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Old 02-03-2010, 09:41 AM   #16
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Really?
Because I've found it to be the sole culprit for the problem with my grout in the bathroom. I didn't figure it out until a few weeks ago when I read a tip suggesting to not use hard water because it might have certain things in it that do more harm than good.

Since I read that I used a batch of my old materials - mixed them up and did a practice with old shards on a piece of backerboard and the thinset and grout actually mixed and set properly, this time.

Maybe not everyone has this problem - but I sure did. My previous tile project was a nightmare because of the water content. But of course my town has some of the worst water - we're under boil bans often because of it's content . . . so maybe my issue isn't quite that common.

So I should suggest, then, to mix up some first - do a practice run (you'll want ot, anyway, to see how it'll go before you start on your more expensive materials) and see how well the thinset and grout go up, etc. . . if I did that before i dove into my tile project i could have saved myself months of trouble.

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Last edited by Snav; 02-03-2010 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 02-03-2010, 11:16 AM   #17
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


BUD, i LOVE it when you talk in BOLD!!! Makes your voice sound soooo deep....
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50% down, 50% after all your complaints....

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hardwood floors,
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Old 02-03-2010, 12:10 PM   #18
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Well, Bud, now I'm curious - why shouldn't one use premixed thinset - especially on a floor?

I've always mixed my own -but that's been for the ease of only mixing what I need. Is there something structurally weak about premixed?
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:33 PM   #19
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Thanks for all the replies so far!

I'm still gathering up the needed supplies to do this project, but in the meantime I'm trying to read up on it as much as I can.

What do you guys think of adding #15 felt paper on the plywood before I add the warming system? Is this necessary?

Here is the link that mentioned it:

http://www.diynetwork.com/how-to/ins...tem/index.html
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:37 PM   #20
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud Cline View Post
CORRECT!
Install the plywood, caulk any seams, leak proof the entire room, install the primer necessary for the SLC, install the heat system, install the SLC, install the tile.


PERFECT!
Home Depot sells Level Quick made by Custom Building Products and it is an excellent self leveller.


TRUST ME!
Your room is small and very manageable. Four bags, tops.

When putting down the SLC, do I need to line the walls, or tub with anything? Will it be ok to have direct contact? Does the SLC need any room to expand/contract to avoid cracking in the future?

Sorry for all the noob questions.
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:39 PM   #21
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
What do you guys think of adding #15 felt paper on the plywood before I add the warming system?
WHY, pray-tell?

Henry I now think that you are overthinking this hole deal. You can't latch onto every little snippet of random information that comes up.

What good would the roofing felt do unless you are partial to the odor of warm asphalt inside your home.

The SLC must bond to the substrate otherwise it could curl. Primer with SLC's is mandatory for this reason.
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Old 02-03-2010, 01:46 PM   #22
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
When putting down the SLC, do I need to line the walls, or tub with anything? Will it be ok to have direct contact? Does the SLC need any room to expand/contract to avoid cracking in the future?
The walls should be lined with foam to allow for future expansion of the SLC and to seal the floor/wall juncture against escaping SLC. Foam sill-seal and spray adhesive can be used to install the foam. After the SLC is set up cut away the sill-seal above the SLC.

Toilet flanges must be protected. A small one gallon bucket will work for that purpose. Caulk it to the floor completely enclosing the flange.

The door(s) to other rooms must be dammed and caulked.

Casings should be removed or undercut ahead of the SLC and the space between the door jambs and the trimmer studs packed with foam.

The base of the tub should be caulked.

If there is a floor vent it too must be blocked out.

Close any gap where the SLC can find a way out because I can assure you if that stuff can escape, it will.
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Old 02-03-2010, 05:33 PM   #23
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
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WHY, pray-tell?

Henry I now think that you are overthinking this hole deal. You can't latch onto every little snippet of random information that comes up.

What good would the roofing felt do unless you are partial to the odor of warm asphalt inside your home.

The SLC must bond to the substrate otherwise it could curl. Primer with SLC's is mandatory for this reason.
I understand what you're saying. I've read numerous "how to" articles on this, and it doesn't seem consistent. Making the thread here has proven to be more informative than most of the articles I've read.

I don't like the smell of asphalt in house, so I'll skip the felt layer. haha
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Old 02-03-2010, 05:40 PM   #24
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud Cline View Post
The walls should be lined with foam to allow for future expansion of the SLC and to seal the floor/wall juncture against escaping SLC. Foam sill-seal and spray adhesive can be used to install the foam. After the SLC is set up cut away the sill-seal above the SLC.
Would a roll of 3 1/2in sill seal do the job?

Quote:
Toilet flanges must be protected. A small one gallon bucket will work for that purpose. Caulk it to the floor completely enclosing the flange.
Good idea!

Quote:
The door(s) to other rooms must be dammed and caulked.

Casings should be removed or undercut ahead of the SLC and the space between the door jambs and the trimmer studs packed with foam.
Pack it using the sill seal foam?

Quote:
The base of the tub should be caulked.
Since this will be covered, is there a specific caulk I should use?

Quote:
If there is a floor vent it too must be blocked out.

Close any gap where the SLC can find a way out because I can assure you if that stuff can escape, it will.
Luckily there is only one doorway, and the toilet to deal with.
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Old 02-03-2010, 05:45 PM   #25
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


I'm also going to install a pedestal sink. I understand the warming system shouldn't go near this, or the toilet so I'll make sure to keep it from these areas.

