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Old 09-10-2011, 09:16 AM   #31
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


I use to have the roller mark problem bad. I just finished my basement and came here for advice. Joe explained how to properly use a roller and I did one area that is 28 X 12 and not one roller track. Mine is such when you come down the basment stairs, there is a cut out in the wall where I'm putting a hand rail and spindles. You are at one point are level with the ceiling and if there were roller marks they would really stand out. After coming here and listening, I learned how to roll paint correctly. I just wish I had know what I learned here 35 years ago. I don't mind painting at all now. I use to hate it.

Thanks Joe

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Old 09-10-2011, 10:03 AM   #32
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Mike, that's great to hear. Hearing success stories like yours makes it all worthwhile. It shows that you're a great student. I know what I know because of the amount of time and energy dedicated to what I do, and the care I take in my approach to it. Just as you would be in your chosen field. And just as you wouldn't expect me to know the intricacies of your trade, I don't either. In spite of my time in the business, I still approach some jobs nervously and walk away from some and shoot up a prayer. To make paint work for you, to look good and last, requires a bit of knowledge, patience, and application. It's not easy. I think that some who come through here dismiss those points because they think painting is so easy that anybody can do it, and to ask for help on such a simple task is beneath them. They're asking for help, but I can read that attitude between their lines. And they don't fare so well here, because they're not receptive. I've seen it in young, inexperienced guys who have worked for me, as well as those here. It requires a bit of humility to learn as well. Some are just to know it all to be good students. Thanks for your kind words and being a great example of the power of DIYChatroom.
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Old 09-10-2011, 05:08 PM   #33
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Your quite welcome Joe. When someone spends 'their time' to help me, I feel a duty to thank them and let them know their efforts are appreciated.

I have received help here on several topics.

This is clearly the best DIY site on the web.

So the thanks go to you.
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Old 09-11-2011, 04:02 AM   #34
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Anybody CAN paint, nothing to it.

Painting properly, now, that is a whole different can of worms
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Old 09-11-2011, 08:06 AM   #35
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Amen brother. We may not be able to change the world, but we can change our little corner of it.
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Old 03-09-2012, 04:05 PM   #36
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Quote:
Originally Posted by jsheridan View Post
It sounds to me like your not applying the product uniformly, which is easy to do on ceilings as a DIY, especially if you don't have the proper workspace set up. If the texture seems it would be visible, patching may be in order. Read the articles I suggested, cause if I'm correct in the uniformity issue, the articles will be helpful. I would also suggest you hang up on Brilliance, and switch to something like Ben Moore Super Spec flat, easy to use, nice and flat. Chalk it up to a learning experience and rolling practice. Good Luck.


I’m hanging up on Brilliance… I’ve had the same experience as the OP just recently. The SW manager heard my complaints and told me to try their SuperPaint flat, free of charge! So I’m trying to steer my attitude in the right direction and give this ceiling one more try, three times a charm… right?!

