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Old 02-23-2010, 11:48 PM   #1
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


I am in the process of renovating some office space in an old commercial building.Currently when you walk on the floors it squeeks. My contractor said he would use a tug and groove plywood to put over all the flooring (wood) and this would do the job. Then I would put a ceramic tile or carpet over top of it. THis seems like a waste of money to me.

My question is, is there a finished product that I could lay over the existing floor that would do the same thing(take out the squeekyness) and avoid the sub floor?


This would save me on cost for the subfloor and then tile on top.

Thanks

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Old 02-23-2010, 11:55 PM   #2
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


Seems to me there must be a way to fix the squeak aside from a 2nd subfloor.

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Old 02-24-2010, 08:52 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by lamrich View Post
I am in the process of renovating some office space in an old commercial building.Currently when you walk on the floors it squeeks. My contractor said he would use a tug and groove plywood to put over all the flooring (wood) and this would do the job. Then I would put a ceramic tile or carpet over top of it. THis seems like a waste of money to me.

My question is, is there a finished product that I could lay over the existing floor that would do the same thing(take out the squeekyness) and avoid the sub floor?


This would save me on cost for the subfloor and then tile on top.

Thanks
What is the current subfloor material? If it is plywood you could try screwing it down where it lays across the joist with some nice 2" deck screws. I did this before I layed down my hardwoods and it made a huge difference in the squeaks.
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Old 02-24-2010, 03:58 PM   #4
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


Just putting the plywood on top, probably won't fix the squeaks, unless they accidently get screws in the right place when they install it.
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Old 02-24-2010, 07:18 PM   #5
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


Lamrich,

You've got two different criteria here. One is a loose subfloor, which is why the floor squeaks. The other is to determine what prep is necessary and what needs to be installed before you install ceramic tiles on that floor. Although somewhat related, one does not eliminate the other.

So, tell us exactly how your subfloor is built starting with the framing. The type and size of the joists, species & grade if at all possible, their spacing and the unsupported span of the joists. Measure this to the inch from one support to the other.

Then tell us what the subfloor (sheets/planks) are made of and how many layers if more than one. Then describe the tiles (ceramic-porcelain-natural stone), and what you plan to install under the tiles such as a cement backer or membrane and with what type of adhesive product.

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Old 02-24-2010, 07:26 PM   #6
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


after you refasten the floor if still squeking can you see the underside from the floor below to see if something is rubbing. you mentioned carpet- sounds like a winner
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Old 02-24-2010, 09:17 PM   #7
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Nothing you lay on top of the existing floor will solve the squeaking. You have to refasten the existing subfloor to the joists.The squeeking is caused by fasteners(usually nails) rubbing against wood that is moving. Clean (sweep/vacuum) the subfloor good, so that you can locate the existing fasteners, then drive a 2 1/4" deck screw into the joist about one inch away from each fastener. Watch the old fastener as you suck the subfloor tight with the new one. If you see any change at all in the relationship of the depth of it to the subfloor, it is loose and needs to be removed. Sometimes the old head will pop up high enough to be pulled with a hammer, other times you will have to dig it out with a cats paw. Do not be tempted to try to just drive it down, it needs to come out. If old subfloor is plywood, I always set the depth of my saw about 1/16'' deeper than the thickness of the plywood and run it down all the seams between the sheets to eliminate them from moving against each other( be prepared to ruin a blade or two from hitting old fasteners); do this before refastening. You should fasten the sheets every 8 " along the seams, and 12" in the field, being sure that the fasteners along the seams are staggered so they do not touch each other. Even with all this , there is no gaurantee you will get every single squeak.
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Old 02-24-2010, 09:48 PM   #8
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Troubleseeker,

While I agree with most of what you wrote, I disagree with you cutting between the sheets of the subfloor therefore eliminating the tongue of the T&G. If this is indeed the subfloor, you've weakened the floor at those spots. Now you'll have to install an underlayment or install blocking from the underside between the joists of the plywood end joints. I also recommend a tighter fastening schedule than 8" & 12". That's the way carpenters do it, we tile guys find 6" & 8" or so is better.

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Old 02-25-2010, 06:37 AM   #9
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


I think he met the butt joints on the joist not the tandg
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Old 02-25-2010, 12:18 PM   #10
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What butt joints? There are no butt joints in subfloor grade plywood or OSB. If there's an underlayment over the subfloor you may have butt joints. But underlayment is supposed to be spaced 1/8" between sheets.

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Old 02-25-2010, 05:14 PM   #11
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Squeeeky Floor... what to do


what sheathing for subfloor framing is T&G on the edge that rests on the framing
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Old 02-25-2010, 09:33 PM   #12
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Is that a question??????

If it is, EVERY sheet of of sheathing made for subfloors has 2 sides with a groove, and two wides with a tongue.

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Old 02-25-2010, 10:07 PM   #13
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You are right Jazman. But I'm sure there are areas, like here, where t&g isn't alway used. And this is an old building. It may have been built before t&g.
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Old 02-26-2010, 09:40 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMan View Post
Troubleseeker,

While I agree with most of what you wrote, I disagree with you cutting between the sheets of the subfloor therefore eliminating the tongue of the T&G. If this is indeed the subfloor, you've weakened the floor at those spots. Now you'll have to install an underlayment or install blocking from the underside between the joists of the plywood end joints. I also recommend a tighter fastening schedule than 8" & 12". That's the way carpenters do it, we tile guys find 6" & 8" or so is better.
Jaz
Just a misunderstanding.
I did not interpret that the current squeaking floor is T&G, but that the new proposal was to use T&G plywood. Maybe I was not clear enough, but I meant to open the joints up on the existing (assummed non T&G) subfloor before overlaying it. Agree..do not defeat the purpose of the T&G by cutting it. Certainly no harm with closer fasteners; expecially when trying to stop a sqeak. I have ended up with screws literally every inch along an entire floor joist and still not gotten the sqeak. Sometimes there is enough deflection in a long joist, and the sqeak originates from the cross blocking within the floor.
My thoughts are that this is an older house, and in my experiencce, most stuff built before 80's or so, did not use T&G plywood for subfloors.

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Old 02-26-2010, 09:45 AM   #15
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"I have ended up with screws literally every inch along an entire floor joist and still not gotten the sqeak."

Those of us that know what is usually the cause of this will never tell the secret.

Jaz

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