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CMHbob 04-18-2011 08:41 PM

Ugly Paint Touch Up
 
I just finished painting the interior walls of my house. I needed 7 GAL, so I bought 1 5GAL and 2 1GAL buckets of flat wall paint of the same custom color on the same day from a reputable, national paint store. It was all mixed at the same time, but in 3 separate buckets.

Now I need to touch up a few spots in each room. When I use the paint from the last 1GAL bucket, it is a slightly different color than the rest of the wall, which was painted from the 5GAL bucket. To make the spot go away, I have to re-paint the whole wall.

Why is this happening? What can I do to prevent it in the future?
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CMHbob
Visit my blog for my latest rehab project and reno tips!

jsheridan 04-18-2011 09:26 PM

Bob, believe it or not, touch up is a very complex thing and not as easy as one would think. Ben Moore has white papers on touch up. There are so many variables that can affect touching up, color, paint type, applicator type, length of time, coverage and sealing of the previous coat being touched up, lighting, to temperature. If a wall is painted under certain environmental conditions and touched up under another the likelihood that it will match is slim. I tell guys who work with me, and my customers, there is no such thing as touch up, it's a misnomer, get it out your head. I say that because a lot of painters have a "we'll just touch it up" attitude. Some paints are better than others for touching, but none will be perfect. At the very least you have to give the touch up the same amount of time to dry as the wall you are touching up, as color development is a function of drying/curing time and that could be quite some time. I see you're doing a flip and have a lot of construction going on. When I encounter those situations, I try hard as I can to postpone final coats until practically all possibility of incidental wall damage is eliminated, for the very reason we're discussing. All that said, there are times when I have to touch up and hope it flies, and then there are times when a full wall recoat is required. Use the same applicator, the same source material, try to feather the material out and hope for the best.

Brushjockey 04-18-2011 09:28 PM

Not totally uncommon, but I might ask who was the reputable store?
Most pros know to intermix, or "box" all paints of one color so all material is exactly the same.
Get an empty 5 and pour one to another until all are intermixed. For this exact reason.
I have found that most of the time buying all material at once from a single store the match is pretty good. Sometimes they don't get shaken enough and some tints get trapped in the lid. Even with a single gallon it is good to stir on site.

ltd 04-18-2011 09:46 PM

get a empty 5 gal bucket pour half of paint from 5 gal to other ,then take one gal and put it in one five the other in other five mix .now you have 2 buckets with 3 1/2 gal ,pour one bucket in to other back and forth. what im saying is mix all paint together :whistling2: its possibly their is a slight color difference ,but how are you touching up? .their is a skill to do good touch ups ,first thin your paint with water .straight paint will lay up on wall and you will see another layer of paint .also use a like texture if it a place where you rolled use a roller ,mini rollers work good for this ,brush use a brush. depending on surface and lighting if you look for it you will always see a touch up

spraygunn 04-18-2011 10:27 PM

Hey CMHbob<
Talk to twenty painters and you’ll get twenty different answers. Everything jsheridan says I agree with, however every manufacturer responds a little differently with different line of products . I know I’m going to get a lot of flack for saying this, however touch-up problems are the main reason I refuse to use Benjamin Moore paint. Even Sherwin Williams has many wall flats that won’t touch up but others do just fine. As for the difference in colors from one can to another is a human problem. All you can do is get made and tell the store they screwed up. I have ordered four gallons all marked the same, but when I opened them one is pure white. The clerk put the label on all the cans but didn’t add the tints in one gallon. This has happened more then once. Frustrating when you have employees waiting while you go back to the store to get the problem fixed. You can’t avoid the human factor.

jsheridan 04-18-2011 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spraygunn (Post 632181)
Hey CMHbob<
Talk to twenty painters and youíll get twenty different answers. Everything jsheridan says I agree with, however every manufacturer responds a little differently with different line of products . I know Iím going to get a lot of flack for saying this, however touch-up problems are the main reason I refuse to use Benjamin Moore paint. Even Sherwin Williams has many wall flats that wonít touch up but others do just fine. As for the difference in colors from one can to another is a human problem. All you can do is get made and tell the store they screwed up. I have ordered four gallons all marked the same, but when I opened them one is pure white. The clerk put the label on all the cans but didnít add the tints in one gallon. This has happened more then once. Frustrating when you have employees waiting while you go back to the store to get the problem fixed. You canít avoid the human factor.

