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Old 12-11-2012, 06:08 PM   #1
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Small roaches


Found two small roaches, maybe half an inch long, brown things instead of the big ass black things. One in the kitchen sink when I left a plate for 3 days--the plate was rinsed and had standing water, it died in the water. One stuck to a piece of packing tape.

I try to keep food out of the house. Don't let it sit in the trash can for days on end, but I don't produce a lot of trash--I think I need a solution for immediate disposal of food outside. So I'm not feeding them.

Dad keeps telling me that when I redo the floors I need to spray roach poison all along the baseboards, behind the cabinets, and even in the cabinets where I'm going to store tableware and food. I don't want to nuke my house with toxic chemicals--it's poison, it's toxic, it's there to poison small animals to death and I don't want it in my house and around my food. I am a great fan of multi-layer security but in this case I'd rather skip the global poisoning layer.

What are my alternatives? I assume eliminating standing water indoors and keeping any food out of reach are primary global strategies.

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Old 12-11-2012, 06:12 PM   #2
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I don't want to nuke my house with toxic chemicals--it's poison, it's toxic, it's there to poison small animals to death
No way youre gonna do that to a house cat/dog/even gerbil. It is NOT there to poison those mammals. A roach weighs a fraction of those furry pets, so no way in heaven it can be toxic/deadly to them. Just toxic to insects that weigh a fraction of an ounce.

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Old 12-11-2012, 06:14 PM   #3
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Small roaches


of course, spray as directed with proper concentration.
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:48 PM   #4
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http://www.ehow.com/how_8449054_keep...naturally.html
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Old 12-11-2012, 06:53 PM   #5
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Small roaches


Remember....small roaches grow into big roaches....

Right now, they are looking for warm places.....Everyone on our street has seen a big increase in sightings.....so far, we have found the sticky traps to work well along with Borax powder.
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Old 12-11-2012, 08:02 PM   #6
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:59 AM   #7
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Small roaches


I have (possibly had?) a roach problem in a home we just purchased.... I tried DIY treating with baits, boric acid, gels & sticky pads. They all worked marginally with no clear winner.

I had an exterminator come 2 weeks ago to spray the interior & exterior perimeters all at once. I have 2 pups & a pregnant wife, and the chemicals they use is considered safe for both. Noticed immediate results but still have a stray roach every 1-3 days around kitchen sink.

You need to get control of this situation before they start laying eggs, which obviously happened to me. Call an exterminator. It's considered safer than DIY chemicals as well.
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Old 12-12-2012, 10:04 AM   #8
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No dogs or cats or children or wives, just I like to work a certain way.

For me it's a matter of reduction of toxins. I don't mind short-term toxins that don't bio-accumulate. Consider cleaners, for example: Sodium Lauryl Sulfate will make you sick if ingested, but there's no long-term harm and if you stop drinking the detergent you stop being sick. Simple Green is poisonous, but it's labeled "non-toxic" because you're not going to have any problems without heavy, continuous exposure. These are fine.

By contrast, it's been shown that children and adults have HIGH concentrations of PBDEs in their blood specifically from the flame retardants used in bedding. All flame retardants used in bedding have been questioned, and are slowly being banned--this is causing some difficulty with the EU and the US CPSC. These chemicals bio-accumulate over time and cause mental development problems (hence the slow banning). You need a prescription to buy bedding without flame retardants; most doctors will write one upon request, no questions asked.

I'm one to haggle over each little chemical exposure until I determine risk versus reward. How much exposure, how short- or long-term, severity of toxicity, bio-accumulation, and effectiveness. I want to cut out the things it makes sense to cut out--that doesn't mean it's always obvious, and it doesn't mean that everything comes whole-sale. In this case, maybe I should get an exterminator to apply chemicals; maybe those chemicals dissipate in a month or three, and after that I can manage the reduced population easily by alternate means.


Because of this, I naturally bias toward anything less toxic. I'll strongly prefer toxins that don't bioaccumulate--for example, Simple Green isn't the kind of thing you want to inhale in high concentration every day, but two or three days of fresh air clears it out, which makes it more attractive than any cleaner that emits toxic fumes that bioaccumulate on the long term or cause more long-term damage.

On the other hand, if the insecticide of choice is pyrethrin, I guess that's not a problem. Additives are an issue--like PBOs. For example, Bonide 857 is marketed as a safe, natural Pyrethin insecticide ... it's 1% Pyrethin and 10% PBO. PBO negatively affects children's mental development when the mother is exposed during pregnancy--the risk window is minimal.

