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Paint and Primer in One? Some Insight

12K views 66 replies 16 participants last post by  Will22 
#1 · (Edited)
Hey Folks
I managed to secure access to an online article that gives some authoritative insight on the issue. It's an excellent article, and Brushjockey will be pleased that it supports his assertion that primers are problem solvers. Though the pros know the value and necessity of primer, less knowledgable HO's and Diy'ers assume that primers are primers and any will do. Not so.
The permission to have this article available to us is generously provided by Paint and Decorating Retailers Magazine. The article is available to members/subscibers only, so we owe them thanks for giving Diychatroom members free access to help us understand this issue. Thanks to Diane Capuano, executive editor and author of the article. Please support them.

Go to my blog to find the link.
 
#53 ·
If you read the link to ASTM D 3359, you will see that the test is intended for a metal substraights and is also for light duty adhesion. Since most houses are not built with "Perfect Wood", i think that if a more strengent test method was used for the appropriate substraight the results would be more true and accurate. These test can be performed over wood,plaster or drywall according to application methods and cure times suggested by the manufacturer. Performance test such as Abbrasion test (scrubability), mold/mildew testing, UV exposure and flexability testing can be found on product data sheets for most quality coatings already. This information is not present on the Behr paint PDS so it probably has never been indepentently tested for its overall performance and longevity. Coverage and hiding power is only a small portion of what makes a quality paint. If someone really wanted to compair the overall performance of products, following the test standards set by ASTM would be an accurate way of doing so.
 
#54 ·
If you read the link to ASTM D 3359, you will see that the test is intended for a metal substraights and is also for light duty adhesion. Since most houses are not built with "Perfect Wood", i think that if a more strengent test method was used for the appropriate substraight the results would be more true and accurate. These test can be performed over wood,plaster or drywall according to application methods and cure times suggested by the manufacturer. Performance test such as Abbrasion test (scrubability), mold/mildew testing, UV exposure and flexability testing can be found on product data sheets for most quality coatings already. This information is not present on the Behr paint PDS so it probably has never been indepentently tested for its overall performance and longevity. Coverage and hiding power is only a small portion of what makes a quality paint. If someone really wanted to compair the overall performance of products, following the test standards set by ASTM would be an accurate way of doing so.
agreed:thumbsup:
 
#55 ·
This information is not present on the Behr paint PDS so it probably has never been indepentently tested for its overall performance and longevity

I didn't know that this hadn't been done. Isn't that telling. And probably more Behr is sold than any paint, but "somehow" this kind of testing is not available, and all HO have is the Consumer Report that says if you're not willing to pay for the good stuff get this...
 
#56 ·
I see no indication of that testing standard on Aura Bath and Spa TDS either, but it ok's going over bare drwall. I am currently doing a bath remodel where I am testing it over existing drywall with a good bit of patching. The first coat looks pretty good for one coat. I'm also going to do a test with a piece of unprimed sheetrock that I will use for an adhesion test. I'll keep you posted. Thanks Mustang.
 
#57 · (Edited)
I see no indication of that testing standard on Aura Bath and Spa TDS either, but it ok's going over bare drwall. I am currently doing a bath remodel where I am testing it over existing drywall with a good bit of patching. The first coat looks pretty good for one coat. I'm also going to do a test with a piece of unprimed sheetrock that I will use for an adhesion test. I'll keep you posted. Thanks Mustang.
I've inserted a link to SW DTM Acrylic. As you can see, testing has been done on this product. What type of adhesion test are you going to do? The tape test will work if the adhesion power of the paint is less than the pull off strength of the tape. I like a pull off adhesion test with a mechanical gauge that records the results in inch pounds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3so3ktUA8E


http://www.paintdocs.com/webmsds/webPDF.jsp?SITEID=STORECAT&doctype=PDS&lang=E&prodno=B66W111
 
#59 ·
jsheridan;808983[COLOR=red said:
]Funny that you mention that, I just got one of those in my stocking for Christmas from Mom. She hoped that would suffice because they were out of the sling psychrometer that I had asked for, which my heart was so set on I couldn't sleep Christmas eve.[/COLOR] :laughing:

Thanks Mike, I think that SW is better at documenting their products. I also think that that info is provided on the products which have industrial applications, like where your line of work comes in, where the tech matters. BM Aura Bath and Spa, how many industrial apps do you think that's seen? One thing I've noticed in my times on BM site is that I've never seen any of their industrial products. Maybe you have to dig deeper than I ever have. To answer your question, I'll use a masking tape test, pressed hard, and torn off like a band-aid. If it passes that it's okay for me.

:laughing::laughing::laughing:
 
#60 ·
I know questions regarding CHB have been covered elsewhere, but I think this thread applies...


The manager at the SW store mentioned CHB as being a paint/primer in one. I have new drywall throughout my 1k+ sq. condo and because they only sell their New Drywall Primer by the (gallon), he mentioned moving over to CHB as an alternative, similiar price. I asked if their 400 line primer was better, he mentioned CHB as being the same thing, the only difference was you could leave it as a flat ceiling paint. One or two coats of CHB and your done.

I went back and forth with him a little, stating I was going to prime and apply 2 finished coats, so the one coat application did not apply to my situation. He said, try CHB, if it does not compare to our NDP then bring it back and will swap it out for our 400 primer.


Thoughts? I put the brakes on... (again) and thinking this over before I start the project. I cut in one of the rooms already with SW NDP and I like it!!


James
 
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