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Old 07-02-2010, 11:38 PM   #1
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Tear it all up or go over top....


Slowly but surely my the house I bought roughly a year ago is coming together. There are plans in motion right now to knock down a wall that is separating the front great room and the kitchen so I can open it up and make it one big area with a kitchen island. Right now majority of the downstairs is a horrible blue tile color that the previous owner did himself mixed with about 400sqft of blue carpet. The carpet is coming up and I am stuck on whether or not to rip up all the tile as well or go over top of it with a hardwood floor. I live in AZ and on a concrete slab with no wood or anything down as a subfloor. As it stands if I keep the tile and go right over top of it my buddy and myself could probably knock out the wood floors in a long weekend and should cost to much. If it all has to get ripped up I will probably have to have someone else do all the work due to making sure everything is smooth on the slab and everything is leveled out. I am a little hesitant with completely ripping everything up because the $$$ almost doubles in the end. I don't plan on being in this house for real long as well but I def want something that will last for years to come. Another option I was thinking about was to have everything torn up and then have the concrete etched and stained but that is going to cost a good amount as well. I am just stuck with decisions right now and losing my mind.

How safe is it to go over the tile with a hardwood floor and what issues could arise? My buddy did it to his house about 4yrs ago and still looks great and has had no issues and I was hoping I could go this route as well to save time and money. Just not sure what the most cost effective way would be to redo all my downstairs flooring. Hope this makes sense and thanks for reading.
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Old 07-03-2010, 08:27 AM   #2
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Tear it all up or go over top....


What type of wood floor - floating - laminate ?
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Old 07-03-2010, 09:58 AM   #3
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If I left the tile down wouldn't I have to do laminate and glue it down? I guess if I ripped everything up then my options open up more.
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Old 07-03-2010, 10:55 AM   #4
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Tear it all up or go over top....


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If I left the tile down wouldn't I have to do laminate and glue it down?
You don't glue-down laminate floors. Laminate floors are "floating floors".

The problems with going over tile is that your (then) subfloor (the tile) must be reliable. Your installation is only as good as your ground work. Any grout joints in the tile would have to be filled and skimmed to plane the floor first.

First use a wooden hammer handle or broom stick or something to tap on every floor tile. Listen for a hollow sound. If any tile sounds hollow it should be removed and either replaced or the depression filled. Loose tile buried under a laminate floor could be a disaster later.

It is always better to remove old floor coverings before installing new ones, but that's not to say what you propose isn't done all the time. You may later find that removing the old tile would have been less expensive in the long run.
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Old 07-03-2010, 11:55 AM   #5
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sorry for the confusion about the laminate, not real familiar with hardwood floors, thats why a buddy of mine was going to help me, he in the carpenters union. I will have to do the broom to tile deal and listen for any hollow ones. I personally would prefer to just remove everything but it seems most places charge at least $1-$2 sqft just for removal and prep then its another $3-$7 sqft for install alone. If I have a contractor do it I am looking at anywhere from $5k-$10k depending on quality. I have been researching doing the removal myself but it seems everywhere i look it is saying the floors will need to be grinded and so forth to get all the thinset up. If i can do this all by hand and I don't need someone to come in with a machine to remove all the tile then that would be great. Since the previous owner did the tile himself I am thinking that everything will need to come up because if its like half the other jobs he did around the house he did it poorly. I guess its prob time to start planning out the funds
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Old 07-03-2010, 12:52 PM   #6
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Tear it all up or go over top....


You can remove the tile yourself. It isn't always an easy job but can be done. A heavy hammer and brick-chisel will work for basic tools. You can also rent (or buy) a "heavy-bar" that may keep you on your feet while plugging away at it. You can also rent a chipping/chiseling machine to hammer on it that you walk behind, or you can rent an electric hammer/chisel machine. That's usually the most efficient tool to use and the most economical.

Grinding of the old thinset will likely be necessary after the tile is out but that too can be done with rental machines.

Tool rental companies offer orbital floor grinders that you walk behind. Some use grinding stones ( you buy the stones) while others use diamond discs (you pay for disc wear) and others have rotating carbide chisels (you buy the chisel teeth). Some of those machines are even self-propelled.

