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Old 02-27-2009, 12:37 AM   #1
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Walk in shower


I'm building a walk in shower that will be tiled from floor to ceiling and was wondering what type of floor system is best they have this new styrofoam system that gives the floor some slope anyone used this???

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Old 02-27-2009, 07:36 AM   #2
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Walk in shower


http://www.schluter.com/4625.aspx

I mud my own pans and only use the kerdi & drain, none of the trim needed.

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Old 02-27-2009, 08:10 AM   #3
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Walk in shower


For rookies and pros alike, Schluter's pre-formed pan and curbs with the integrated drain flange is a great system. You use Kerdi over it and you've got a really foolproof shower. It is a little more money up front but is much less complex than doing it any other way.

As R&D said, you can place your own mud base and mud curbs if you prefer...And use Kerdi over them. Just do plenty of research about how bases and curbs are made and what mix to use (hint: it isn't conventional concrete).
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Old 02-27-2009, 08:29 AM   #4
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Walk in shower


Two criteria we use in order to put in the Schluter polystyrene shower kit are the size of the floor footprint and the time frame we have to put it in; I know there are others but when we do the Kerdi kit, these are the two that come to mind.

Schluter have a number of different sizes...3'x5' is a popular one we use. The kit costs about $500 but that includes everything you need for a waterproof shower and we haven't had anyone complain about paying the extra $$ for peace of mind.

Then there's the speed of installation. We don't normally have more than a few days to do everything so being able to put up the wall boards of choice, thinset the Kerdi and Kerdi-Band all around, lay the floor - and then start the tiling almost in the same day really saves time.
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Old 02-27-2009, 03:35 PM   #5
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Walk in shower


The problem with pre-made systems is that the dimensions of your shower have to be perfect. That means moving walls, drains, etc to make it fit. If none of these are a factor I would say definitly use schulter, if you have to move things it is easyer to use mud. I am currently doing a walk in shower with floor to ceiling tile. Ended up with an odd size shower (something like 38inch X 42) and couldn't use either system. I poured mud for my curb and shower pan. It was pretty easy and I've never done anything like this before.

Good luck.
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Old 02-28-2009, 08:10 AM   #6
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Walk in shower


Yup...prefab kits (and Schluter is but one) aren't made for everywhere. And I'd not make the shower walls and drain accomodate the floor, it's the other way round!

But we sell "waterproof showers" - not just a new floor - so our approach is more "a system"... like the subfloor+ the walls+ the floor+ the drain+ 2" plumbing. Sort-of "all or nothing"...Plus, I really don't like signing my name to someone else's work. Easier to start from scratch.
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Old 04-10-2009, 02:43 PM   #7
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Walk in shower


I had a "handyman" lay a new mortarbed for my shower tile install project. He also put up cement backerboard for the walls. He suggested that I paint everything, walls and floors (and the transitions between planes) with Redgard. I've done so and am wondering if this was the right thing to do. Have I created a moisture proof system that I can now lay tile on? Should I simply apply the mortar/thinset directly to the Redgarded mortarbed and put down the tile?

Thanks!

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Old 04-10-2009, 06:42 PM   #8
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Walk in shower


Frank,

You didn't supply enough info on how the base was built. Is there a shower pan membrane attached to the special floor drain? Is there a pre-slope under the membrane? Doesn't sound like it. Handyman? Why a handyman to build a shower?

Go here to see how an "old fashioned method" shower is built. http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html

Go here to see how a much better watertight Kerdi shower is built. http://picasaweb.google.com/tile4youinc

You will have more questions. Ask them here.

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Old 04-10-2009, 08:29 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMan View Post
Go here to see how an "old fashioned method" shower is built. http://www.ontariotile.com/preslope.html
Jaz
Well, that's not how he did it at all. He did not do a preslope...he put down the poly sheeting straight on the plywood, then created the mortar bed. He then put backerboard on top of the poly sheeting on the curb. So obviously there are now holes in that poly sheeting.

To add insult to injury, the mortar bed is not flat and is not a good surface to lay tile, even if the rest of it was done well.

I guess I may have been had. I've already paid for this work, and it's essentially a complete rebuild of a shower area that was riddled with water/termite damage.

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Old 04-10-2009, 11:06 PM   #10
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Walk in shower


Next time hire a real tile setter, but be warned, most tile setters do NOT build them right either.

Main reason is that the pan is usually installed by the plumber. Most plumbers do NOT build showers right either. They know they should install a pre-slope, but they also know most HO's and builders will not pay the extra $$$ to do it right, because the other plumbers do it wrong too. Vicious cycle.

So, you do it yourself if you are handy and have the time, OR have a tile setter than specializes in Kerdi showers build you a shower. If done right, you can NOT build a better shower.

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Old 04-11-2009, 06:44 AM   #11
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You got an "Edsel"...now I don't know how old you are but some might recall a car of decades ago that has become a synonym for something built long ago that never had a chance - and didn't work. That's the shower you got...

Look I'm not knocking this handyman because I know nothing about him; however, I do know about shower systems and what you were 'sold' was a "American-built, reliable vehicle that looks good"...trouble is he didn't tell you it was an Edsel.

Showers used to be built like that (I took one up that used plastic green garbage bags as the pan liner) and sometimes you were lucky if you got any slope in the floor -mostly they were flat. Showers like that lasted ~5 years before they smelled like mould. Guess why.

But in the past 15yrs or so, shower systems have taken a quantum leap in the technology of water and moisture management; probably in response to the 'mould' paranoia attributed to asthma and other health problems, and the ever-tighteneing insulation/air circulation and infiltration awareness we now have - all of which have become prevalent in the past 3-4 decades - with good cause. The result is we have better products and we know what we're doing.

And it used to be that plumbers did the plumbing bit, a carpenter or handyman did the walls and a tile-setter did the tiles - but no-one looked at the whole things as a water management 'system'. Besides they had plenty of showers to build and rebuild every ~5-7 years or so - so life was good. Nowadays we're looking at one shower to outlast the current homeowners. Like an heirloom...

Unfortunately one mistake or omission and the whole system is shot.

But give your guy some credit: he knew about RedGard. Had to, actually - it's a waterproofing product. And what shower doesn't use "waterproof" in its function or description?

Not too late for the shower - too late for the Edsel tho'.
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:41 AM   #12
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So what should I do? Do I tear everything down and do it correctly? Could I just treat what I've got right now as a preslope and go from there? Should I just trust the liner he put down (without the preslope) and just get some mortar to make this slope correct?
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Old 04-11-2009, 07:53 AM   #13
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Walk in shower


I would rip out the floor mud, install a Kerdi drain, remud the floor sloped correctly, only one mud bed required with this system, then kerdi the walls and floor.
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Old 04-11-2009, 08:12 AM   #14
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Walk in shower


I lean to the tear-out option only because that's the way I work - I don't do patch-up jobs of someone elses' work and sign my name to it...can't afford to. Besides it's not big time consumer so I can redo it in the time it takes someone else to pick around at this-and-that. But again, that's just my approach...

That's not to say a patch-up job can't be done - and R&D address that question very well. And if I did patches, that'd what I would do but I'd like to see it first.


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