here, CPVC proved itself as a better option in this case.

And I know there is much of a religious debate when it comes to the sharkbite fittings. I don't know if it's old-school plumbers turning their noses up to an alternative that makes their job look easy. But, if they are designed, rated and tested for these types of applications then they obviously perform up to those standards. I would be more inclined to trust the sharkbite than my skills at sweating the copper.

Third, about the insulation. So you would keep the insulation as you see it? (obviously need to replace around the vent)? The dead space there would obviously be unconditioned, so using the pipe insulation there would suffice?
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Old 11-11-2009, 09:25 PM   #4
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A few quick questions...


If that horizonal vent line is 5" higher than the vanity it will perform without issue although it MAY not meet code. If sweating copper is out I'd do this. They do make drop eared eLL's in Sharkbite I believe or Vangard makes them in Plastic. Either way I'd take out what is there and replace them with these. That way the connections would at least be mounted ridgidly. Then inside the studs of the wall where the hot/cold stubs come out, I'd install a 1x nailer and either drill holes to carry the pipes through it or use as a place to install plastic pipe hangers before they come through the drywall. I do NOT like pipes that move around much and I'm sure the Sharbites will too. The pipes inside of the insulation won't need to be wrapped but if it makes you feel better go ahead. It's cheap to do and will keep the "sweat" from the cold pipe off the sub floor.
Good luck.

Remember to thoughly deburr the pipe ends inside and out BEFORE inserting them in the Sharkbites. You cut that little "O" ring in there and you'll certainly have a leaker. In plumbing the details are essential.
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Old 11-12-2009, 12:36 AM   #5
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A few quick questions...


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Originally Posted by LeakyMike View Post
If that horizonal vent line is 5" higher than the vanity it will perform without issue although it MAY not meet code. If sweating copper is out I'd do this. They do make drop eared eLL's in Sharkbite I believe or Vangard makes them in Plastic. Either way I'd take out what is there and replace them with these. That way the connections would at least be mounted ridgidly. Then inside the studs of the wall where the hot/cold stubs come out, I'd install a 1x nailer and either drill holes to carry the pipes through it or use as a place to install plastic pipe hangers before they come through the drywall. I do NOT like pipes that move around much and I'm sure the Sharbites will too. The pipes inside of the insulation won't need to be wrapped but if it makes you feel better go ahead. It's cheap to do and will keep the "sweat" from the cold pipe off the sub floor.
Good luck.

Remember to thoughly deburr the pipe ends inside and out BEFORE inserting them in the Sharkbites. You cut that little "O" ring in there and you'll certainly have a leaker. In plumbing the details are essential.
I have enclosed a picture of what I've completed...

With the copper I cut cleanly with a tube cutter, de-burred and cleaned the 15/16" that was placed inside the sharkbite with emery cloth so it had a good "bite" on clean pipe. Same way with the CPVC, cut cleanly and de-burred.

I put the 2x blocking there to keep the pipes rigid. There is still a fair bit amount of up-and-down play so i may add another 2x flat and brace the CPVC to it.

Also, I think I'm going to insulate the pipes. $4 and 2 minutes of my time, no sweat (pun intended).

I also included a picture of the shower assembly that I also finished. The CPVC was messy to work with because of the glue but man does that stuff hold tight and set fast!

All-in-all went pretty well. I might go ahead and heighten that vent pipe another 4" (thats as high as i can go) while its easy and accessible. Can't hurt, right?!

While I'm at it, I also included a picture of the shower drain and p-trap. I put a sweeping elbow to connect to drain that the plumber stubbed out for me. Look good!? I got a little messy with the primer
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Old 11-13-2009, 06:39 PM   #6
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A few quick questions...


All looks good except one thing. Looks like you used a removable trap ell in a place where you'll never have access to once the tub is in. Should use a all cement type instead. These fittings can and do loosen over time.
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Old 11-14-2009, 12:06 AM   #7
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A few quick questions...


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All looks good except one thing. Looks like you used a removable trap ell in a place where you'll never have access to once the tub is in. Should use a all cement type instead. These fittings can and do loosen over time.
Dope... Thanks, will replace that with a permanent one. Can't believe I didn't think about that.

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