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-   -   Paint or stain for shingled house? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f4/paint-stain-shingled-house-11627/)

skwpt 09-17-2007 06:48 PM

Paint or stain for shingled house?
 
It's time to paint my house. Or maybe stain.

Stain was recommended as being really low maintenance, but we stained our new deck (Behr Deck and Railing Stain) last spring, and it looks dingy and dull this year. We put a medium grey on the floor and painted the rails white. I find it extremely hard to clean, and the bottom rails are full of mildew, despite the paint supposedly having mildew control.

I am considering repainting the rails with a latex semi gloss, hoping they'll be be easier to maintain and clean. We get lots of bird poop out there because of our gardens and bird feeders.

Do any of you pro exterior painters have an opinion as to which is better for maintenance and durability (paint or stain)? I assume if I do fastidious prep work, my paint (stain) job should last around 10 years.

I live in New England with cold, winters, humid summers, and our house doesn't get more than 4 hours of sun in mid summer (huge trees), with almost no sun on the front and north side of the house.

The house is covered in what looks to be badly-peeling painted white pine shingles, which were put over clapboard (which makes me think lead paint way down there).

slickshift 09-17-2007 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
Stain was recommended as being really low maintenance...
we stained our new deck (Behr Deck and Railing Stain) last spring, and it looks dingy and dull this year.

No and yes...and no....
Stain is not really low maintenance
However, stain is a much better product (than paint) for decks
Unfortunately, the Behr deck stain is bottom of the barrel...I'm surprised it took this long to look bad
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
We put a medium grey on the floor and painted the rails white. I find it extremely hard to clean, and the bottom rails are full of mildew, despite the paint supposedly having mildew control.

They have a great marketing department though
Some mildew control products work better than others
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
I am considering repainting the rails with a latex semi gloss, hoping they'll be be easier to maintain and clean. We get lots of bird poop out there because of our gardens and bird feeders.

You have a point...but that's another thread (Fixing a Behr latex stain deck before things get ugly and I have to re-deck)
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
Do any of you pro exterior painters have an opinion as to which is better for maintenance and durability (paint or stain)?

For a deck...stain...no doubt...always better
For a house...it depends
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
I assume if I do fastidious prep work, my paint (stain) job should last around 10 years.

That would be unreasonable for New England
3-5 would be respectable
Nearly any house that's been ten years since painting will have issues that will make more work for the re-paint
If it doesn't, it would be more a location and good maint. thing...not prep
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
I live in New England with cold, winters, humid summers, and our house doesn't get more than 4 hours of sun in mid summer (huge trees), with almost no sun on the front and north side of the house.

You've got a mold factory there
You'll need to keep this in mind
And you'll need to regularly clean anything outside...and probably use a mildecide regularly also
Quote:

Originally Posted by skwpt (Post 63484)
The house is covered in what looks to be badly-peeling painted white pine shingles, which were put over clapboard (which makes me think lead paint way down there).

The badly peeling paint will have to be removed

Do you have pics?
It may need a complete strip, or maybe just a scrape
It depends

Also:
How old is the house?
Is it on/near the water?
Was it ever a summer home and converted to year round?

These could affect which is better for your house

skwpt 09-18-2007 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
However, stain is a much better product (than paint) for decks. Unfortunately, the Behr deck stain is bottom of the barrel...I'm surprised it took this long to look bad

Consumer Reports gave Behr a good rating. </wah> What brand stain would you use? I love working with Benjamin Moore paints; maybe I will try their stain. Or Cabot?

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
Quote:

Originally Posted by me
I assume if I do fastidious prep work, my paint (stain) job should last around 10 years.

That would be unreasonable for New England
3-5 would be respectable
Nearly any house that's been ten years since painting will have issues that will make more work for the re-paint
If it doesn't, it would be more a location and good maint. thing...not prep

OK, thanks. That's good to know, so I can plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
Quote:

Originally Posted by me
I live in New England with cold, winters, humid summers, and our house doesn't get more than 4 hours of sun in mid summer (huge trees), with almost no sun on the front and north side of the house.

You've got a mold factory there
You'll need to keep this in mind
And you'll need to regularly clean anything outside...and probably use a mildecide regularly also

OK. So yearly with a power washer. I read that can damage a paint job and that you're better off using a long scrub brush and a regular hose.

What's a good mildecide besides bleach? My town doesn't have public sewage (we all have septic tanks), and I don't want to adversely affect my leach field.

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
The badly peeling paint will have to be removed

Yup. I am thinking a good power wash will take care of the worst of it, and then it will be me, a ladder, a scraper, and sandpaper.