I primed the entire room with SW HighBuild primer using a 18” x 1/2” Wooster sleeve. Overall it came out nice, uniform texture and uniform coverage. I read jsheridan’s tutorial 5 times to make sure I was using the right technique, lol, sure enough it seemed to work! I then used a 18” x 3/8” Purdy white Dove sleeve to apply the SW Brilliance ceiling paint. I choose this roller as a beginner because I figured it would force me to use less while maintaining good coverage. Also, I heard it was one of the best for low lint. The first 10ft went on great using jsheridan’s technique, but the further I got the worse it got!? By the time I finished the 25x11 foot room I had flashing going on all over half the room. I ended up using 2g of Brilliance to cover the ceiling (1st coat). The following day I tried to correct the flashing areas by using another full gallon of the paint (2nd coat). The same result, maybe even worse. At this point I got up on a ladder and inspected the ceiling, sure enough I was getting smooth and rough areas… causing the blotching and dark shadowing across my ceiling. It doesn’t look that bad when the can lights are on, but during the day when the natural light crosses the ceiling you see it and it’s horrible.
My theory, whenI load the Brilliance ceiling paint lightly across the ceiling the damage is already done. It’s filling in the grooves and texture. By the time I spread it out only a little texture returns, but not enough to create a uniform look over a 3x6 area. I’ve put it on heavy and light, both ways, it doesn’t seem to matter. In the end after applying 3g of the stuff I decided to re-texturize the ceiling with the HighBuild primer. It looked awesome, I was tempted to leave it at that, but I know that’s not right, lol. So I went back early this week and tried to apply another layer of Brilliance on the ceiling, really paying attention to my technique and the way I loaded the 18” roller in the pan. This time a 3x11 foot area came out OK, I was applying it uniformly and the first run looked great, but by the second run the problem started reoccurring…. SOB!!! I started cross rolling at this point, mid-stream to try and correct the issue. I ended up putting another gallon of the stuff on the ceiling only to have it turn out like crap. I’ve given up on the Brilliance at this point and switching to the SuperPaint. I figure if I can make the ceiling look sweet with the HighBuild primer, maybe I can do the same with the SP!?

My question to you guys… I’m I using the wrong roller with Brillance? I’ve used Purdy’s 3/8" and 3/4" white Dove, neither seem to work well. At least for me, the Wooster applies the HB primer just fine and Purdy's 1/2" white Dove works well with SW Duration on the walls. So I don’t know what is wrong, if it’s me or the wrong combination of tools…?

See pictures for evidence of issue.


SW brillance_three quarter_Purdy Dove_2 by Zquicksilver, on Flickr


SW brillance_three quarter_Purdy Dove_1 by Zquicksilver, on Flickr

Last edited by jawadesign; 03-09-2012 at 04:15 PM.
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Old 03-09-2012, 05:06 PM   #37
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


To be honest, in the second picture you simply did not apply enough paint. I say this over and over.......load that roller sleeve up with paint! It should be nearly dripping wet with paint. I use a 1/2" Wooster & it puts on plenty of paint. Don't push.......lay the paint on. You do have to move rather quickly as ceiling paint sets up quickly. Even doing it right you can still get uneven results with Brilliance. I wish I knew why........I loved Classic 99 ceiling paint.
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:03 PM   #38
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


that's the crazy thing about it... i did load the roller (3/4") with paint, practically dripping and applied it nice and wet. it actually cracked in some areas it was so thick. it seems, at least with me, the brilliance goes on and creates unforseen texture out of nowhere. that's why i asked the questoin here, i can't figure it out i'm going to try and use the SuperPaint in the morning with a 1/2 Wooster, going parallel with the windows and perpendicular with the main entrance.

i originally started in a corner (1st run) and did a 3x6 area, then crossed over to the other side of the room and did the other half, also a 3x6 area. using a 18" roller...
i moved on and began the (2nd run) just behind the (1st run), crossing back and forth, barely overlapping. I did the entire 25x11 room like this, dividing the (11ft) in half, working my way down the long portion of the room.

is there some sort of paint extender i can add to keep it from drying so damn fast, maybe thin it out a little, this stuff seems like pancake batter at times.

thanks!
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Old 03-09-2012, 11:01 PM   #39
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


maybe i'll use this guys painting technique on my ceiling tomorrow... this guy does a really good job!! it's one of the better videos on YouTube, as far as learning and watching others paint ceilings. OH wait, it's JackPauhl, no wonder it looks so easy, lol! and to be honest, i did paint my ceiling in a similar fashion, stupid Brilliance! i'm going to give it one last shot tomorrow...

http://www.youtube.com/user/jackpauhl

and NO, i didn't run into problems because i didn't paint like this guy...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r31Wy...feature=relmfu
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:18 AM   #40
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Brilliance would be my last choice( well maybe not last) for ceiling paint. That being said try adding some of this
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:01 AM   #41
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Chris, I still haven't tried your PPG recomendation for ceiling paint. I have a gallon on standby......

