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-   -   How would I best prepare this garage floor for acid staining? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f5/how-would-i-best-prepare-garage-floor-acid-staining-8598/)

joeyboy 05-21-2007 05:21 PM

How would I best prepare this garage floor for acid staining?
 
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I just moved into this place, and there's green paint (or epoxy? I'm almost positive it's just paint though) on lots of the concrete slabs, as seen in the picture. You can see that the more weathered a spot is, the less green it has (lots of outdoor spots are bare, but the garage floor is almost fully covered still).

I am planning to get that green up, and to acid stain / seal / wax to get a good tan color going. What would be the best way to get that off before doing acid etching / preparation for stains? Use a pressure washer to blast it off (3500psi)? Chemicals? Chisel? I'm sure all of those would work, I just really don't want to spend a ton of time doing an inefficient method lol

joeyboy 05-23-2007 11:24 AM

you said there are several ways, and that you do grinding with a diamond disk. Any others you'd recommend?

I don't think I'm gonna bother trying to do an overlay until I try an acid stain first, since if the current slab takes teh stain properly there wouldn't be much point doing the overlay.(edit- re-read your post about it saving back breaking prep. Wouldn't I need to do teh same preparation regardless of whether I'm trying to apply a stain or an overlay? I thought both would need a pure, etched concrete surface, no?)

BTW, saw your site a few days ago and loved it, I was actually mapquesting your showroom but I'm ~3hrs away, otherwise you would've already met me lol.

joeyboy 05-25-2007 09:31 PM

where did dcsurfaces' posts get removed (advertising too much lol?)

anyways, whadda ya'll think I should do? Part of me is thinking to just
- heavily wash/clean floor, maybe sand/scarify a bit to promote adhesion
- apply primer (lanco liquid bonding agent)
- apply a thin overlay (probably some generic resurfacing concrete from home depot)
- stain that (i'd want to epoxy, but that seems a lil involved, and I'd have to wait for the concrete to age, cuz I'm almost positive that the failure rate of epoxied garage floors is way higher on newly poured cement)

DCsuperstore 05-26-2007 11:48 AM

Prepping concrete for acid stain
 
You've got the right idea. Your plan sounds good. You are right about the epoxy not being a great product to use on garages. We've resurfaced a bunch of garages that had epoxy chipping off the floor.

Good luck with your project!

DCsurfaces
www.DCSurfaces.com

joeyboy 05-26-2007 08:02 PM

Damn they can't hold you back huh!?

joeyboy 05-26-2007 08:03 PM

My method would basically have been to prepare the floor for an overlay, which I'd stain. If I could just remove that green coating, I could just stain that. I have to imagine that it'd be easier to get rid of a green coating, than to lay a whole new overlay on my garage.

Any suggestions on how to just get the green off? Paint thinner? Super paint thinner? :)

DCsuperstore 05-29-2007 08:28 AM

I know it is more work, but you are better off with grinding down to the bare concrete, especially if you don't use an overlay. If you use paint thinner (we would probably use straight Xylene) you will most likely run into 2 problems. First the paint you are trying to remove may get very gummy and hard to remove completely. Second, when you acid stain without an overlay, the acid will be reacting with whatever paint thinner you used to remove the green. You will most likely come out splotchy and with very uneven color variations.

I realize what I am risking here, but that's why I initially suggest our overlay. You would only have to lightly scuff the green paint (with an abrasive disk) and apply the overlay. Then you have the right palette for the acid stain to react well. Our overlay is different from other overlays or resufacers in that way. It can bond to a scuffed paint surface with no problems. It sounds crazy and probably goes against everything you've heard, read or learned of overlays, but that's what sets it apart.

