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Old 07-22-2010, 01:41 PM   #61
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Well I havnt quite got the retaining wall finished but it was close enough for me to go ahead and order the flagstone and more sand.

So I went down to the local brick and block shop and told them I needed to order some flagstone and sand, and that I also needed to return the original caps (pictured previously). Well he ended up telling me that he couldnt take those back because they had to be special ordered for me. I was a little PO'd about that because I just wasnt happy with the way they looked, completely un-natural. But I decided not to say anything further about it because I dont think it would have led anywhere but south. So he starts pricing up the flagstone for 200sqft with about a 1/2 ton of sand. I had a price that I had in my head, based on the average price per sqft that I had seen. The stuff is 2" thick (range from 1.5-2.25") and was only... get this... $195/ton! So he figured up how many tons I would need for my 200sqft. Their conversion was 130sqft/ton so it came out to right at 1.5tons... only $292!!! Thats only $1.46/sqft. Hell the thin flagstone they had at Lowe's was over $7/sqft and it didnt look nearly as good and was only about an inch thick! So I was like, hell throw in another 100sqft worth and I'll do a damn flagstone sidewalk out to the pit too! So I got 2.3T flagstone and 1T sand DELIVERED to my house with tax for only $559. I can not believe it. Needless to say, there are no hard feelings about not being able to return the old caps :D

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Last edited by eemichael83; 07-22-2010 at 10:55 PM.
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Old 07-22-2010, 01:51 PM   #62
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Look at it this way...you're happy with the deal on all your new stuff.

And you can always sell off what you don't want anyway.

Good luck with getting her all finished up.
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Old 07-22-2010, 02:03 PM   #63
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Look at it this way...you're happy with the deal on all your new stuff.

And you can always sell off what you don't want anyway.

Good luck with getting her all finished up.
Thank you! The new supplies are scheduled to be delivered tomorrow and I'm taking the day off. I'm not sure I'll be able to sell off those caps, but I might be able to find some kind of use for them. Maybe I'll build a little dog house with the old caps as a concrete base or something. Anyway, I'm just hoping that their sqft estimation was correct. As I'm reading I'm seeing that 130sqft/ton is more like the approximation for the 1-1/4" flagstone. Mine is thicker, so maybe more realistically it is only 100-110 sqft/ton. Either way, I should have enough leftover to at least do some stepping stones out to the pit and it still ended up being a little cheaper than I originally thought it was going to be... it helped offset the cost of the wasted caps for sure and even the unexpected cost of the retaining wall.

I'll keep everyone posted as always and will snap some pics of the flagstone when I get it. Thanks for the encouragement
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Old 07-22-2010, 02:54 PM   #64
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Michael, things are looking good so far.

As for the cultured caps, that's not really uncommon for them not to accept the return, especially on non-stock accessories. Here, I can't even return stock material w/o a huge restocking fee.

Glad you found a deal at your local yard on the flag, that's actually a little cheaper than I get flag for here. Often times, folks just automatically think that the big boxes are cheaper w/o ever looking into it. It sounds like you not only got a better price, but more importantly, better value.

As for the coverage, I generally figure 80-100 sq. feet per ton for that thickness of flag. It really depends alot on the quality of stone that gets shipped to you. If you end up with a bunch of huge pieces that aren't condusive to the space, you may have a lot more waste.

Keep up the hard work, and find a way to put that dog to work in your favor!
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Old 07-22-2010, 09:35 PM   #65
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^Thanks very much for the comments. You've been a pretty big help throughout the project and I appreciate it.

On to today's progress!




I finished placing and leveling the edgers and then I shoveled some dirt from the high and 'open' side to the low side to try and level it out a bit. Now she's all ready for the drain pipe and some sand

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Old 07-22-2010, 10:23 PM   #66
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All Right! Now you're talking...what a difference!

I'm really looking forward to see how all that good flagstone looks.
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Old 07-23-2010, 10:38 AM   #67
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Stone's here! Bright and early too! Guess I'll hit the McDonalds for some breakfast and then head to Home Depot for a few small items I need then get to work. I'll snap a couple of pic of the flagstone when I unwrap the plastic when I get back. Gonna be a long day
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Old 07-23-2010, 06:22 PM   #68
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Well, I got the yard mowed and went out to get a few things to work on the pit today. I ended up having to take a few steps backward. The start and end of the edgers were off by about 3" in elevation. I guess it could have been worse over the course of about 40ft lol. So I found the section that started to slant upward (unlevel) and luckily it was the last 10 or 12 blocks that I had laid down. I pulled these up, dug out a little from under them, and laid them back down, only this time level lol. Now the start and end of the wall are at the same height I've also had to take a break and come inside every half hour or so... its bee VERY hot.