Jawa........sorry about your problems with Brilliance. I, too, am very frustrated with it. Used to be you could get by with ONE coat of Classic 99 on a ceiling. Now, TWO coats of Brilliance doesn't even look good. Very disappointing.
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:35 PM   #42
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


I have been looking at the pics and have a question
Are they anywhere near smooth and level?
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Old 03-12-2012, 01:41 PM   #43
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


If you're referring to the drywall, yes, it is smooth and level, but not perfect. First, I re-leveled the ceiling joist in the kitchen area, it was gutted. Second, I blended the old and new ceiling at about the 2/3rds point, where the small partition can be seen. Third, I skimmed the entire ceiling with 1/4" sheet rock. I tried my best to make sure the last layer of sheet rock was secured and not bouncing around after installation. I think I see where you’re going with this and it could be the reason for of my problems. At this point I cannot blame the SW Brilliance paint entirely. I think it's about 6 factors that contributed to my roller marks and inconsistent texture.

1. ME (not enough experience 1st time doing a ceiling with 18" roller)
2. Not working quickly enough!
3. Not loading paint evenly, in the pan and during application
4. I had a fan blowing warmer air into a cooler room.
5. The ceiling is not perfect and using a larger roller will definitely skip over low spots.
6. Over working the paint and maybe using a 3/4" roller wasn't the best idea!?
7. SW Brilliance paint and me are not compatible…

It’s kind of odd, but the 1/2” Wooster sleeve (Lowe’s blue colored) and the SW HighBuild primer went on perfect and blended into the nice area of my ceiling covered in Brilliance!? That’s the part I don’t get. I went back and looked at my ceiling for about 10min this weekend. I found that a 3rd of my celling looked like a pro did it. I could only find one area with a slight difference in texture, but you had to look for it. The other 2/3rds came out like crap… IMHO. I went back and talked with the SW guys again and decided to I will try CHB, verse Brilliance from SW. It costs about 20% less a gallon and I can’t see a big difference between the two. It’s has a much thinner viscosity according to them and I think it will be better suited to me. I’m also consulting a more experienced painter, I may have him do all my ceilings at once!? We shall see…

In the meantime, I went back and skimmed a super tight layer of mud over the heavy textured areas and areas that had deep cavities in the paint. In my experience, it seems even the HB primer cannot correct these troubled areas. This was my only solution… what a pain in the ass!


Filled in rough areas...


Kitchen_paint_patch by Zquicksilver, on Flickr


Pic of HighBuild primer


Primed_SW highbuild_half inch wooster by Zquicksilver, on Flickr

Last edited by jawadesign; 03-12-2012 at 01:46 PM.
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Old 03-12-2012, 03:34 PM   #44
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


Jawa, I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune, but glad to hear that something I said was helpful. If 1/3 of your ceiling came out nice, then the other 2/3's should have as well. Unless. From all that you've written, I'm suspecting that you're crushing the roller nap, and the 2/3's is the result of a worthless nap. Did you read that part in my articles, how to break a roller cover in?

In the first ten minutes or so of use, the cover shouldn't be pushed past a few sqaure feet, then dipped again, then a few sqaure feet. During this time the paint is working toward the core of the cover, filling the reservoir. If the roller isn't sufficiently filled and you stretch it too far, ie, attempt to cover normal per dip square footage, the nap will crush and the cover will be worthless. With a crushed nap, there is no resevoir effect, and you'll only be applying that which you pick up with each dip, when you should be pulling some from the resevoir as well. The resevoir then gets refilled with each dip and the cycle continues.
From what you're descibing, and from what I can see in the pics, this sounds to be the case. Might it be?
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Old 03-12-2012, 04:37 PM   #45
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SW Brilliance Ceiling Paint - Seeing Roller marks


What he said( arrow pointing up)

If it was me I would also ditch the 18 in cover, you don't need it.

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