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Old 03-29-2008, 04:32 PM   #1
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


I'm halfway through painting my entire house and I just made the realizaition that I may have made a mistake. The house is 3-1/2 years old with white "builders grade" paint. It was sprayed and back-rolled by the builder, i have my doubts if it was primed. I am putting two coats of F&H Masterpiece low lustre paint on top of the builder's paint. In small areas where I did joint compound work, I spot primed with Kilz.

I notice that when I apply the F&H paint to the areas with the Kilz, it goes on a LOT smoother, easier, and takes a lot longer to dry. This would indicate to me that much more finish paint it staying on the surface where I want it as opposed to getting sucked into the drywall through the builder's paint.

Did I make a major mistake in not priming the entire house before painting? Will this cause problems down the road? I really wish I primed the bathrooms with a mildew resustant primer like Kilz premium.

By the way, not using Kilz to cover anything up, just using it because its readily available and I like the workability of it.

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Old 03-29-2008, 09:02 PM   #2
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


That's a good indication the original job was pretty cheesy paint, and poorly (thinly) applied
Although usually there's no reason to prime a simple repaint, this type of project, painting over a poor builder's paint job, would be an exception

I would suggest priming the rest of the walls you are re-painting before you paint them

I know you are happy with your product choice so far, but I would be remiss in not mentioning the poor adhesion qualities of the latex Kilz products
Especially in a difficult (not perfect or ideal) situation such as this, I'd really strongly suggest a better primer
The Zinsser, Ben Moore, or Sherwin Williams latex primers are much superior for this application
If you have any chaulky builder's paint, you'll want a specialty sealer such as Zinsser's Gardz

Your paint job is at a high risk of failure, you need to stack the deck a little

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Old 03-29-2008, 09:10 PM   #3
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


Have you ever used F&H paint?

I guess I should take that unopened can of Kilz back and trade it in for some Bin...




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Originally Posted by slickshift View Post
That's a good indication the original job was pretty cheesy paint, and poorly (thinly) applied
Although usually there's no reason to prime a simple repaint, this type of project, painting over a poor builder's paint job, would be an exception

I would suggest priming the rest of the walls you are re-painting before you paint them

I know you are happy with your product choice so far, but I would be remiss in not mentioning the poor adhesion qualities of the latex Kilz products
Especially in a difficult (not perfect or ideal) situation such as this, I'd really strongly suggest a better primer
The Zinsser, Ben Moore, or Sherwin Williams latex primers are much superior for this application
If you have any chaulky builder's paint, you'll want a specialty sealer such as Zinsser's Gardz

Your paint job is at a high risk of failure, you need to stack the deck a little
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Old 03-29-2008, 09:18 PM   #4
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


If they have the 1-2-3 (the latex primer from Zinsser, the company that makes BIN), that would be a better choice than the BIN shellac based primer/sealer

But yes, if you haven't opened it I would return/exchange it if possible
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Old 03-29-2008, 09:55 PM   #5
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


Man, you have no idea how many man-hours I put into this painting project so far. It it fails, I am going to FREAK.

Thanks for your advice. Switching to BIN (you're not the first one to say this)


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Originally Posted by slickshift View Post
If they have the 1-2-3 (the latex primer from Zinsser, the company that makes BIN), that would be a better choice than the BIN shellac based primer/sealer

But yes, if you haven't opened it I would return/exchange it if possible

Last edited by Plasmech; 03-29-2008 at 09:59 PM.
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Old 03-29-2008, 11:24 PM   #6
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


You really don't need the BIN for this project. BIN is an excellent primer for stain-blocking. However, stain blocking isn't what you need. In addition, BIN requires a respirator to apply indoors, and cleanup is a pain in the rear.

Use a quality water-base primer that isn't Kilz-brand, and you will be fine. My "go to" primer is Sherwin Williams PrepRite Pro Block Latex. You can also use 1-2-3, and I'm sure Ben Moore or F&H have one too.

I've been doing the same thing you have been (going over builder paint or badly-applied ugly-looking homeowner paint), and have been pretty pleased with the Pro Block Latex so far.

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Old 03-30-2008, 07:43 AM   #7
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


Thanks for your advice. Switching to BIN (you're not the first one to say this)

Just to add what the others have said, this is NOT the primer you need, any other normal latex primer will do the job( just stay away from the big box stores, Kilz,Behr, etc.) and go to any real paint store.
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Old 03-30-2008, 08:01 AM   #8
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


What exactly is so bad about Kilz?


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Originally Posted by chrisn View Post
Thanks for your advice. Switching to BIN (you're not the first one to say this)

Just to add what the others have said, this is NOT the primer you need, any other normal latex primer will do the job( just stay away from the big box stores, Kilz,Behr, etc.) and go to any real paint store.
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Old 03-30-2008, 12:50 PM   #9
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


Water-base Kilz in inexplicably a horrible primer. There have been serveral reports here, and on other boards, of it literally falling off the wall, or the topcoat not adhering to the Kilz properly. And this is under circumstances under which water-base primers are supposed to do just fine. We are talking ordinary drywall priming here, not some witches-brew of lacquer-coated melamine or similar... Given that primers are generally supposed to enhance adhesion, this is about 100% unacceptable.

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Old 03-30-2008, 01:22 PM   #10
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


I bought a gallon of S-W prep-rite primer today. Expensive but better than the paint falling off the wall. That would really suck.

Also bought a gallon of their silica ceiling paint, the stuff that turns from violet to white when dry. The guy said I was the first person to ever buy it.



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Originally Posted by sirwired View Post
Water-base Kilz in inexplicably a horrible primer. There have been serveral reports here, and on other boards, of it literally falling off the wall, or the topcoat not adhering to the Kilz properly. And this is under circumstances under which water-base primers are supposed to do just fine. We are talking ordinary drywall priming here, not some witches-brew of lacquer-coated melamine or similar... Given that primers are generally supposed to enhance adhesion, this is about 100% unacceptable.

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Old 03-30-2008, 02:37 PM   #11
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Priming "builders grade" paint before painting


I saw that on their website recently. Let us know how it turns out.

SirWired

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