SO, on to the actual progress for the day. I got the fabric down and the holes drilled for the drain. I also placed the pipe and put a little silicone around the connections, I still need to test this out by pouring water in the pit to make sure it doesnt leak around the pipe.





And here is the first pic of the stone! It doesnt have much of the marbling that I seem to have remembered but it is quite colorful with shades of brown, red, and black.



I'll have better pics of the stone once I get some off the palet... its a pretty tall stack. I also picked up a large masonry chisel to cut the stones rather than using the diamond blade. This will give me a rougher edge at the cut that will look a little more natural.

Just tested the drain... works great, no leaks.

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Old 07-23-2010, 06:43 PM   #69
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2 more things:

- Keep the fire away from that pex, or sheild it somehow, or convert over to metal for the first few inches.

- Your chilising plan sounds good on the surface, but I highly doubt it will work out as planned. Odds are, that flag has seams/veins running through it's cross section. That makes it extremely difficult to chisel w/o breaking it into many pieces. I hope I'm wrong, but I saw every piece of flag we lay. What you can do is saw 2/3 of the way from the backside, and then hammer/chisel the front to get a somewhat irregular edge.

BTW, that flag looks very nice, much more uniform than what comes out of the ground here. Mind telling me where that stuff is originated from?
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Old 07-23-2010, 07:03 PM   #70
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Jomama,

I was kindof assuming that the PEX would be OK since it only sets in the wall about a 1/4". The wall is almost a foot deep so there is around a foot until you get to the PEX. On top of that, I'll have about 3" of Egg Rock that the fire will sit on so there shouldnt be any direct heat at the hole.

I will probably try chiseling the first piece and if it doesnt work out, then I'll just scrap the idea and do as you suggest. I saw somewhere that someone said to lay a piece of angle iron under the line you are chiseling to keep pressure on where you're chiseling from the other side... maybe that will help. The only downside to sawing through 2/3 or so is that when I'm using it as the cap on the pit, you'll still see the sawn part of the edge.

I'm not really sure where the stone originated from. I'm in Bowling Green, KY though if it comes from nearby. I can ask the folks at the yard the next time I'm in there.

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Old 07-23-2010, 07:33 PM   #71
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That does look like some nice stone there.

I also read about using the angle iron under the stone when you cut it, but I have never tried it. Anyway, you have two ways to try it now.

And in the end, are you going to have to worry too much about your drain line? I would think that there may not be that much heat at the bottom of the pit nearly a foot through the wall. And if for some reason it does fail, the water will just drain into the ground like it always has.

I guess your experience will tell us what transpires when the time comes. I sure hope it doesn't cause you any trouble.
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Old 07-23-2010, 08:38 PM   #72
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Wow this stuff is really really heavy. I'm finished for the day, simply because I can't even get the top stone off the pallet. I'm going to either have to wait until someone can help me unload the stuff or I'm going to have to cut it while its still on the pallet. A little more progress for the day, put down most of the sand. I'll probably wait until after I get the cap finished on the pit before I put the rest of the sand down and level:



The stones are pretty dirty too so I wont know exactly what they look like till after I put them down and pressure wash them.


Cocobolo - the only reason I'm interested in keeping the pipe from leaking is the fear of too much water settling under the stones and then possibly freezing in the winter and expanding enough to crack the mortar that I'm going to put between the stones. I shouldnt have much trouble though since the sand base should allow any water under the patio to drain anyway.

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Old 07-24-2010, 12:03 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by eemichael83 View Post
Wow this stuff is really really heavy. I'm finished for the day, simply because I can't even get the top stone off the pallet. I'm going to either have to wait until someone can help me unload the stuff or I'm going to have to cut it while its still on the pallet. A little more progress for the day, put down most of the sand. I'll probably wait until after I get the cap finished on the pit before I put the rest of the sand down and level:



The stones are pretty dirty too so I wont know exactly what they look like till after I put them down and pressure wash them.


Cocobolo - the only reason I'm interested in keeping the pipe from leaking is the fear of too much water settling under the stones and then possibly freezing in the winter and expanding enough to crack the mortar that I'm going to put between the stones. I shouldnt have much trouble though since the sand base should allow any water under the patio to drain anyway.
Well that certainly makes sense.

Now you need to go and hunt down your strongest buddy!
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Old 07-24-2010, 04:15 PM   #74
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A friend offered some help, so I got the stones unloaded. After getting the top one off with some help, the rest werent too difficult to move by myself. I'm pretty sure I'm going to end up killing a lot of grass by laying them out like this, but its pretty crappy grass and needs attention anyway so I dont care lol



Closeup of a few still on the pallet:
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Old 07-24-2010, 04:33 PM   #75
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Love the colours in your stone.

It looks similar to the sandstone that we have here on this island. It appears to be sedimentary. Don't forget to ask the store next time you go there...several of us are interested.

Hey, if the grass doesn't like it, you can always plant green concrete!

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