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Old 02-19-2011, 10:14 AM   #1
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advice on installing new water supply shutoff


I have a difficult time getting the water to shut off completely. There are two shutoff valves, one on either side of the water meter; even with both fully off there is still a slight trickle. So I was thinking of installing a new ball shutoff valve. But I'm not sure about the type of union that is connecting the meter to the copper line. Here are a few pictures.

Is that an older dieletric union? On the new ones I've seen there's a knurled grip on the threaded side, and the copper tube on the sweat side sticks out a bit, and the conductivity breaking rubber collar sticks out a little like a collar around the copper tube.

Meter with shutoff valves on either side of it.


Union


Union cleaned up a bit -- view of its right-hand (i.e. fixture) side.

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Old 02-19-2011, 10:39 AM   #2
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Is that brass nipple coming out of the union threaded?

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Old 02-19-2011, 10:43 AM   #3
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advice on installing new water supply shutoff


Personally I would not start horsing around with those old fittings or you may end up calling the city to shut off the water at the street if they start leaking bad once you move them. Worse yet if you have a lead service supplying the meter. Then you may have to get a Pro plumber to break the floor and fix it all up. I would go downstream a bit and use a Sharbite ballvalve and cut it in to the copper line. A bit pricey but incredibly easy to work with. Google: SharkBite fittings and CAREFULLY read the install info. Available at HDepot
http://www.sharkbite.com/
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Old 02-19-2011, 10:59 AM   #4
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Depending on where you live you may be able to buy a six foot or three foot key to turn off water at B-box yourself.

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Old 02-19-2011, 11:29 AM   #5
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Is that brass nipple coming out of the union threaded?
I don't see any threads on the nipple and am reluctant to take it apart.
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Old 02-19-2011, 11:34 AM   #6
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"Reluctant" is a GOOD word. I have 4 Pro service journeyman plumbers where I work and hear all the horror stories of what can go wrong when you start moving the meter or any of the supply fittings to/from it. Nothing worse than creating your own problems.
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Old 02-19-2011, 11:42 AM   #7
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They can be an adventure!----Not to bad if you are just changing to house side--if the street side still works!

I had the basement water proofers crush the main with a jack hammer last week.

I had to sweat a new valve into the line while under full pressure---The Buffalo box was lost under the snow.
Jet Swet Offficial Site This is the tool that I used to stop the water inside the pipe while I sweated on a new ball valve.---Mike---
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Old 02-19-2011, 11:59 AM   #8
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Personally I would not start horsing around with those old fittings or you may end up calling the city to shut off the water at the street if they start leaking bad once you move them. Worse yet if you have a lead service supplying the meter. Then you may have to get a Pro plumber to break the floor and fix it all up. I would go downstream a bit and use a Sharbite ballvalve and cut it in to the copper line. A bit pricey but incredibly easy to work with. Google: SharkBite fittings and CAREFULLY read the install info. Available at HDepot
http://www.sharkbite.com/
I've seen the SharkBite connector fittings but have never seen their ball
valves. Didn't know they made them. Thanks for the tip.

The old rusty valve on the right-hand side of the meter is not dripping, just not closing all the way, so I could put off replacing it.
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:11 PM   #9
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Recovering from problems I've created for myself is one of the areas of my expertise. I won't step into a small boat without my trusty cordless drill and some bubble gum.
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:14 PM   #10
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oh Mike, that Jet Swet is the best thing since sliced bread.
Too bad Santa was here not that long ago.
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:34 PM   #11
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oh Mike, that Jet Swet is the best thing since sliced bread.
Too bad Santa was here not that long ago.
actually, its the best thing since a wadded up ball of wonder bread
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Old 02-19-2011, 12:55 PM   #12
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Now why did I not know of that 10 yrs ago when I did commercial/industrial plumbing in the Hospital I worked in and later Convention centre. We had high pressure boosted water up to 100 psi and gritty water which wore out most of our shutoff valves. Along with DHW domestic hot water recirc lines wearing out everywhere. CANNOT easily shutdown a main supply in large bldgs like that. Got so bad I ordered a pipe freezing kit. Blood pressure type cuff and you shoot liquid nitrogen in it to freeze the pipe and quickly solder it a foot or more downstream. Ah the Good Ole Days.
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Old 02-19-2011, 05:41 PM   #13
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That thing is a god send----Sold in full sets for about $285--Individual sizes start at about $40--

I will say that it takes some young muscles to shove that down the throat of a gushing pipe!
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Old 02-19-2011, 05:51 PM   #14
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The old rusty valve on the right-hand side of the meter is not dripping, just not closing all the way, so I could put off replacing it.
The valve on the right looks like it's threaded on to the nipple coming out of the union---that should make for an easy replacement---

Either use a threaded full port ball valve or use a threaded female copper fitting---(make up the valve --pipe--female--first--let it cool--dope and tape)

It is always best to connect up threaded fitting after they cool--Soldering to close to a threaded fitting often causes a leak.
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Old 02-19-2011, 06:29 PM   #15
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Those full port ball valves are handy. Remember years ago where we had a contractor do a "hot tap" onto a 8" chilled water line under pressure. Similar idea as your plug system. Welded the collar to the pipe, screwed on a nipple, ball valve , nipple and the hot tap cutter device. Ran it thru the chilled water line, backed it out, closed the ball valve and Bob's yer Uncle.

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