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Old 11-18-2011, 11:23 AM   #1
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Can anyone help me with a major problem we’re having? I bought a batch of tile to go through the kitchen/foyer/dining area, and even though I calculated correctly, I’m only going to have one spare tile left over when I complete the job. I usually like to have at least a packet or two left over in case of damage, but I did too good a job of calculating the layout through the three areas and making sure all the cuts along the walls were balanced out – I ended up with a stack of near-half width pieces!

We’ve belatedly decided to convert our garage into additional living space (building a new garage at the same time) with a single step down entry off the foyer. Obviously, opening an entry through the wall off the foyer means that the extra four inches of concrete exposed makes the present half tiles butting up to the wall redundant - I’ll need at least 6 new tiles to relay to the edge of the step down into the converted garage.

Though it’s not a major issue, I had hoped to use the same tile through the garage, which of course would mean getting hold of enough to cover an area about 25’ square.

So what’s the problem? We returned to the store where we bought the tile 9 months ago, only to be told that the tile we used has been discontinued! Talk about a jaw-dropping moment! We tried going back to the distributor to see if he could source at least enough for me to do the step, but we’ve had no luck. We are now basically up the creek, as I sure as heck can’t go back now and tear out all the tile we just laid down. So I have a few questions –

1) Is anyone at all familiar with the tile, and know where there might be some stock sitting around? It’s 18” x 18” ceramic tile, called ‘Peacock Multicolor’, by a company out of Israel called ‘Negev’, though they sell this particular tile under the company name ‘Novo’. At the least, we need one packet to help us finish off our project and to keep a few tiles in reserve. Somewhere, there HAS to be a packet or two of this stuff lying around that no one can sell because they don’t have enough stock left to make it viable, given that it’s apparently been discontinued.
2) Worst case scenario, I have one option open to me. Though 99% of the work has been done, I still have about 12 whole tiles set aside to finish off the job. 7 are to complete a run between the dining area and the family room, transitioning over to wood flooring. The other five are to go on the step leading from the foyer into our formal area. I hadn’t actually done the work because I had a couple of questions to clear up before proceeding. Now, if someone can come up with some kind of creative way to save the whole tiles by using something else, I could set aside those precious whole tiles for use on the new opening to the garage and as reserves. Some ideas I’ve considered for the transition over to wood
a) Some sort of complimentary tile that could make it look like a border between the main tile and the wood
b) Using the left over tile pieces creatively (by that I mean all the smaller cut pieces left over from the job I've done so far) either by cutting them up into rectangular pieces (or squares) that would fit 3 across to every whole tile they’d butt up to, or by smashing up a pile of them and laying them out as a mosaic to fill the required area. Never done either so I don’t know if it would work or end up looking like crap.
As for the step into the formal area, though I don’t think the smashed tile idea would work, cutting the left over pieces up and using them as squares or rectangles might work.

Finally, in case anyone is wondering why I just don’t use the wood flooring to take up the area where I was going to transition from tile to wood, it won’t work. It would mean laying the wood into an area that was opened up by removing most of a wall – even though only a few feet of the wall are left in one corner, I’d have to lay the wood 12 inches deep on the inside of that section – it would look weird!

Sorry for the long post – and I hope the pictures make it easier to understand!
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Solving discontinued tile issue-transition-area.jpg  


Last edited by timbo59; 11-18-2011 at 11:34 AM.
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Old 11-18-2011, 11:25 AM   #2
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Here's a clearer picture of the tile in question - I thought I'd uploaded it with the previous post.

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Old 11-18-2011, 11:28 AM   #3
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Okay, figured it out - file size issues!
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Old 11-18-2011, 11:39 AM   #4
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Solving discontinued tile issue


This is the step in question, where you can see the area waiting for the final tiles set aside. The opening into the garage will be a mirror of this one, directly on the opposite side of the foyer, where you can partly see an antique cabinet in place.
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Old 11-18-2011, 12:38 PM   #5
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Solving discontinued tile issue


The chances of finding tile from that exact "lot" is slim-to-none. That's the way tile goes. When purchasing tile for a project one should purchase more than is needed. If a later extension is in the plans that tile should also be purchased in advance and at the same time.

Tile designs and patterns just don't stay around for long.

You may get lucky and find that same tile somewhere, but how you would locate it is beyond me. The name of the tile is basically useless because tile carries different names at different locations. This is done (just like some carpets) to keep you from shopping one suppliers price over/against another's.

Where did you originally purchase the tile?

You may want to contact the CTDA (Ceramic Tile Distribution Association) and see if they can help to locate some additional tile. The problem is now...you don't need enough additional quantity to get anyone interested in searching for it.

CTDA has a website.
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Old 11-18-2011, 01:00 PM   #6
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Try calling this place...they have this tile on their design page. http://www.amlaski.com/Porcelain-Til...eville-Ga.html
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Old 11-18-2011, 01:06 PM   #7
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Hi Bud,
As I said, I thought I had purchased enough (working to the rule of ordering 10% more than I needed based on square footage), but all the half tile cut for the borders (which took out about 10" out of every 18" tile used on the borders) really ate into my reserve. It's the first time I've used 18" tile, so I should have allowed for more wastage.

Bear in mind that i did finish up with enough - it's just the change in plan as far as the garage is concerned that's messed things up. Trust me, if I had to pay $10 a tile to get the extra I needed I'd pay it!

No suggestions on alternatives to save the dozen odd tiles I have in reserve, or thoughts on my ideas? If you're a tile guy, I'm sure you've had to get creative at times yourself.