Anyone you hire will be doing the same thing you can do yourself. In fact a lot of those guys will only rent the same machines you can rent anyway.

It's not easy work but it isn't difficult to figure out. You can also bring in a metal dumpster for the spoils and they will haul it off when you are done.

If you are sure this is going to happen then it can't hurt anything to take a hammer and chisel and try to remove a few tiles just to see what you are up against. You may find out the tiles will pop-up with little effort and take most of the thinset adhesive with them. You'll never know until you do some exploration.

After the floor is clean and flat the rest is really easy.
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Old 07-03-2010, 01:01 PM   #7
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I actually did take up a few tiles when i first moved into the house in the bathroom and it took a second to do and left nothing behinds in the area I did. I wish I could only be that lucky throughout. I also had to cut away a few inches of tile in the kitchen when putting the new base cabinets in and it was the same thing, cut the line made and the tile came right up. I guess time will tell with this, I have to demo a wall out before i start anything and then work around that.
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Old 07-03-2010, 01:06 PM   #8
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Knocking the firmset off the floor with a rented floor buffer equipped with carborundum grinding stones is not that big a job.----Call a local rental place to get the cost---you might find out that you can do it yourself at a fair price.---Mike--
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Old 07-03-2010, 02:35 PM   #9
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I actually did take up a few tiles when i first moved into the house in the bathroom and it took a second to do and left nothing behinds in the area I did. I wish I could only be that lucky throughout. I also had to cut away a few inches of tile in the kitchen when putting the new base cabinets in and it was the same thing, cut the line made and the tile came right up.
Those two experiences are a pretty good indication that your tile was installed poorly and THAT is in your favor.
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Old 07-03-2010, 06:39 PM   #10
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I have heard of self leveling liquid. You pour it right on your tile, smear it around a little, and leave it. Come back a couple of hours later and you have a level floor.

You probably wouldn't need a moisture barrier either with the tile and the leveling compound, but I would recommend it just to be safe.
Those are words of someone that < that is repeating what he heard. No reason to be rude to him for repeating it. >.

Let's keep this thread on track and focus on reality.

Last edited by beenthere; 07-03-2010 at 08:33 PM. Reason: Remove rude/insulting comment/wording
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Old 07-03-2010, 08:34 PM   #11
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Tear it all up or go over top....


When someone post inaccurate/untrue info. Posting the correct info is what should be done.
Please don't be rude though.
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Old 07-05-2010, 11:21 AM   #12
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Tear it all up or go over top....


Quote:
Originally Posted by fox_forma View Post
There are plans in motion right now to knock down a wall that is separating the front great room and the kitchen so I can open it up and make it one big area with a kitchen island. Right now majority of the downstairs is a horrible blue tile color that the previous owner did himself mixed with about 400sqft of blue carpet.
Back to the original question:
If what will become your open area currently has carpet and tile, and you plan to use one flooring throughout, you will have to get the entire area to one even level. So leaving the tile may not be an option.

I say go for it! One of the best ways for a non-experienced DIY'er to save money is by doing their own demo. If you get in over your head and the guys (and gals) here can't walk you through it, then hire someone.
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Old 07-05-2010, 02:38 PM   #13
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Tear it all up or go over top....


If i demo all the tile and rip up the carpet then the first floor will all be the same through out. Where the wall is coming down I could actually carpet on the one side that goes towards the front of the house and do something else on the kitchen side. Still haven't really decided on the exact layout after the wall comes down on how it will transition. It seems the best option is to just rip everything up myself then go from there.
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Old 06-12-2011, 09:15 AM   #14
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Tear it all up or go over top....


What is the average cost to hire thinset removal, I have a guy taking forever using a small impact hammer thinset is really hard, I need to get done.
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Old 06-12-2011, 11:35 AM   #15
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Tear it all up or go over top....


Quote:
What is the average cost to hire thinset removal, I have a guy taking forever using a small impact hammer thinset is really hard, I need to get done.
You also need to start your own thread and not hijack this one.
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