Info overload on tile setting

Subcooled · 02-27-2011, 10:50 PM

I've read literally hundreds of post and followed many links and there is some "info overload" on setting tile, so I want to condense it down to something managable.

I realize with each person there will be variance and whether to modify or not thinset depending on the application.

So here's what I gathered in the simpliest form.

My job:
I removed all drywall. Removed dry rotted areas of subfloor and wall joist and replaced with new wood.
With exception of shower area all new wall board will be greenboard and vapor barrier inside (for my location)

Floor
Tiles will be 12" x 12" on new 1 1/8" t&G subfloor
Support (joist) mofified to 16" OC
No premixed thinset.

1. Hardiboard attached directly to T&G subfloor with unmodified thinset ( no underlayment) usuing square head zinc deck screws.
2. Unmodified thinset on top of hardiboard, then tile.
3. Use a 1/2x1/2" trowel for the floor and back-butter the tiles for overall coverage of 85%

Shower wall
6 x6 tiles
1. No vapor barrier
2. Hardibaord full wall to cieling, using fiberglass mesh and thinset between joints.
3. Use liquid membrane to seal (water proof) front side of Hardiboard.
4. Use thinset on top of menbrane modified with latex.
5. Install tile from top down to shower pan.

Ok pro's your thoughts; One time to do it right!

JazMan · 02-27-2011, 11:49 PM

Hi Subcooled,

Yes, it's easy to get info overloaded. I'm wondering where you read some of the recommendations. Well, never mind.

The subfloor thickness and joist spacing is very good. You didn't mention the type and size of the joists and their span though. And yes, no pre-mixed stuff.

Floor:

1. Hardie can be set into fresh thinset of either type, unmodified or modified.
a. Why not use the screws made specifically for Hardie?
2. Hardie always wants you to use modified thinset not unmodified to set tiles.
3. 1/2x1/2 is a bit much for your basic 12" tile. Many tile setters get by with 1/4x1/4, I think 1/4x3/8x1/4 is the one to use unless there's something unusual about your tiles.

Shower Wall:

1,2,3 Sounds good.
4. Use modified thinset. Do not add latex to modified thinset though. What thinset will you be using?
5. Why from top down? You need to start at the bottom. Either the first row or the second row with a straight edge, (1 by 2, 3, or 4").

How are you building the shower pan? Or is it a fiberglass molded pan?

Jaz

bluebird5 · 02-27-2011, 11:53 PM

Yazman where are you?

bluebird5 · 02-27-2011, 11:53 PM

haha i typed that and you replied just before that

JazMan · 02-27-2011, 11:57 PM

I've been called "Yaz" before. Did ya miss me? Took a cruise.

Jaz

bluebird5 · 02-28-2011, 07:58 PM

you just always have good posts with ACCURATE info. i'm always eager to learn something

Subcooled · 03-02-2011, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

I'm wondering where you read some of the recommendations. Well, never mind.

Thanks for the responses. All the info from "this" site. I searched the forums and used the advise from your's and Bud's post's/responses. Some from "08"

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

The subfloor thickness and joist spacing is very good. You didn't mention the type and size of the joists and their span though.

2x8 on 48"

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

Floor:
a. Why not use the screws made specifically for Hardie?
3. 1/2x1/2 is a bit much for your basic 12" tile.

OK i'll use the screws for Hardie, I seen them next to the board at HD
I got the 1/2 x 1/2 from one of your older posts, but will use as you suggested now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

Shower Wall:
1,2,3 Sounds good.
4. Use modified thinset. Do not add latex to modified thinset though. What thinset will you be using?

Have not decided on that yet and will take your suggestion for thinset. We are rural and not many stores to choose from and have to go into the "city" for the 2 main box stores.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

How are you building the shower pan? Or is it a fiberglass molded pan?

I know you like Kerdi, but you and Bud posted a link to John Bridges and I will building a mortar bed and using an Oatay liner and drain or other if suggested.

JazMan · 03-03-2011, 06:03 PM

2x8's on 48"? YIKES. Usually when we see 48" o.c. the joists are more like beams. 6x8 or so. Tell me more.

Quote:

I got the 1/2 x 1/2 from one of your older posts

If I suggested a 1/2x1/2 there must have been a special reason. 1/4x3/8x1/4 is the best all round trowel for standard tiles in your size category.

If you use an unmodified for under the Hardie, I don't care which one you buy. I would use modified for all steps though. Any tile shop will carry modified thin set for the job. It'll say it meets ANSI A118.11 The orange place has Versabond for an economical yet very decent one, and Flexbond for more $$$. Lowes has Multipurpose and others, they have several brands due to location.

Quote:

I know you like Kerdi, but you and Bud posted a link to John Bridges and I will building a mortar bed and using an Oatay liner and drain or other if suggested.

John's forum has lots of good info in the "Liberry". You can also check the main pages at http://www.northamericantile.com/

Jaz

Bud Cline · 03-03-2011, 09:02 PM

Sub,

Quote:

I will building a mortar bed and using an Oatay liner and drain or other if suggested.

Before you finalize that idea, do yourself a favor and take a look at the Schluter Systems website. Look at their Shower Kits and Shower Trays and KERDI methods. Much much easier and a better system than the old method you are suggesting.

Subcooled · 03-04-2011, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazMan

2x8's on 48"? YIKES. Usually when we see 48" o.c. the joists are more like beams. 6x8 or so. Tell me more.

Maybe I worded wrong.
Original floor was 1 1/8" on 48 span.
When I put new T&G (1 1/8') I put 2 x 8 across the 48" span and are 16" OC to each other.

or in other words

My post/beam is 4x6 with 48" span and where there was nothing I installed 2 x 8 perpendicular to the 4x6, with the 2x8 16" between them.
Room is only 5 x 9.

Subcooled · 03-04-2011, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bud Cline

Sub,

Before you finalize that idea, do yourself a favor and take a look at the Schluter Systems website. Look at their Shower Kits and Shower Trays and KERDI methods. Much much easier and a better system than the old method you are suggesting.

I will look again, I was at HD today and all they had was the ditra. The guy had deer in headlight look

when I asked about the other Schluter products. I'll go back and see if I can find a seasoned guy or find another way to order the product. I am interested and want to be sure the pocket book can handle Kerdi.

Bud Cline · 03-04-2011, 05:11 PM

I can't begin to tell you how much those Home Depot guys can piss me off.

I can tell you that Home Depot is a fully authorized distributor for ALL Schluter System products. In fact they are probably the largest Schluter products distributor IN THE WORLD.

Another thing! Home Depot keeps a Schluter Systems binder at the desk in the tile department. That binder contains details and costs on every product Schluter sells.

Grab one of those idiots by the hair and drag his butt back to find that binder. See if the department manager has any idea where he slept last night, and ask him if just maybe he has seen a memo or been to a meeting that told him what to do with Schluter stuff.

Man they make me mad.