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Old 02-09-2012, 01:29 PM   #1
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Please help - We bought a house that was built in 2001. Unfortunately the builders went with the absolute minimal on everything. We had re-painted bedrooms thinking that the paint on the walls had been put on with primer first. We used paint with primer just in case. My daughter put things on her walls using the glu squares that were supposed to not damage walls - HAHA as they fell down they took off all layers of paint down the brown under the paper.
I attempted to do patches but the paint did not match (even though the mix was the same but done at a different time - they were not even close). I thought I would just repain the entire wall with the new color so I had to remove several more items that were held up withthe glu squares. Large areas of paint pulled away from the wall leaving large bubbles underneath. Ok - so I will peel the paint off and start from scratch. The top areas that pulled away pulled off in large clean sheets exposing the white paper and smoothing compound underneath. Then as I went down the wall it pulled off down the brown paper in many areas.
Of course I was unable to save the adjoining walls from pulling as I reached the corners. As a result I ended up peeling paint off the entire room. Large areas of exposed white paper and white compound and many many large areas of rough brown paper.
I was told to use TSP and wash the walls down before I prime - there was orange peel on the wall so we have smooth and rough spots. I started washing the walls and I was left with smeared white all over, more peeling paper, rough brown areas and a big mess. There is no way I am going to get these walls smooth with paper edges all over the place that roll off when you rub them and rough brown areas where there is no paper. We tried using orange peel in other areas of th ehouse that we had to spot fix and it never matched the rest of the wall.
Do you suggest just ripping out the dry wall and starting fresh with new dry wall or is there a way that is not going to take days to get this right? I am a novice at this and I am doing it alone.

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Old 02-09-2012, 02:29 PM   #2
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Oh boy- does sound like a mess. And maybe more than a DIY project.

If it were me- Id get it to a reasonably sound surface- then thoroughly coat in Gardz to seal everything and give a starting point. This primer is clear, thin and penetrating. It also makes a moisture barrier so any following work will not reactivate problems sealed in.
Then I would skim all smooth, sand and reprime ( gardz again or any good primer sealer)
You said you have a texture on walls- (I come from the smooth wall part of the country). This would be the retexture time. then paint to finish.

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Old 02-09-2012, 02:45 PM   #3
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rschmidt View Post
Please help - We bought a house that was built in 2001. Unfortunately the builders went with the absolute minimal on everything. We had re-painted bedrooms thinking that the paint on the walls had been put on with primer first. We used paint with primer just in case. My daughter put things on her walls using the glu squares that were supposed to not damage walls - HAHA as they fell down they took off all layers of paint down the brown under the paper.
I attempted to do patches but the paint did not match (even though the mix was the same but done at a different time - they were not even close). I thought I would just repain the entire wall with the new color so I had to remove several more items that were held up withthe glu squares. Large areas of paint pulled away from the wall leaving large bubbles underneath. Ok - so I will peel the paint off and start from scratch. The top areas that pulled away pulled off in large clean sheets exposing the white paper and smoothing compound underneath. Then as I went down the wall it pulled off down the brown paper in many areas.
Of course I was unable to save the adjoining walls from pulling as I reached the corners. As a result I ended up peeling paint off the entire room. Large areas of exposed white paper and white compound and many many large areas of rough brown paper.
I was told to use TSP and wash the walls down before I prime - there was orange peel on the wall so we have smooth and rough spots. I started washing the walls and I was left with smeared white all over, more peeling paper, rough brown areas and a big mess. There is no way I am going to get these walls smooth with paper edges all over the place that roll off when you rub them and rough brown areas where there is no paper. We tried using orange peel in other areas of th ehouse that we had to spot fix and it never matched the rest of the wall.
Do you suggest just ripping out the dry wall and starting fresh with new dry wall or is there a way that is not going to take days to get this right? I am a novice at this and I am doing it alone.
In most cases when a new home is built the builder does not want to pay much to the subcontractors to get the job done so they have to use cheaper products. With that being said, most likely the paint is a builders grade paint and it's possible it is flat paint as well. Who knows if it was primed. Most paint companies prime though.
So, let's start at square one. If you tore the paint off and the some of the paper from the drywall then you will have to prime with an oil based primer. The reason is because oil base primer will dry quickly, seal those brown little pieces of paper and it will not bubble the paper. You do not need to prime all your walls since there is paint on there already. You do not need to clean the walls with TSP (not sure who even told you to do that) unless there are greasy areas or severely soiled areas. Once you prime those areas, skim them out with drywall mud, then sand smooth. After that, prime those areas and paint your walls.
Lastly, if you are a novice, I would NOT replace the drywall board. To me, you'd be biting off way more than you can chew.

