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Mroe192 02-09-2013 06:06 PM

Redoing oak kitchen cabinets- primer question
 
I am about to take the plunge and repaint my builders grade oak kitchen cabinets. The wife wants them painted white, and I understand that is going to be a huge undertaking. I most likely will take the plunge and use FPE brushing putty to eliminate the grain. I understand an oil based primer is needed after using the brushing putty. I plan to spray latex with my HVLP for the top coats to get a wonderful smooth finish. My question relates to the primer...

I want to spray the primer, however my main work area is the garage which also has our hot water heater in it with a gas pilot light. Pretty sure that wouldn't be a good idea. Would brushing the primer and then sanding smooth cause any issues with the final product?

jsheridan 02-09-2013 06:49 PM

Mroe, feeling ambitious? I've never worked with brushing putty, but I understand it's a lot of work, and anything from FPE is not cheap. Not trying to talk you out of it but go in with your eyes open, once you start there's no stopping. I've painted a number of oak cabinet systems and never had a complaint about the grain. You might sample a door first to see if it passes muster.

I did watch a faux decorator use a similar product for a project on oak that couldn't tolerate grain due to the project's detail. I know her primary supplier is Faux Effects, I've applied enough of their product through her. It may be their product. She did quite a bit of work with that product with relative ease and it looked great, and I think they're a green company, so everything's latex. You might want to check for an FPE competitor product.

If you're planning a spray finish look, do not use a brush/roller at any stage. You'll risk brush marks and they're not easy to sand out. You'll have enough sanding with brushing putty. If you can wait till good weather, you can shut the pilot off long enough to spray, air out, and re-ignite. Or, take the plunge and turn your kitchen into a total spray booth, you're there anyway with the cabinet bodies. Don't forget the pilot light on the stove when you shoot the bodies.

Mroe192 02-09-2013 07:11 PM

Jsheridan, any thoughts regarding use of a filler such as MH Ready Patch or Wunderfil? What type of primer do you normally use when refinishing cabinets?

jsheridan 02-09-2013 08:08 PM

I'm familiar with MH, but not Wunderfil, assuming they're relatively the same. Since bputty and MH accomplish the same task, I can't see a difference in outcome, but I think that more than merely filling alone, bputty adds a thin veneer. The big difference lies in application. And that would turn on how much detail your cabinets have. Applying a filler to detail with a brush would be far easier than a spackle blade, but I think that blading would be far easier on the flats than brushing a product of a melted peanut butter consistency. I've done quite a bit of filling details over the years with fingers as tools. The MH or Wunder may thin to a brush or rag app consistency. Maybe a combination of both.

There are pros and cons either way, and various work arounds. I would suggest that if you're committed to 86'ing the grain (for the new schoolers, 86 means gone or do away with), first be sure the painted grain is out of the question. And then experiment. With the amount of time and expense involved in such a project, some advanced fooling around and small expense is justified, and may just prove to reveal a more effective and efficient means to your end. See if a local kitchen place or similar have any dinged doors on the cheap to play around with.

As to primers, always a bonding primer for cabinets,
Zinsser BIN, pigmented shellac, superior bond, great stain blocker, excellent underbody for enamels, dries quickly but difficult to use if inexperienced, clean up with ammonia, since it sticks to glass you can eliminate sanding on smooth surfaces
Zinsser 123 or Inslx Stix, both latex bonding primers, easier app and great underbody, 123 about one hour recoat, Stix around three hours, least offensive odor, least universal stain blocker
Zinsser Cover Stain, oil based, great stain blocker, about two hour recoat, good but a lesser underbody of options, worst odor of options, clean up with thinner, sands powdery unlike other three
I've used them all over the years and any would serve, but the latex choices are probably best all around for what you need.

ToolSeeker 02-12-2013 08:42 AM

Since you are spraying latex primer the pilot light is not an issue. If you look in some wood working supply magazines or on line there are products made just to fill the grain in woods such as oak.
Just a word of warning for spraying your top coats with an HVLP. If you are planning on using a latex top coat a regular HVLP may not work. Latex paint is so thick it must be thinned a lot to spray in HVLP unless you have a 4 or 5 stage turbine whice costs like a $1000 and up. The problem is the air from your gun dries the thinned paint too fast and makes it look streaky. Don't ask how I know this.:whistling2: You may consider renting an airless sprayer for this job, using mine solved the problem. With airless you don't have to thin.:thumbup:

Faron79 02-13-2013 10:51 PM

I have some pics on Gardenweb, of a small project I did on my entry-door sidelights....using FPE stuff.

Faron

wetech 02-14-2013 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToolSeeker (Post 1115585)
Since you are spraying latex primer the pilot light is not an issue. If you look in some wood working supply magazines or on line there are products made just to fill the grain in woods such as oak.
Just a word of warning for spraying your top coats with an HVLP. If you are planning on using a latex top coat a regular HVLP may not work. Latex paint is so thick it must be thinned a lot to spray in HVLP unless you have a 4 or 5 stage turbine whice costs like a $1000 and up. The problem is the air from your gun dries the thinned paint too fast and makes it look streaky. Don't ask how I know this.:whistling2: You may consider renting an airless sprayer for this job, using mine solved the problem. With airless you don't have to thin.:thumbup:


I've been spraying all of the 6 panel doors in my house with a Wagner HVLP conversion gun hooked into a 20 gallon compressor. Primed with BIN, and top coat of Insl-x Cabinet Coat thinned with 2oz water and 2oz Flotrol per 32oz paint. Been working great. Next project is going to be the kitchen cabinets.

Mroe192 02-27-2013 10:20 PM

And the update...... Tried filling with MH Ready Patch. That was an epic fail. I put too much on and then spent 2.5 days sanding and took too much off. The grain is still very prevalent. I was in the midst of painting. 2 coats bullseye latex primer and two coats of paint. I am getting yellowish/brown bleed through from the grain. Should I go back to square one and use BIN or Coverstain.??? I am worried about mixing solvent types in my gun too as it was a big investment that I don't want to ruin. It's a Fuji Mini Mite 3. So far it has been awesome for spraying the latex.


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