Am I getting a fair price?

danielrg

I had a pretty standard plumbing job done. Beforehand I was told that the guy charged $65/hr. We agreed on time and materials. Job is in North Utah Metro area

It was a basement bathroom job. The toilet stub was in the wrong spot, and there was no tub drain. There were existing vents already in place to tie into.

He had to:
-jackhammer concrete
-move the toilet stub
-stub a bathtub drain (maybe 5 feet from the existing line under concrete
-tie this into the existing vents.
-concrete back over it
-relocate about 15 feet of our house supply line (3/4" pex) from under joists to inside joists so we could sheetrock. Didn't have to change the route otherwise.

He did a pretty good job. There is still a hole he didn't concrete over and the vertical tub drain just ends there in the hole - no Ptrap or vertical stub yet. He said he needs the exact tub before he can finish stubbing it out.

I got the bill so far, and I think the bill is too high - He is charging $945 for time and materials. He spent a little under 7 hours at hour house. 7*$65=$455. I would expect materials not to exceed $150. I was expecting the job to run maybe $600, $650 tops. His invoice says 11.5 hours, $75 for jackhammer rental (he didn't say a word about that) - and materials were around $125 or so. Don't know why he is saying 11.5 hours - he spent 7 hours at our home on the work. I have called him to ask these questions but no reply yet.

I want to pay what's right, and compensate him fairly. But I don't want to get hung out to dry either, and this seems too high.

Any comments? Many thanks!

oh'mike

That price is reasonable----4 hours for shopping and travel and shop time seems about right.

When you hire by the hour you have an employee. Employees get paid from start of work day till end of work day.

If your boss wanted you to get 20 bags of cement in your car,for example, would you not expect to be paid for that time?

Sure you would.

By the way. in this area a good plumbers hourly rate is $120 per hour.

Honestly it sounds like this plumber is a fast and efficient worker--that's a lot of work in a day.
I'd keep him around.

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danielrg

Thanks for your answer! That's good to know, I didn't really think about his time going and buying the materials. I wouldn't expect to pay him for time travelling to and from the job. I don't get paid for my commute time - but shopping for me during the job- that I can live with, especially if he is giving such a good hourly rate.

I do wish he'd set my expectations properly, he didn't tell me many details about how he charged - and I could have asked more questions too. I'll let him get back to me with his itemization for the hours and we'll see how it turns out.

Any other comments on the price from other areas? Thanks!

TheEplumber

The OP's comments are why I won't price T & M. Too many details about pricing and cost are assumed by both parties. Every minute, tool rental, material, sub contractor, etc. directly used for the project should be billed for.
And $65 is a good rate

danielrg

Thanks. This is helpful for me to understand how it works. I asked if he wanted to quote. He said he has to quote worst case and that I would be better off doing T&M. Perhaps he's right. Fortunately, as we work together, our expectations will become more explicit, and fewer misunderstandings.

DangerMouse

I did a plumbing job once where it was just a leaky faucet. I told them that it was $40.00 an hour. Period.
After 4 hours it was not finished because they wanted to "cheap out" and the pieces did not work. THEN they did not want to pay me for the time I spent already that day, but STILL wanted me to come back the next day and finish!! Calls not returned. They spent 3 times as much hiring someone else to do it.
You got a good deal, treat the guy right.

DM

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Daniel Holzman

On a time and material job, you should ask for and receive an itemized list of time spent and material cost. Typically on a T&M job you pay ALL costs (travel time included, picking up parts etc.), plus all materials at the price the contractor paid, plus mileage, PLUS an agreed upon profit rate, which is typically at least 10 percent (I would never work for only ten percent, I typically charge 25 percent profit, but of course everyone is different, and the economy is slow). The point is a T&M contract is a contract of faith, because there is no upside limit to the cost.

If you want an upside limit, you may consider a T&M contract with a guaranteed maximum price. This obviously favors you, because the contractor does not know in advance what unexpected issues they will run into, but some contractors may sign such a deal. Another alternative is a fixed price bid, where the contractor assumes all risk for unexpected conditions. Your contractor is correct in that a fixed price bid must generally be priced based on worst case assumptions, so if everything goes well, you end up paying more than the equivalent T&M contract.

oh'mike

I hate T&M work---To many misunderstandings.

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Alan

Too much time to inventory the job too. I concur.

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amuffly

I had a shower drain moved, tub set, water lines ran and toilet flange set for $1,200 so yes you are getting a fair price.