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Old 09-11-2011, 12:36 PM   #1
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primer included in paint... does it work


I have a house which has an oil based paint that is 20 years old but in relatively good shape. Do I need to put on a separate primer coat (then main coat) or are the new paints that include the primer going to be just as good for long term durability.

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Old 09-11-2011, 01:09 PM   #2
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primer included in paint... does it work


Of course it doesn't work. It's nothing but a marketing ploy. You try and combine a paint and a primer in one product, all you get is a product that is neither a good primer nor a good paint.

In your case you want to wash the walls down and prime with ideally an oil based primer like Zinsser Coverstain. Barring that you can use a high quality acrylic like Zinsser 1-2-3. Zinsser also has a couple new high adhesion primers called Bondz and Ultra Prime if I recall correctly. Either route, you can top coat with whatever you want, preferably not paint from any of the big box stores.

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Old 09-11-2011, 01:22 PM   #3
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primer included in paint... does it work


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Of course it doesn't work. It's nothing but a marketing ploy. You try and combine a paint and a primer in one product, all you get is a product that is neither a good primer nor a good paint.
Then why are industry-leading and respected companies like Benjamin Moore and Sherwin Williams advertising their top-of-line products as self-priming and as having the primer and paint in the same can?

There is such a thing as "progress" you know. At one time, it was said that "all-weather" tires were just a marketing ploy - that you had to have "snow" tires on during winter weather, and regular tires for the other seasons. Don't imagine that many of us still have that stack of snow tires sitting in our garage ready to go on at the hint of snow season.

And before you say, "no they don't" concerning the "respected" brands,

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Old 09-11-2011, 02:20 PM   #4
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primer included in paint... does it work


John- we've done this before

THE question is, what do you want your primer- primer in paint to do ?
IF you can answer that well, then we can answer the question.
I carry about 5 primers- they all do different things. ANYBODYS supposed all in one will not stop stains, adhere well to glossy surfaces, etc.
Primers are not one thing, they are many different things.
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Old 09-11-2011, 05:31 PM   #5
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primer included in paint... does it work


[quote=JohnKC;725946]Then why are industry-leading and respected companies like Benjamin Moore and Sherwin Williams advertising their top-of-line products as self-priming and as having the primer and paint in the same can?

There is such a thing as "progress" you know. At one time, it was said that "all-weather" tires were just a marketing ploy - that you had to have "snow" tires on during winter weather, and regular tires for the other seasons. Don't imagine that many of us still have that stack of snow tires sitting in our garage ready to go on at the hint of snow season.

And before you say, "no they don't" concerning the "respected" brands,

[/quote]


$$$$$$$

It is still a marketing ploy and nothing more. Respectable or not.
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Old 09-11-2011, 05:53 PM   #6
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primer included in paint... does it work


john yes you can use it in some applactions as a primer .but try and use it over 25 year old gloss alkyd, it will not adhere at least not to my likeing . or use it over warter staind walls ,nictine stained walls. guess what it wont work. yea but the poster says its paint and primer in one.so now you have all the labor in doing this and the paint dont stick ,warter spots come through ,and the nicckatine comes through. and heres what gets me and i might be wrong on this one ,people think you put one coat on and you painted and primed in that one coat .no first coat is primer and 2 coat is top coat
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Old 09-11-2011, 06:49 PM   #7
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primer included in paint... does it work


No professional in his right mind would use the paint and primer in one process no matter how much progress it represents. 'nuff said, end of story.
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Old 09-11-2011, 08:26 PM   #8
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primer included in paint... does it work


Gym- that is a bit of an overstatement. I do know of good contractors ( right from sister forum Paint Talk) that swear by 2 coats Aura over bare sheetrock.
But bare sheetrock isn't the only situation one can encounter painting that might need a primer.
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Old 09-12-2011, 03:21 AM   #9
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primer included in paint... does it work


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Gym- that is a bit of an overstatement. I do know of good contractors ( right from sister forum Paint Talk) that swear by 2 coats Aura over bare sheetrock.
But bare sheetrock isn't the only situation one can encounter painting that might need a primer.

Ya, and as you pointed out( I think) why use $60 paint as you're first coat? Makes no sense to me, but ,hey, to each there own.
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Old 09-12-2011, 06:41 AM   #10
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primer included in paint... does it work


Yep it's still just marketing. Read the back of the can before commenting on these reputable companies' marketing tactics. There are generally one or two substrates listed that it can self prime on. Everything else will have a primer recommendation first.
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Old 09-12-2011, 09:16 PM   #11
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primer included in paint... does it work


Thanks for the great info..... any thoughts as to what is the best primer and preparation for an oil based paint that is probably 20 years old. I bought the house 8 years ago and the surface is surprisingly still in relatively good shape.

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Old 09-13-2011, 02:35 AM   #12
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primer included in paint... does it work


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Thanks for the great info..... any thoughts as to what is the best primer and preparation for an oil based paint that is probably 20 years old. I bought the house 8 years ago and the surface is surprisingly still in relatively good shape.

Don50

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