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Old 03-16-2012, 09:32 PM   #46
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


Use the type that are closer to you. I don't know which will fit better. I also don't know whether you should/need to pry anything. I'd evaluate how flat the floor is before you create a high spot.

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Old 03-17-2012, 11:12 AM   #47
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


I know at least in the one area that had the bounce the center is about 1/4" lower than the edges (discovered this when using snap line). I guess we'll try to raise that joist a 1/4" and evaluate/raise the others accordingly.
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Old 03-17-2012, 10:43 PM   #48
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


When I shimmed my old kitchen floor, I put my 6 foot level on the floor across the low spot. Then I had someone sit in the doorway across the room to watch while I shimmed the floor from the basement. I put a little glue on the top and bottom of both shims, then tapped them into place and they told me when the floor hit the level. After that, I screwed the floor to the joist next to the shims (the second time... the first time I put the screw through the shims which splintered them into toothpicks... oops!)

But when I did my bathroom, I just screwed the floor to the joists, then leveled the worst places, then plywood, then leveled the whole thing - which was waaaay easier, but rather pricy. However, it was well worth it for the simplicity of tiling a perfectly flat floor.
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:02 PM   #49
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


It was a little scary, but we successfully (I think) raised the joists so that the floor is flat (or at least flatter than it was).

It was a little scary - using a 7' post and a automobile jack to raise the joists, but it worked amazingly well. We shimmed with 1/8" sheet metal pieces, cut to about 2"x4" pieces.

It seems to me that the floor is more secure. However - jumping on the floor still shows noticeable movement in the floor. Inspecting from below shows that the joists are flexing BETWEEN their support (I-beams).

I guess right now we will just plan on counting on the information on the "Deflecto-lator" being correct, and hoping for the best.

Thoughts?
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:08 PM   #50
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


In my opinion? No.

If your floor is flexing with you on it, it will flex more with all that additional weight on it. The deflectolater assumes that your joists are in good shape. A joist that flexes when the span is only 6 feet is not what I would consider "good shape"

It will stiffen up when you do the plywood layer, BUT the underlying support is still your joists. It would really suck to do all that work just to have the tiles crack and/or come loose
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:49 PM   #51
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


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Old 03-18-2012, 03:27 PM   #52
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


I'm not sure if "Big Stud's" head banging is to me or the OP.

However, I'm now that I have re-read, I'm confused by the post from earlier.

You jacked up the joist using a car jack and a post, and then shimmed what to where???

When you shim something, you put a wedge between the secure item and the moving item. I'm not following what you shimmed with these 1/8 inch pieces of metal. You jacked up the joist, then... what? And did you leave the post in place? Because if you didn't, what is holding joist that you moved?

In MichelleLand, a shim is a wedge shaped piece of wood/ plastic/ whatever. It is not flat. You tap a shim into place and it is held by the tension between the secure item and the non-secure item. Yes, I secure them afterwards, but they should be held by the pressure.

Can you post pictures?

Oh, and this:
Quote:
and hoping for the best.
is a recipe for a very very disappointing outcome.
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:43 PM   #53
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


I placed the pieces of metal under the joists, where they rest on the I-beam. I guess we will secure the 1/2" ply and see how much that helps, then go from there.

On DIY I saw them screwing and gluing plywood to either side of the joists. Would something like this strengthen the joists significantly? Would the best option be to screw and glue another 2x6 to the current joists?

I've actually started securing the plywood in the utility room, which didn't have as much flex as the kitchen. We've run into another problem.

As I said before, we're using #8 x 1-1/4" screws. I'm not sure what the problem is... some of the screws are counter-sinking, but some are not. I tried moving these over an inch, thinking I may have hit the seam of the t&g on the ones that aren't going in. This doesn't seem to be helping.

Do I need to try #10 screws? Pilot holes? I have no idea how to fix this problem, or why it is occurring to begin with.
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:47 PM   #54
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


At this point, I think you need to have a professional come in and look at this. Yes it will cost you some money, but doing this install on inadequate support the entire thing is going to be a disaster.
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Old 03-19-2012, 07:22 AM   #55
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


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I've actually started securing the plywood in the utility room, which didn't have as much flex as the kitchen. We've run into another problem.

As I said before, we're using #8 x 1-1/4" screws. I'm not sure what the problem is... some of the screws are counter-sinking, but some are not. I tried moving these over an inch, thinking I may have hit the seam of the t&g on the ones that aren't going in. This doesn't seem to be helping.

Do I need to try #10 screws? Pilot holes? I have no idea how to fix this problem, or why it is occurring to begin with.
I'm guessing that you didn't strip out the screws, that they just stopped and you couldn't get them in any deeper.

Or, are they spinning in place and not going any any deeper? Is this the reason that you asked about the #10's...you think that the 8's don't have enough bite, so they are spinning in place. Question: Are you using fine threaded screws, because you should be using coarse threaded screws...fine threads do not have enough bite in wood.

As far as buying bigger screws, that will only increase the amount of energy it takes to drive them in. So, if you're having trouble driving #8's, then you'll have more trouble driving #10's and you'll have more splitting.

As far as hitting the TG...after you moved the screws, did they then counter sink?

Based on your post, this is about as good as I can suggest.

Last edited by Ed911; 03-19-2012 at 07:44 AM. Reason: clarification
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Old 03-19-2012, 07:32 AM   #56
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


I'm wondering if the screws aren't stripping out. They will continue to turn, but aren't going any deeper. This surprises me, as the t&g planks they're going into are in good shape.

As far as the technique - those are a lot of helpful tips. Based off of what you said I think I'm doing it correctly. When I run into one that doesn't countersink I've just been moving it (usually 2-3 times) until I find a spot it will countersink.

The Ditra Handbook said to space the ply sheets 1/8" for expansion joints. Just curious - won't these fill in with thin set when I go to put in the Ditra? I'm sure it will work, as this is what they suggest, just wondering how the joints will expand if thin set gets into the gap.
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Old 03-19-2012, 07:49 AM   #57
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


Are you using fine threaded screws...if so, you need coarse threaded screws...other than that...you may occasionally hit a space...like the T&G, but moving the screw over should have taken care of this, as long as you're not moving them along the line of the T&G.

Fine threaded screws don't have enough bite in wood...and can strip out...

Last edited by Ed911; 03-19-2012 at 08:09 AM.
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Old 03-19-2012, 08:08 AM   #58
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


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Originally Posted by duffman56 View Post

The Ditra Handbook said to space the ply sheets 1/8" for expansion joints. Just curious - won't these fill in with thin set when I go to put in the Ditra? I'm sure it will work, as this is what they suggest, just wondering how the joints will expand if thin set gets into the gap.
Good question...I'd like to hear the answer to that myself...never thought much about it.
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Old 03-19-2012, 08:31 AM   #59
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


I think we will have to wait until JazMan comes back to answer that question.
Can't wait to learn about how that will work
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Old 03-19-2012, 09:21 AM   #60
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Securing plank subfloor to joists?


You may need to get Mike Holmes to come in and raze the whole house and start over from scratch ........ I'm sorry, couldn't help myself,

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