Thanks for the contact information though - I'll see what I can dig up on that front.
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Old 11-18-2011, 01:20 PM   #8
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Solving discontinued tile issue


There have been times when creativity had to prevail. When facing an apparent shortage even after deploying the most skilled estimating techniques I have had to use a different tile to create a feature at a door opening or a tile "rug" near an entry. Using your imagination you can use a contrasting tile and make it look like a work of art and appear that extensive planning went into the feature when the truth is, it is there because of a screw up.

There is no real "rule-of-thumb" when estimating a particular quantity of tile for overage. I can tell you (and as you now know) using tiles larger than 12" can create additional needs you would have never believed. I have prospective customers tell me how much faster their installation is going to be because they have chosen super large tiles. Nothing could be further from the truth and the waste also increases exponentially in some cases. It has more to do with configuration of an area than with overall square footage. Estimating needs based on total square footage without also considering configurations can send a person back to the drawing board every time.
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:02 PM   #9
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Solving discontinued tile issue


You're dead right on the latter score. 12" tile has always been my standard for previous layouts, so I thought I was on the money with my estimates, but the amount of wastage for 18" tile is enormous, as I've discovered. I'm really fastidious about tile layout, and drew up a plan with a matching 18" grid on waxpaper to lay over it and make sure that the layout was nice, even and balanced throughout the three rooms. But I ended up having to slice up about 70 - 80 pieces to go along the walls that were aprox. 10" in width, so you can imagine how much got wasted!

I also don't know what your experience is, but I thought 18" tile would be easier to lay more accurately than 12" tile, but the reverse applied. This particular ceramic tile was not particularly accurate in the consistency of its dimensions, so, much as I like to use spacers to supplement my ruled lines, I often didn't use them, as I constantly had to 'work' tiles around a bit to make the runs stay true to the next line drawn on the concrete.

Anyway, I now know that in future with 18" tile I'll have to take into account the increased wastage and do an actual tile count needed from the plan to factor in how much more to order as a reserve, rather than going by the actual square footage.

Thanks for your input, as ever.

Tim
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:20 PM   #10
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Quote:
But I ended up having to slice up about 70 - 80 pieces to go along the walls that were aprox. 10" in width, so you can imagine how much got wasted!
Yup for anyone else reading this that amount of waste amounts to about 80 square feet of tile. Each 8" X 18" piece discarded is one square foot of waste. The potential for waste is absurd, but look at what it does to tile sales...the marketing guys are geniuses and know how to bump sales without anyone realizing it.

Quote:
I also don't know what your experience is, but I thought 18" tile would be easier to lay more accurately than 12" tile, but the reverse applied.
Nope, not at all easier. Trying to go through door openings is a killer. Every time an attempt at an intricate cut results in a broken tile you have then wasted 2.25 square feet of tile.

Quote:
This particular ceramic tile was not particularly accurate in the consistency of its dimensions, so, much as I like to use spacers to supplement my ruled lines, I often didn't use them, as I constantly had to 'work' tiles around a bit to make the runs stay true to the next line drawn on the concrete.
Exactly the issue. Tile spacers just as well be in a dumpster, they are basically useless in most all cases. Chalk-line grids are the way to go. Then you can tweak-to-the-eye and make everything look good. Relying on using spacers will only result in a terrible installation.
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:23 PM   #11
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Many thanks to Sephora! I called the place, told them about my issues, and they said they'd get back to me. I fully expected them to return my call with the same line I'd had from our local store and the distributor for SE U.S.A., namely that the stuff had been discontinued and was no longer available. Well, I just got the return call - they have 1500 square feet of the stuff lying in their warehouse! Yipee!

I'll drive up to Georgia and pick the stuff up myself!

Many thanks again - I don't know how you found the site. I searched under 'Novo' and 'Peacock multicolor' and got zilch other than a pile of sites selling slate under that title.
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:47 PM   #12
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That is wonderful! I love Google!

I just searched peacock muticolor and then clicked "images" and saw your tile. I went to the site and figured they might have it since it was a design co.

Last edited by Sephora; 11-18-2011 at 02:49 PM.
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:53 PM   #13
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Solving discontinued tile issue


Though you''re right about the spacers, they do offer one invaluable service, which is why I like them in place when I can on the previous run I've worked on - they give you a bit of peace of mind knowing you haven't accidentally bumped a tile here or there out of place as you're wrestling around with an ornery tile that isn't exactly the right size. When not using them, I always try to stay alert for accidents by closely checking alignment as I finish each run. Saved my bacon a few times on this job, as I've gone back and had those "oh crap, how did I do that' moments when I've had to fix something before the thinset dried!

For a pro like you I'm sure it all becomes second nature, but for someone like me I like to have safeguards when I can and try to keep on the alert for any unintended screw ups when spacers aren't tenable.
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Old 11-18-2011, 07:32 PM   #14
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Solving discontinued tile issue


I understand. I always try to set up the install so that I am always backing away from the fresh-set tiles. But, always looking and checking and tweaking. After setting several tiles in a burst of energy I usually stand up and stand back and study what has been done. Frequently you can see more standing back than you can right on top of the tile. A satisfactory installation involves a lot of standing-around and observing time as part of the process.
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Old 10-03-2012, 08:03 PM   #15
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Solving discontinued tile issue


hello dose anyone know where i can get durastone roseberry pl-15 flooring tile they no longer make it was just woundering if someone had some laying around

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