Hopefully this will be deemed as helpful, professional advice and not an unsolicited advertisement. Our company tries to help DIYers whether they use our products or not. I trust the administrators of this forum will see that I am posting on related topics and not just polluting all the posts and topics with our name and products irresponsibly.

joeyboy 05-30-2007 11:08 AM

What makes your overlay/resurfacing cement hold more than any other resurfacing cements? What if I added bonding agents to another resurfacing cement, would I still likely be able to go over scuffed paint?

joeyboy 05-30-2007 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCsuperstore (Post 46720)
I know it is more work, but you are better off with grinding down to the bare concrete, especially if you don't use an overlay. If you use paint thinner (we would probably use straight Xylene) you will most likely run into 2 problems. First the paint you are trying to remove may get very gummy and hard to remove completely. Second, when you acid stain without an overlay, the acid will be reacting with whatever paint thinner you used to remove the green. You will most likely come out splotchy and with very uneven color variations.

I was actually looking to get a mottled effect, so if it comes out uneven that wouldn't be too bad imo

DCsuperstore 05-31-2007 07:29 AM

Our overlay has bonding agents in it to help it grab to less than desirable surfaces. Other resurfaces with bonding agent may hold as well. I don't know if other brands will hold up to tires, etc. I know ours will.

I STRONGLY recommend using some kind of resurfacer before you acid stain. I've seen too many customers not take that advice, go through all the trouble of prepping the surface, not resurface in any way, just acid stain with tragic results. I can almost guarentee it won't look good. What ever you use to remove the current stain will not react with the acid stain. Additionally, you can never be sure why the previous homeowner painted the concrete. Maybe their are oil stains, etc. and the acid will not react with that either.

I really encourage you to take the extra time to resurface before you acid stain.

joeyboy 05-31-2007 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCsuperstore (Post 47108)
Our overlay has bonding agents in it to help it grab to less than desirable surfaces. Other resurfaces with bonding agent may hold as well. I don't know if other brands will hold up to tires, etc. I know ours will.

I STRONGLY recommend using some kind of resurfacer before you acid stain. I've seen too many customers not take that advice, go through all the trouble of prepping the surface, not resurface in any way, just acid stain with tragic results. I can almost guarentee it won't look good. What ever you use to remove the current stain will not react with the acid stain. Additionally, you can never be sure why the previous homeowner painted the concrete. Maybe their are oil stains, etc. and the acid will not react with that either.

I really encourage you to take the extra time to resurface before you acid stain.

does 'anyone' sell their bonding agent separately? Never saw it on.. that site :)

joeyboy 05-31-2007 07:37 PM

Damn I wish I wasn't over here near tampa, I'd love to come see you guys. And if you're new in that industry, I've got a couple slabs that I'd love to let you experiment with !!!!

joeyboy 05-31-2007 07:38 PM

and not to keep posting over and over, but if you're already doing an overlay, why even bother staining?

If I'm going for a mottled tan effect, why wouldn't I just mix up several different batches of varying tan shades, and then lightly swirl them together as I'm laying it? That would save time and no worries about the stain fading or anything. I've already experimented with mixing diff color mortars and mixing together (nothign special, I can snap some shots if you'd like, but it's really easy / cool to mix diff colors and barely swirl, gives good effects)

DCsuperstore 06-01-2007 09:33 AM

"Someone" may have recently posted more products on their online store--including acylic additive by the gallon and 5 gallon. FYI...

We've been in business for about 10 years, but we are always experimenting with new products and techniques. If you're ever in the area, please stop by.

I would like to see pictures of your dyed concrete swirling technique. You could do that with the overlay you put on the garage. It may save you some time and money. After you do that, you may want to apply a clear sealer to protect the new surfaces from stains.

joeyboy 06-01-2007 10:37 AM

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Again, these are nothing special, I was just messing around to see how it'd come out.

I was using some white mortar (versabond I believe, must've been the only white mortar I'd have had since I was tiling my room when I made those), with black sakrete powder pigment added in.

I made some batches of white, some of grey, dark grey, and black. I mixed the individual color batches up normally (with drill attachment), and mixed different colors by hand (when I tried using the drill, it blended the colors way too much).

They aren't anything, just some little squares to practice swirling with, but I think that if I were to play around with colors I could make a pretty nice overlay (i'm thinking I'd be making like 5 batches of varying tan shades, then swirling together while placing. Nothing as contrasting as that, those were just the colors I had on hand)


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