Last edited by BraniksPainting; 02-09-2012 at 02:52 PM.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:45 PM   #4
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Ok well Lowes told me to use the TSP. After the first wall I began to realize the mess it was making - a big smeary mess. The next step was to use 180 grain sandpaper to smooth out the orange peel junk left on the walls (we hate it but that is what was there when we moved in). It did a good job smoothing down the orange peel tha twas on the white paper areas but it also pulled up more edges of the white paper - into the already brown areas making deeper grooves. So I quite doing that as well. I vaccuumed up the white powder mess and gave up for now - I currently have 2 walls that have been washed and or sanded. Lowes also sold me ZINSSER Bulls Eye 1.2.3 primer. Is that any good? But my real problem is how do I ge tthe edges to be smooth and even if sanding pulls the edges up? UUUUGGGGHHHHH!
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:28 PM   #5
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Quote:
Originally Posted by BraniksPainting View Post
In most cases when a new home is built the builder does not want to pay much to the subcontractors to get the job done so they have to use cheaper products. With that being said, most likely the paint is a builders grade paint and it's possible it is flat paint as well. Who knows if it was primed. Most paint companies prime though.
So, let's start at square one. If you tore the paint off and the some of the paper from the drywall then you will have to prime with an oil based primer. The reason is because oil base primer will dry quickly, seal those brown little pieces of paper and it will not bubble the paper. You do not need to prime all your walls since there is paint on there already. You do not need to clean the walls with TSP (not sure who even told you to do that) unless there are greasy areas or severely soiled areas. Once you prime those areas, skim them out with drywall mud, then sand smooth. After that, prime those areas and paint your walls.
Lastly, if you are a novice, I would NOT replace the drywall board. To me, you'd be biting off way more than you can chew.

Wrong, not at all necessary. Gardz is NOT oil based and is formulated for just this kind of mess.
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:36 PM   #6
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rschmidt View Post
Ok well Lowes told me to use the TSP. After the first wall I began to realize the mess it was making - a big smeary mess. The next step was to use 180 grain sandpaper to smooth out the orange peel junk left on the walls (we hate it but that is what was there when we moved in). It did a good job smoothing down the orange peel tha twas on the white paper areas but it also pulled up more edges of the white paper - into the already brown areas making deeper grooves. So I quite doing that as well. I vaccuumed up the white powder mess and gave up for now - I currently have 2 walls that have been washed and or sanded. Lowes also sold me ZINSSER Bulls Eye 1.2.3 primer. Is that any good? But my real problem is how do I ge tthe edges to be smooth and even if sanding pulls the edges up? UUUUGGGGHHHHH!

NO, no and no. Get out of Blowes and go to a real paint store. Gardz is what you want and never take advise from Lowes paint personal who 5 minutes before was in the gardening section from which they also know nothing.
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:37 PM   #7
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rschmidt View Post
Ok well Lowes told me to use the TSP. After the first wall I began to realize the mess it was making - a big smeary mess. The next step was to use 180 grain sandpaper to smooth out the orange peel junk left on the walls (we hate it but that is what was there when we moved in). It did a good job smoothing down the orange peel tha twas on the white paper areas but it also pulled up more edges of the white paper - into the already brown areas making deeper grooves. So I quite doing that as well. I vaccuumed up the white powder mess and gave up for now - I currently have 2 walls that have been washed and or sanded. Lowes also sold me ZINSSER Bulls Eye 1.2.3 primer. Is that any good? But my real problem is how do I ge tthe edges to be smooth and even if sanding pulls the edges up? UUUUGGGGHHHHH!