When anchoring down the base of the sink, is this something I would do once the tile is in place, or should the hardware be installed before I do the floor? I have access to the crawlspace below if needed. I'm assuming I can do this once the floor is completed.

Last edited by HenryG; 02-03-2010 at 05:51 PM.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:20 AM   #26
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
Would a roll of 3 1/2in sill seal do the job?
That will work fine. I have also used the foam product you can buy to seal a pickup truck cover to the pickup bed rails. It comes already glued with a peel-away paper on the sticky side. Pre-glued foam weather seal used for exterior doors can also be used. The latter products aren't as wide as the sill seal tho.

You want to be sure the foam touches the floor to keep the SLC from escaping under the foam and finding voids or gap under the stud bottom plates.

Quote:
Pack it using the sill seal foam?
Yup!

Quote:
Since this will be covered, is there a specific caulk I should use?
Nope, I use the cheapest painters caulk I can find for this purpose. This caulking process isn't intended to do any more than keep the SLC from escaping the room.

SLC can surprise a guy. If there is an escape route it will find it.

Quote:
When anchoring down the base of the sink, is this something I would do once the tile is in place, or should the hardware be installed before I do the floor? I have access to the crawlspace below if needed. I'm assuming I can do this once the floor is completed.
Yes, wait until everything is done and install the sink and any mounting hardware on top of everything. In your room all that is required is a pathway of the heat mats. Just don't run it under the sink area.

You will also have to make a small hole at the base of one wall for the wires of the heat mat to enter the wall cavity to travel to the thermostat. That hole will also have to be caulked before the SLC goes down.
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Old 02-04-2010, 09:29 AM   #27
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Here's some more helpful stuff I think.

The plastic portion of the heat mats can be stapled to the plywood sub floor. Don't spare the staples. The wires will be held down by the fact they are woven through the mats but that isn't good enough when you are trying to limit the height of the SLC pour. So...hot glue the wires to the floor about every six inches everywhere or those suckers will float up to and above the top of the finished SLC.

You will be trying to hold the overall SLC thickness to 3/8" and that is a minimum. More would be better.

Don't forget to prime the plywood BEFORE you install the heat mats. After priming, you only have twenty-four hours to install the heat and pour the SLC before the primer becomes moot and must be redone.

It's all do-able.
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:18 PM   #28
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
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That will work fine. I have also used the foam product you can buy to seal a pickup truck cover to the pickup bed rails. It comes already glued with a peel-away paper on the sticky side. Pre-glued foam weather seal used for exterior doors can also be used. The latter products aren't as wide as the sill seal tho.

You want to be sure the foam touches the floor to keep the SLC from escaping under the foam and finding voids or gap under the stud bottom plates.
I'll see about getting the widest option I can. I'd rather spend a little extra to ensure this doesn't turn into a disaster. lol

Quote:
Nope, I use the cheapest painters caulk I can find for this purpose. This caulking process isn't intended to do any more than keep the SLC from escaping the room.

SLC can surprise a guy. If there is an escape route it will find it.
Ok.

Quote:
Yes, wait until everything is done and install the sink and any mounting hardware on top of everything. In your room all that is required is a pathway of the heat mats. Just don't run it under the sink area.

You will also have to make a small hole at the base of one wall for the wires of the heat mat to enter the wall cavity to travel to the thermostat. That hole will also have to be caulked before the SLC goes down.
Ok that would make this a lot easier.

I'm going to order the mat today hopefully. I'll definitely post photos of my progress.

I really appreciate all the help so far!
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Old 02-05-2010, 03:20 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bud Cline View Post
Here's some more helpful stuff I think.

The plastic portion of the heat mats can be stapled to the plywood sub floor. Don't spare the staples. The wires will be held down by the fact they are woven through the mats but that isn't good enough when you are trying to limit the height of the SLC pour. So...hot glue the wires to the floor about every six inches everywhere or those suckers will float up to and above the top of the finished SLC.

You will be trying to hold the overall SLC thickness to 3/8" and that is a minimum. More would be better.

Don't forget to prime the plywood BEFORE you install the heat mats. After priming, you only have twenty-four hours to install the heat and pour the SLC before the primer becomes moot and must be redone.

It's all do-able.
When the SLC is added, I'm assuming I just need to spread it around a little, but not mess with it too much?

What do recommend to prime with? This step looks doable in a day's time.
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Old 02-05-2010, 05:09 PM   #30
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Preparing to tile in bathroom. Questions


Quote:
When the SLC is added, I'm assuming I just need to spread it around a little, but not mess with it too much?
If mixed properly the SLC works really good, it is some amazing stuff. You may have to encourage it into the corners and around the toilet flange. All in all it should do OK on its own.

Quote:
What do recommend to prime with?
All SLC's have their own compatible primer you should use.

Quote:
This step looks doable in a day's time.
Once you have all the materials on hand you can easily prep and pour the room in about forty-five minutes. It would be nice to have a helper.
Hint: To keep the SLC from clodding while mixing, have all of the required water in a five gallon bucket first. Then start the mixer as someone else slowly pours the powder into the water. Then mix for an additional two minutes after all the powder is in the bucket. If the instructions tell you something different then follow the instructions.

Use real cold water and the SLC will flow even better for you. I've been known to put ice cubes in the water in the summer time.


Last edited by Bud Cline; 02-05-2010 at 05:16 PM.
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