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
Do you have pics?
It may need a complete strip, or maybe just a scrape
It depends

I can post some up later. A complete strip may not be out of the question. I can peel some of it off completely with my fingers.

I was originally thinking of stripping down all the shingles, installing fresh insulation (though inspectors said the house was well insulated already), and putting up brand new shingles (white pine, so I can get that lovely grey patina you see on houses at the ocean). But I am concerned that the house's northern exposure will just make it look wet and moldy. Not to mention the cost. If I do all the labor, I can save myself close to $4K by painting the house myself (and, yes, I have done exterior painting before).

Quote:

Originally Posted by slickshift
How old is the house?
Is it on/near the water?
Was it ever a summer home and converted to year round?

Built in 1948 in a former mill town, so the only nearby bodies of water are fresh (ocean is about 45 minutes away).
It was never a summer home. The structure of the house is in excellent shape with a great foundation (according to our home inspector and the structural engineer we hired as a backup). It was built when houses were made with good quality materials (plaster walls, etc.) and pride.

slickshift 09-18-2007 02:37 PM

Yeah the Behr/CR thing is a mystery wrapped in an enigma...

Suffice to say that all things being perfect, most Behr products can function
It takes a long time and more product and more hassles to get there, and they never, ever, look as good as premium products, but they can actually work
Any deviation or less than perfect conditions create problems immediately
I'm sure the laboratory testing at CR don't take many real world factors into play
They also are not tested by painters, they are tested by lab techs
This means important painting criteria are left out, and others that aren't important are emphasized...
They also have never had to tell a customer that stained their deck 3 years ago with a now pealing Behr goo that won't strip/scrape/sand off that their best option is to re-deck
...but that's another thread...

BM and C's stains are fine...I've used them both
Professionally I tend to spec C for "clear" and "semi", Sikkens for "solid" (looks like paint)
I'd use BM if the customer preferred, or if it was a supply issue

Quote:

So yearly with a power washer. I read that can damage a paint job and that you're better off using a long scrub brush and a regular hose.
Yearly...well that depends on your specific situation
Could be more/less
I'd say yearly min. anyway...even if it looks OK

A PW can damage the siding if not done right...heck I've demo'd swing sets with one before (on purpose;))
The avg. H/O is probably better off with a hose and brush
It just that it looks too much like work, and not as fun as spraying with a machine

Most wait until long after mold/mildew is a problem and the brush.hose is simply not enough

If done regularly, and before m/m becomes an issue, a brush and hose is fine and much safer than PWing

Quote:

What's a good mildecide besides bleach? My town doesn't have public sewage (we all have septic tanks), and I don't want to adversely affect my leach field.
A JOMAX/bleach/water mix is excellent
The amount of bleach in the mix is 1/1000 of what you would pour directly into your water supply if you were having a bacteria issue (first try, second would be more)

Quote:

...stripping down all the shingles...and putting up brand new shingles
If your house is a candidate for a full strip, this may be an option
The shingles are not easy to strip paint off of...it will be time consuming and messy
It may be close to the cost for re-shingling (+/-) to properly do this
Of course, the DIY aspect of cost savings enters in here, with what you are comfortable doing yourself
But I have looked at shingled house that needed a complete strip, that it was cost effective to re-shingle
It depends on many factors

Quote:

(white pine, so I can get that lovely grey patina you see on houses at the ocean). But I am concerned that the house's northern exposure will just make it look wet and moldy.
Welcome to my world
It could get mold (you have a mold factory over there after all)
More likely it would turn black on the tips of the shingles
Regular PWing helps
Or, as some around here do, a clear sealer (eh...not sure it's worth it) or bleaching oil or hub oil (nasty but effective)
Most leave them untreated

As per the house, just checking to see if it might be a "wet house" as that could make a difference...you don't have a likely candidate for one of those though

skwpt 09-18-2007 05:49 PM

Wow, thanks!

I raced home to take pictures, but I got stuck at work an extra 90 minutes, so the light isn't great.

We washed the house with a scrub brush, extension pole, and Simple Green last October. If you click the pictures link below, you can see how much mildew crept in in less than a year.

As for the paint, we should have done it a year ago, maybe even two (this being our third summer), but we had other projects we were working on and limited funds.

I contracted a painter for this past spring, but I was disappointed with his other work, so I let him go. And by then I was knee deep in joint compound. ;)

Pictures

NateHanson 09-18-2007 06:02 PM

Do you mean White Cedar? I've not seen many houses shingled with pine in NE. Most are white or red cedar (white being preferred for longevity, and for that silver patina you referred to).

skwpt 09-19-2007 07:41 AM

Sorry, yes, white cedar.


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