NO, no and no. Get out of Blowes and go to a real paint store. Gardz is what you want and never take advise from Lowes paint personal who 5 minutes before was in the gardening section from which they also knew nothing.
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Old 02-09-2012, 05:12 PM   #8
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Some things behr repeating... lol
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Old 02-09-2012, 05:37 PM   #9
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


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Wrong, not at all necessary. Gardz is NOT oil based and is formulated for just this kind of mess.
Never tried the Gardz. I'll have to try it. But for now, I'm sticking with my original post and the oil primer untill I have a chance to try Gardz. Why fix what ain't broke.
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Old 02-09-2012, 05:51 PM   #10
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


I agree with Brush Jockey; this problem may exceed the skill of a novice. Use the Gardz primer. When you smooth the wall, use all-purpose joint compound. Do not use lightweight joint compound. This is easy to handle and sand, but it is too soft to support the weight of a paint film.
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Old 02-10-2012, 03:33 AM   #11
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


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Never tried the Gardz. I'll have to try it. But for now, I'm sticking with my original post and the oil primer untill I have a chance to try Gardz. Why fix what ain't broke.


cheaper, works better, does not stink, water clean up. etc, etc
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Old 02-10-2012, 04:44 AM   #12
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Hi! I was just in the same boat with rough drywall in a 70's home. I did not attempt it myself, but I can tell you how the pros did it, 'cause I watched. They used sheetrock brand all purpose joint compound and skimmed the walls with a wide drywall knife, about 12" or so. Then after the compound was dry they sanded with drywall sanding sponges, a wide one for the center of the wall and an angled one for corners, around the baseboard and ceiling. The sponges were med. on one side and fine on the other. They started with the med. and went back over it with the fine. Then primer (one that works for new drywall) and paint. Be prepared for the mess and use plenty of drop cloths, especially over the shut door to the room, no sense in getting it thru the whole house. Be sure to dust the wall down good before primering. If you are not good with a drywall knife and I wasn't, best to find a drywall guy and let him do it.
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:22 AM   #13
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


i have used zinsser peel stop in this situation ,with very good results ,but you know what i think gardz and peel stop are very familiar,as in the same thing but different labels on can but who knows? maybe ric knows
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Old 02-10-2012, 07:28 AM   #14
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


I have also compared peel stop and gardz. I don't think peel stop is quite as good at making the vapor barrier. Both penetrate and seal. Peel stop seems to be a more rubbery flexable coating.
PS smells less, Gardz- while not bad like oil, has an odor that I find hard to take. But disappears when you recoat it with something.
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:03 PM   #15
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Repairing a very poor initial paint job


Forgot to mention, they used a smaller (5") drywall knife to cut in the corners, and used the wider one for the bulk of the walls. I have tried this myself and it is really hard to do. It was hard for me to be able to run that drywall knife up the wall with the skim coat, but the drywall pros make it look easy. Gotta respect them. By the time you buy all the tools to do it with, you could hire someone and have it done right and save yourself the aggravation. It will be aggravating enough just dealing with the mess. As good as they were, they still had to touch up a few places after the primer went on and reprimer the touch ups. This is really hard to do, imo, and best left to the pros. I am not sure about primering the walls before, "cause mine all had paint on them. The paint guys on here are good, I have taken their advice many times, no probs. I think they are probably right about using the primer first to seal everything off. They just didn't have to in my case 'cause the walls were already painted, not down to bare paper, as in your case. Good Luck!!

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