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-   -   problem with rebuilding a starter motor (http://www.diychatroom.com/f46/problem-rebuilding-starter-motor-191848/)

noquacks 12-10-2013 05:23 PM

problem with rebuilding a starter motor
 
People,

Bosch starter, before dismantling it, I tested it with 12v, and clutch popped out, starter motor turned. It had about 100,000 miles on it, and the car did have trouble starting with that one, so yanked, it, put in new, and now trying to rebuild this one until the instaled one quits.

So, bought a new brush kit, spec'd out the bushings, and cleaned it up a bit. I believe I put it back together all ok......LOL

So, then, applied 12v to the rebuilt starter, and no start. Motor makes no sound at all. Clutch though, does pop out. man, where did I go wrong? I did notice a tad of smoke (sooo tiny), from the batery clamp connection point (12v is from a car battery, with jumper cables). other than that, no go.

Tips/condolences apreciated.

Windows on Wash 12-10-2013 05:44 PM

All the wires hooked to the right poles?

noquacks 12-10-2013 05:56 PM

I believe so. Hey, maybe I switched the poles of the solenoid?? I mean, if poles of solenoid are switched, would the clutch still pop out? I kinda doubt it, but not 100% sure......

joecaption 12-10-2013 09:43 PM

There is no clutch on a starter, do you mean Bendix?
http://www.prestolite.com/pgs_training/training_4.php

noquacks 12-11-2013 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecaption (Post 1277193)
There is no clutch on a starter, do you mean Bendix?
http://www.prestolite.com/pgs_training/training_4.php

There is a "clutch" on a starter. Ever take one apart/look at a diagram? At least, thats what people call them, guesss we could call them something else. Whats a bendix (without me looking it up on wikipedia)?

PoleCat 12-11-2013 06:44 AM

I can't remember now which one is which but one type uses inertia to propel the gear into place while the other uses a magnetic solenoid to pull a plunger that drives the gear into place. If the solenoid is attached to the starter this is the type with the plunger.

joecaption 12-11-2013 07:01 AM

http://www.2carpros.com/articles/how...solenoid-works

iamrfixit 12-11-2013 10:03 AM

Did you clean up the commutator that the brushes run against? If so you probably shorted it out. The small spaces between the commutator segments can be easily contaminated with metal or carbon particles from cleaning and end up shorting out the armature.

I wouldn't bother with it, If you bought a quality rebuilt or new unit it will likely last as long as the original, not worth keeping it around in storage. Pretty small cost given the length of service. Usually a rebuilt unit will either fail quickly during the warranty period or last a very long time.

noquacks 12-11-2013 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoleCat (Post 1277246)
I can't remember now which one is which but one type uses inertia to propel the gear into place while the other uses a magnetic solenoid to pull a plunger that drives the gear into place. If the solenoid is attached to the starter this is the type with the plunger.

magnetic solenoid- plunger, with spring, activates the clutch, with a fork, ......but again, thats not the problem- the clutch works. The problem is the MOTOR.

noquacks 12-11-2013 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamrfixit (Post 1277321)
Did you clean up the commutator that the brushes run against? If so you probably shorted it out. The small spaces between the commutator segments can be easily contaminated with metal or carbon particles from cleaning and end up shorting out the armature.

I wouldn't bother with it, If you bought a quality rebuilt or new unit it will likely last as long as the original, not worth keeping it around in storage. Pretty small cost given the length of service. Usually a rebuilt unit will either fail quickly during the warranty period or last a very long time.

Yes, fixit, I did clean up the commutator, and the stacks. Shop manual says to do that. Now, if I shorted it, did I ruin it? Not clear on that- I followed the usual method of sanding down slightly the copper area, with fine grit, then dusted off.

The rebuild is junk. Squeals like mad upon start up. This original Im trying to rebuild is OEM Bosch, made in Germany. The bushings are even better condition than the new ones included in the rebuild kit for this starter! So, I kept them on.

Thanks, fixit.

noquacks 12-11-2013 04:53 PM

nice article, joe- now I know the bendix is the sprocket "gear"- whatever- still, the article confirms the starter has a clutch.

noquacks 12-11-2013 06:07 PM

took it apart, checkd commutator for ohms to shaft, and I get no circuit/infinity (thats a good unit, I understand), indicating no shorting (right, guys??)

put it back together. will batery test it tomorow, too late for me now- bedtime. Also, dark outside.
Thanks, people.

PoleCat 12-12-2013 06:00 AM

Did you do anything with the solenoid? The plunger also is the contact for the big current that drives the motor. The contacts must be clean and free of oil, not burnt to a crisp etc. The plunger must be able to slide evenly so it slams all the way in and doesn't get lodged in its sleeve.

noquacks 12-12-2013 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoleCat (Post 1277579)
Did you do anything with the solenoid? The plunger also is the contact for the big current that drives the motor. The contacts must be clean and free of oil, not burnt to a crisp etc. The plunger must be able to slide evenly so it slams all the way in and doesn't get lodged in its sleeve.

thnaks, pole. Thinking about it- contacts are clean/no burnt. Now, remembering, before I took the whole thing apart, the starter DID work (I probably did not make that clear). So, solenoid, I assume should be OK. Right?

Also, doesnt it mean solenoid is ok since now it at least, does move the clutch forward into position. just that at that point, no motor activation. I mean, according to one source, that IS the solenoid go/no go test.

Wanted to try it today, but no time to jump it with batteryu cables. but dont worry, I wil get back to yous hopefully by sunday. Big thanks for your support in this perplexing matter, people!!

rusty baker 12-12-2013 06:18 PM

I have a Ford starter here that I rebuilt for the same reason. All these part store parts seem to be junk anymore. I just changed the fuel pump on my work van three times before I got one that worked. The new window motor that I put in the driver's side a couple months ago has already quit.


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