Thanks Steve, I hear you about the BM, however, I'm finding the Aura line is pretty good at touch up, so far. I find though, with BM, they have a better track record with consistency from one gal to the next, unlike SW. My experience with SW is if you buy four gallons, you get four shades. And yes, I've bought the gallons with no tints added and I've opened one or two on the job that didn't make it to the shaker, which for a deeper color is a return to the store as well. The world would be a great place if other humans didn't occupy it.:laughing:

spraygunn 04-18-2011 11:32 PM

Good one Joe, can I use that one?

chrisn 04-19-2011 03:14 AM

The world would be a great place if other humans didn't occupy it:thumbsup:

jsheridan 04-19-2011 06:03 AM

Feel free to quote me anytime:thumbsup:. Actually, the saying is better when the word people is used in place of humans:yes:.
On topic, I was at BM's tech library and this came up in another unrelated search. I'm pretty certain there is other documentation there as well for those so interested to search.

http://www.benjaminmoore.com/bmpsweb...eLabel=fc_home

CMHbob 04-19-2011 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brushjockey (Post 632116)
Not totally uncommon, but I might ask who was the reputable store?
Most pros know to intermix, or "box" all paints of one color so all material is exactly the same. Get an empty 5 and pour one to another until all are intermixed. For this exact reason.

I didn't want to give anyone a bad rep so I did not mention the store name earlier. But you asked and the store is Sherwin-Williams. When I went back to the store and asked the manager about the color difference, he said "it shouldn't happen. All colors are mixed by computer and should be exactly the same." Not much help, eh? Thanks for the tip to intermix. I'll try it next time.
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CMHbob
Visit my blog for my latest rehab project and reno tips!

CMHbob 04-19-2011 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsheridan (Post 632113)
Bob, believe it or not, touch up is a very complex thing and not as easy as one would think. ... Use the same applicator, the same source material, try to feather the material out and hope for the best.

Wow - I never thought it was this complicated but results speak for themselves and mine are ugly. I used a 3/8" nap roller for the original coat and a good brush (i.e. the best one I could find, not Lowe's or HD brand) for the touch ups. The brush works great for trimming and cutting in corners. Apparently, not so great on touch ups. I feel a little better that it is not as easy as it looks. I'm going to take your advice on the next project.
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CMHbob
Visit my blog for my latest rehab project and reno tips!

CMHbob 04-19-2011 10:10 AM

Question for ltd
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ltd (Post 632134)
their is a skill to do good touch ups ,first thin your paint with water .straight paint will lay up on wall and you will see another layer of paint .also use a like texture if it a place where you rolled use a roller ,mini rollers work good for this ,brush use a brush. depending on surface and lighting if you look for it you will always see a touch up

Excellent advice. But why thin the paint? Won't this lighten up the color, creating a bigger color differential?
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CMHbob
Visit my blog for my latest rehab project and reno tips!

jsheridan 04-19-2011 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsheridan (Post 632188)
I find though, with BM, they have a better track record with consistency from one gal to the next, unlike SW. My experience with SW is if you buy four gallons, you get four shades.

There's more to gallon to gallon consistency that a computer can't account for, like keeping the dispensers clean and in good working order, precision of dispensers, for example. Historically, I haven't used a great deal of SW, but my cousin has. He was on a job of mine where this customer was strictly SW. We bought four gallons of the same color, which he opened and declared we had Sherwin's Rainbow. Yes, with the lids off all four, you could see a slightly different shade to each without doing a droplet test. Apparenty, working for an SW devotee, he dealt with this all the time, hence the name Sherwin's Rainbow. I find that BM's match so closely that boxing isn't quite the issue, besides I don't box until the final coat. That said, I could easily get caught off gaurd relying on BM's record but using SW mixes. Don't feel bad Bob, it's a learning experience, and all have some cost.
(Disclaimer: I can't say that all SW stores sell rainbows, it could be a problem local to that market.:laughing:)


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