Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Plumbing

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-02-2011, 12:41 PM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Share |
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


Hello,
Okay here goes:

I have a septic pipe that will be run approx. 18" underground for about 35'
And it gets cold here....really cold. Like -40 cold.
Heat tape can't be used because we simply do not have that much power.
There is no option to run it below the frost line. (about 4-5 feet or more, but it doesn't matter as this is not an option)

I was thinking about two options:

1. Centre the 4" pipe inside a larger pipe and fill the void with insulation...spray foam...I don't know...throw me some ideas.

2. Run a length of flexible tubing along or wrapped around the pipes length and back again to the house so I can create a loop to run hot water through to defrost the pipe.

Or maybe a combination of the two.

Any thoughts? ideas? (besides moving to a less god forsaken part of the world)

Thanks.

morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2011, 04:20 PM   #2
Member
 
Lightfoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: ky
Posts: 411
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


My friend, i cannot even begin to imagine what -40 would feel like!
I don't know what to tell you but both of your ideas seem pretty good to me Although circulating hot water i would think that would get expensive. Maybe a geothermal type unit, but if it gets 40 below there, you probably couldn't get it deep enough.

Lightfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2011, 10:29 PM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 57
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


My first choice would be ask around about different heat trace products that coupled with maybe fiberglass insulation and double that up.

Or redo your septic field so it's not so far out.
Adam_M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2011, 10:37 PM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


hmmmm?...how do you explain -40 to someone who has never experienced it? I have friends from tropical places and have spent many a night on palm covered beaches trying to get this concept across to them. I have failed every time.

I was playing with a 4" and a 8" and was having hard time figuring out how I would get the abs to stay perfectly straight inside the larger pipe.
Start pumping in spray foam and who knows what the shape of the pipe would take!
I could end up with a bow in the line and would lose the angle I need.

So now the heated water pipe is looking good.
Yes it would cost a bit if I was running it all the time...but I would only turn it on if I suspected it was freezing up.

Geothermal would be great..it works in the area, but costs a lot and needs a lot of power. I'm living off the grid so we have to keep things as power frugal as possible.
morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2011, 10:43 PM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


Hi adam,
I simply don't have enough power for a heat trace system.
doing any kind of Electrical heat would leave me in the dark so fast that my wife would kill me.

Moving the holding tank is not an option either...Oh if it were only that simple!
morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2011, 10:43 PM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 57
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


I lived in northern BC for 20 years I understand the cold, here is a link to one product as an idea

http://www.tycothermal.com/assets/Am...ce_DS_0211.pdf

If you want to spray foam, the one method I have done in the past for furnace ducts was dig your trench wrap it in poly put your pipe in on blocks then foam around it before finish wrappin the poly.

Last edited by Adam_M; 08-02-2011 at 10:47 PM.
Adam_M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 11:27 AM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: WV
Posts: 2,906
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


I guess I'm not understanding your concern. Sewer lines are empty almost all the time.
md2lgyk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 12:31 PM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


Hi md2lgyk,
Yup, you are right...but I would be worried about a slow build up of ice, and once its frozen - it's frozen - and winter is LONG here.
(The snow started in Oct. finally melted in the middle of May this year.)

It may not be a problem...it may all just flow slick as...well you know.
But I would like someway to mitigate any problems before they have the Mrs. pooping in a bucket. Because if she has to do that...well, my life gets pretty miserable!

Okay, must get back to digging.

Thanks.
morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 01:32 PM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 146
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


Can't you just flush the line with hot water or a salt water solution if it begins to freeze up? Maybe put a Tee with a clean out in right before it exits the foundation?
GottaFixIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 01:49 PM   #10
A "Handy Husband"
 
rjniles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: South Carolina Low Country
Posts: 4,028
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


My experience is that a septic tank as long as it is used normally will generate enough heat by bacterial action to keep things from freezing. The heat backs up into the inflow pipe to keep that unfrozen.
__________________
Location:
Coastal South Carolina
rjniles is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 02:06 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Atlantic Canada
Posts: 378
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


http://www.nrc-cnrc.gc.ca/obj/irc/do.../nrcc36049.pdf
(skip to the pictures)

Dig it up, put 4" styrofoam board on the sides and top (with lots of overlap) and bury it again.
shazapple is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 04:00 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


wow!
Lots of thoughts about my pipe.
Thanks.

I have a couple of clean outs planned for the line.

Hopefully bacterial heat will keep the end of the pipe free and clear, but I wouldn't count on it keeping all 35' free and clear.

The hot water down the drain might work if done on a regular basis in large enough volumes. (this is a situation of homesteading....we don't have an endless supply of water. I know what you are thinking...a few gallons of water...whats the big deal? Well, we have to use less than 3 gallons a day so we don't run out before winter breaks.) We use in a year what most people use in a week so I cringe at the idea of "wasting water".

The PDF is interesting...makes me even more concerned in the end actually. The depths shown are all about 6' deep! I am limited to 18 inches of depth.
But I do think the idea would help as long as there was no standing water in the waste pipe.
Cool

Thanks everyone.
morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 05:39 PM   #13
Member
 
biggles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Long Island
Posts: 3,630
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


unless there is a constant flow of water even cold couple of hot showers in the morning bathroom use will keep the line free of ice.for water to change to ice the heat in the water flowing down would have to drop to fast below 32F to even start to frost or crystalize within the pipe plus the bacteria within the pool produces heat when it is breaking dow and that rises up the pipe to heat it..sure its not 75F but it certainly is above freezing which is 32F..........water at 32F taken to 32F ice takes a super blast of heat loss and without constant flow the line will never block up with a hot shower or dinner dishes being done daily.consider making ice cubes how long does it take your freezer to make that change
biggles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2011, 07:29 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 64
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


I don't know how long it takes to make ice cubes...I don't have a freezer!

The general consensus is that I should have nothing to worry about.

I don't know if that should make me feel better or severely concerned!

I suppose the positive part is that if I do need to dig it up it's only 18" not 6 feet.

Hmmm?
What to do what to do?

I think I will run a loop of flexible poly and that way I have the option if somewhere down the line it goes sideways.

Any other thoughts?
morpho is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2013, 08:07 PM   #15
Master Plumber
 
Javiles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Miami Florida
Posts: 1,338
Default

DIY insulated septic pipe


Quote:
Originally Posted by saltracer View Post
Removed spam link
The guy that started this post moved to Hawaii last year..

__________________


Experience is Knowing what to do next, Skill is knowing how to do it

http://www.americandrain.net

Last edited by beenthere; 02-03-2013 at 07:51 AM. Reason: Removed spam link from quote
Javiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Septic problem or vent problem? wilsonstark Plumbing 9 01-17-2011 06:35 PM
Condensation in Gas Furnace Vent Pipe chanco HVAC 2 01-08-2011 04:01 PM
Insulated AC Pipe Freezing up Upnya HVAC 2 06-13-2010 09:02 PM
Water leaking into septic pipe below toilet Gramps Plumbing 1 09-14-2008 09:54 PM
water leak around septic pipe gvanhoven Plumbing 2 04-13-2008 10:29 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.