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Old 04-21-2008, 10:05 PM   #16
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


here is what the floor looks like with vinyl, chipboard, and another layer of vinyl removed. see the felt underlay?

how to get this off easily?


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Old 04-21-2008, 10:05 PM   #17
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


here's a picture of the funky 1950's flooring.. oh, and see top right corner? they weren't kidding about the electrical under the chipboard subfloor... this wire must have been crushed good by the cabinets near the walls.

i can understand why they did this though. accessing the wall from the crawlspace is near impossible because the wall sits in the middle of a 18" thick stone foundation wall. and access from the top would be through the attic, but there is no attic access hole.. only other option is to run the wire along the ceiling, or floor. looks like they chose floor. doubt very much this is to code.. will have to be fixed.


Last edited by Knucklez; 04-26-2008 at 04:02 PM.
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Old 04-21-2008, 10:09 PM   #18
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


this is cool... found a trap door. must have been for the original kitchen addition build. there must have been no access from the basement (there is a tiny hole now where the furnace has room for ducting).

also confirmed that the joists are 1.5" wide by 10" deep, spaning 12ft. should hold weight of concrete counter. wall foundation is stone, about 18". thick. in all, the concrete countertops (which weigh about 400lbs when done!) will have its weight distributed over a stone foundation and two joists along the wall with the window. along the other wall it will span over the same stone foundation plus many joists. in both cases, i believe there to be sufficient floor strength to carry the weight.

this will come in handy for access crawl space to do wiring and plumbing.


Last edited by Knucklez; 04-26-2008 at 04:01 PM.
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Old 04-23-2008, 07:08 AM   #19
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


I like your asbestos tiles
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Old 04-23-2008, 09:07 PM   #20
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what? that's aspestos? i thought aspestos was for insulation.. not tiles. or are you speaking of the floor felt (grey paper stuff)?

or maybe just pulling my leg?...

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Old 04-23-2008, 09:31 PM   #21
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklez View Post
what? that's aspestos? i thought aspestos was for insulation.. not tiles. or are you speaking of the floor felt (grey paper stuff)?

or maybe just pulling my leg?...

Asbestos was used for MANY building materials, including floor tile. (sorry to say so)
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Old 04-23-2008, 09:36 PM   #22
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More information on asbestos: http://www.epa.gov/asbestos/pubs/ashome.html

Asbestos Flooring: http://www.inspect-ny.com/sickhouse/asbestoslookB.htm

Don't panic!!

It's not the "end of the World". Do your research and educate yourself.
(Example: It takes alot of asbestos, over a long period of regular exposure to cause serious health issues. I am not saying that you should thro caution "to the wind", just that, if you did disturb some material, then learn what to do, to properly get rid of the rest of it.)

2 months ago, I tore out the 2nd floor (asbestos tiles) in my new (to me) 1930's farm house. EPA allows you, as a home owner to do your own removal. They ask that you follow the safety guidelines, especially, if it is exterior siding material.

(Just so you know; it's the Commercial, Public, & Multi-Resident Properties, that fall under a different "jurisdiction" and specific licensing, qualifications, checks, inspections, protocol, etc.....in terms of requirements for removal and control)

Last edited by AtlanticWBConst.; 04-23-2008 at 09:47 PM.
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Old 04-24-2008, 07:39 PM   #23
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I don't know for a fact it's asbestos. I just know that alot of asbestos was used for decades in everything from plaster, floor glue, lineoleum, vinyl tiles, insulation and siding so the probability that your tiles are made of asbestos would be high. You can get these things tested very easily by sending them to a lab thru the use of a home testing kit.
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Old 04-25-2008, 08:35 PM   #24
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thanks peeps, i'm not panicking. actually i was (briefly) trained in asbestos abaitment years ago. i just didn't know it was in floor tile.. all i ever saw was asbestos insulation around piping and also some flange gaskets.

agreed that labs can test, but i don't want to wait. i'll just assume that it IS asbestos and proceed accordingly. i think you might be right after doing some google research. this kitchen was remodeled in the 50's or 60's (based on galvenized plumbing and decore evidence). that was just at the peak of asbestos popularity...

anyway no worries here.. but removal of the felt will be a bit tough.. need to use water based product as sanding is definately a BAD idea.

how about removing felt with paint stripper?
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Old 04-25-2008, 10:05 PM   #25
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Wow, looks like you have your work cut out for you. Keep up the good work, and also keep up the updates with the pics! Can't wait to see it complete. In a month I am about to start a kitchen update myself
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Old 04-26-2008, 03:45 PM   #26
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great, make sure you post your progress on this website.

hope you read what i have done and learned what NOT to do.. ha.
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Old 04-26-2008, 03:50 PM   #27
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found some good web info for my situation:
http://www.asbestos-institute.ca/buildings/tiles.html

i added some stuff, see purple text

Supplies and tools
  1. Broad, stiff-bladed wall scraper, or floor scraper.
  2. Utility or hook knife.
  3. Tank type vacuum cleaner with disposable dust bag and metal floor tool (no brush).
  4. Large size heavy duty impermeable trash bags (or closed impermeable containers) with ties, typaes, or string to tie shut, and tags for labeling.
  5. Hand sprayer or sprinkling can.
  6. Liquid dishwashing detergent or liquid wallpaper remover mixed with water to make a dilute solution (1 oz. liquid in one gallon of water).
  7. mask with hepa filter
  8. throw away clothing
  9. gloves
  10. 6mil poly and tuct tape to seal off the room
  11. plastic drop sheet to cover floor that is NOT being worked on (you don't want to step on the stuff and trail it around)
Complete removal of an existing adhered sheet vinyl floor covering
If complete removal is required, follow these instructions:

Reminder: Never sand an existing floor covering
  1. Remove any binding strips or other restrictive moldings from doorways, walls, etc.
  2. Make a series of parallel cuts 4 to 8 inches apart and almost through the backing, parallel to a wall.
  3. Start at the end of the room farthest from the entrance door, and pry up the corner of the first strip, separating the backing layer. Pull the top layer back upon itself slowly and evenly at an angle that permits the best separation and most of the backing and top layers will pull free. Remove this strip, gently turn it over and roll face out into a tight roll. Tie or tape securely and place in a heavy duty impermeable trash bag or closed impermeable container for disposal.
  4. Repeat the above on the next two strips but do not remove anymore than a total of three strips at this time.
  5. Remove the felt remaining on the floor in the stripped area by wet scraping. Wet scraping is done as follows:
    • Pour the detergent solution into the sprayer or sprinkling can.
    • Thoroughly wet the residual felt with this solution. Wait a few minutes to allow the solution to soak into the felt.
    • Stand on the remaining floor covering (not the felt) and use the stiff-bladed scraper to scrape up the wet felt. Re-wet the felt if it dries out or if dry felt is exposed during scraping. Pick up the scrapings as they are removed from the floor and place in a heavy duty impermeable trash bag or closed impermeable container. Scrape all felt from this floor area before proceeding further.
    • Repeat the above on the next series of strips. Do only one three-strip area at a time. Stand on the remaining floor covering or clean floor (do not stand on the felt) to scrape up the felt.
    • Repeat this operation until the felt has been removed from the whole floor. Close full bags tightly, and seal securely for disposal. Identify with a label stating "Caution *** Contains asbestos. Dispose in an approved landfill only."
  6. damp (not wet) mop the floor with throw away cloth.. i.e., use a "swiffer" or microfiber mop with sprayed solution on it.
  7. When the whole floor has been cleaned free of felt, let it dry and vacuum up with a wet/dry vac with hepa bag installed any dirt using the vacuum cleaner with the metal floor tool.

    Reminder: Do not dry sweep.
    Position the vacuum cleaner so that the discharge air does not blow on the floor being cleaned.
  8. Carefully remove the Hepa rated dust bag from the cleaner and place in a heavy duty impermeable trash bag or closed impermeable container for later disposal.
  9. When the floor is dry, it is ready to have a new resilient floor covering installed. Follow the floor covering manufacturer's instructions (or www.diychatroom.com) .

Last edited by Knucklez; 04-26-2008 at 03:55 PM.
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Old 04-26-2008, 10:48 PM   #28
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my kitchen reno - complete remodel (with concrete countertop)


Are you planning on doing the counter tops yourself? Do you just use reg concrete or something special?
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Old 04-27-2008, 01:24 PM   #29
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ha.. i will EVENTUALLY get to the concrete countertops.. promise.

here is a website that someone else documented their concrete countertop experience:
http://www.instructables.com/id/Conc...--Solid-Surfa/

yes, i am doing this project myself. it will be my first attempt. i have all the tools and supplies. as you may have noticed from this thread and my other ones, i detail every thing i can and also discuss my philosophy of WHY i did it this way, or that way. i try to show the REAL challenge of a DIY project, and with some fearless attitude, to overcome... well, as best as can be expected for an ameture.

i read the book and watched the video, did lots of web research.

got products from and instructions from:
http://www.concreteexchange.com/index.jsp

the canadian reseller is:
http://www.shopinterstar.com/

the tools i purchased from ebay, i.e. variable speed double insulated 4" wet grinder, and concrete grinding pads, various grits.

i also purchased the decorative add-ins from ebay.. but i can't give you any hints on this until i get to that point of the kitchen remodel

Knucklez

Last edited by Knucklez; 04-27-2008 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 04-27-2008, 01:40 PM   #30
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ok.. so back to this felt removal. this is a lot more difficult than it looks. the felt will scrape off after being sprayed with soap/water mixture and use of a 4" drywall knife.

i tried excacto blade and paint scraper.. they were both a waste of time. it took me almost an hour to scrape 3 boards, about 4' long with use of the paint scraper.. yes it actually exposed the wood.. but wow, what an effort!

so i think i'll go back to use of the drywall to remove the GREY felt paper. then i'll use a sander to remove the underlay stuff.. i don't know what this is. its tough as leather. is it glue? is it the felt after being compressed for 40 years? its basically merged itself with the actually wood and is freak'n impossible to remove.

but i think if i remove the grey felt to get to this leather like under belly.. i can just sand that off.. i don't want to use a sander.. but looks unaviodable if i want to restore the wood.

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