Things like permethrin are toxic to humans in a big way, though, and also popular because they're synthetic. In this case synthetic means less expensive--you can synthesize it in lab rather than collecting, processing, and refining from plants that have to be grown first. Unfortunately it's not molecularly identical, and this form bypasses protection mechanisms that help metabolize the poison away, so its toxic actions apply to mammals.

I guess something like Bonide 857 works within my stringent requirements and fits a balanced risk model where elevated effectiveness is desirable. I hear good things about baking soda for roaches in particular, but this stuff has a much wider effect (many more insects affected).
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Old 12-12-2012, 10:27 AM   #9
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I understand your concerns, so I suggest calling an exterminator & requesting an MSDS to make your decision.

I will reiterate: Get a hold of this situation now, or else you'll bio-accumulate roaches...


Sounds like you may have German roaches, and they're a tough bunch to get rid of.
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Old 12-12-2012, 10:43 AM   #10
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I understand your concerns, so I suggest calling an exterminator & requesting an MSDS to make your decision.

I will reiterate: Get a hold of this situation now, or else you'll bio-accumulate roaches...


Sounds like you may have German roaches, and they're a tough bunch to get rid of.
MSDS makes sense.

German roaches? I don't have any cabbage?
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Old 12-12-2012, 05:10 PM   #11
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OK, good points. Get the msds and go to the section on toxicity (you probably already know about that). LD 50's, rat/mouse/rabbit, etc etc etc. Also, mutagenic effects area.

Still, no need to over analyze the roach thing. You only spray 1X a year (more, and youre using the wrong chemical). Germans are the worst, like posted above by fellow member.
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Old 12-12-2012, 05:13 PM   #12
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Any human body living in our "modern" world has already about 4000 different chemical compounds in the body/blood. A wiff of second hand smoke from a stinkin cigarette from a tobacco addict offers about 3000 right there (including arsenic, cadmium, lead, nitrosamines- also from well done bacon, benzene, vinyls from the filter, and pesticide residues from the sprays they put on tobacco). . Then, sitting in trafic at a red light- another 200. we only got 800 to go and its not hard to aquire in our polluted environment. (vinyls from our shower curtains, etc etc etc.........)
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:13 AM   #13
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...also from well done bacon ...)
Don't ruin bacon for me please!
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Old 12-19-2012, 12:56 PM   #14
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Small roaches


The consensus here, I am generally in agreement. Diatamaceous earth is FAR better than any boric acid. Use it with a bulb duster LIGHTLY. It works by abrading the exoskeleton of insects causing dehydration...a dessicant that will be transferred to others in the colony. Boric acid is toxic to humans, animals and fish so it is generally not recommended for use around children or pets. DE is inert.

Refrain from using spray products if at all possible. Most DIYers will use way too much. Plus making baits MUCH less effictive.

If you can find MAXFORCE GEL (actually a paste in a "syringe" applicator), or another gel that contains FIPRONIL and follow the directions for crack and crevice application. Many small beads are better than fewer large "goops". The delayed mortality allows the product to remain effective to roaches that haven't eaten it. Roaches eat roach feces and are cannalbalistic.

Gentrol is a restricted product in the US but if you can get it where you are, use it in conjunction with the others. IT WORKS!

I would suggest finding a reputable exterminating service that supports Integrated Pest Management (IPM). Most sell their products to the public is diluted form, and are free with their advice.

Good Luck!
~Z

PS - The Label is the LAW...and any pest control company will supply you with both the label and the MSDS sheets.
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Old 12-19-2012, 03:18 PM   #15
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I would suggest finding a reputable exterminating service that supports Integrated Pest Management (IPM). Most sell their products to the public is diluted form, and are free with their advice.
This sounds interesting. I like layered approaches. I'm going to be working out all the cracks and entrances and sealing them up, though I'm trying to figure out how air gets into the house--can't seal the whole thing, I'd die in there. Or need to get a houseplant. Right now I'm focused on the weather stripping around the front and back doors--it's correct and proper, but light and air come in around the door, especially around the corners. Insects could come through that.

I'm not sure how to apply diatomaceous earth. I'm gonna rid myself of all the carpet, eventually. I've heard it's super-effective, though.


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