Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Painting

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-15-2013, 03:10 PM   #1
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7
Share |
Question

Paint prep bondo


I am new to this site. I am an out of work plumber/pipefiter . I am currently prepping my house to paint. It is my first time painting anything other than an interior sheet rock wall. I am a very meticulous person.

I went around the whole house with a pair of grinders with a cut off wheel and a flap disc cutting off and grinding down passed flush all the nails that were poking through the ply wood as well as sanding all areas such as where the nails split off a large chunk of wood, as well as all of the biscuts (i was told they were called this the little football shaped spots on ply wood)I finished applying the bondo and started sanding it yesterday.

I noticed that the sand paper on both the orbital sander and square pad palm sander would gum up a lot as well as sometimes leave a patch of what I thought was just paint dust that formed a putty. I would scrape off what I could on sand paper and ply wood.

This morning I sanded a spot that just seamed to smear around a little ( it looked like the bondo would look if I mixed too much or took too long to spread it out where it got thick and hard if not impossible to spread smooth and thin.) I asked a contractor buddy of mine who is a jack(ass) of all trades master of none type. He said I did not add enough hardener as it should be pink to light red in color and its mostly grey slightly darker than it was without hardener .

It says to mix no more than what you can apply in 3-4 min so the first couple batches got hard a lot sooner than 3-4 min I figured I was using too much hardener. My buddy told me to make it real read so I could sand it sooner but as I had a lot to do I was not worried about being able to sand 10 min later as you would want if you had a small job and you only had a small area to do and didn't want to wait the 15/20 min like can says u should be able to do. The directions on the can don't say it should be red just a consistent color.

So now that I'm done applying the bondo and ready to sand it it seams that most of it is not completely hard . As it is several days later for some spots I sanded today and yesterday I figure that m buddy is right and I didn't put enough hardener in the mix.

Has any body come across this problem before? Is it ok to paint over as long as I can get it to a smooth enough appearance for my likening ? I also called the tech support for 3m and the guy said same thing that it will never get hard and that I need to scrape it all off and start over. As it took me over a week to apply the first time I am not looking forward to removing and reapplying . Is this necessary? Can I paint over it or will it all peel or fall off if I paint over it? It is hard enough where it feels smooth to the touch but still a little tacky .

If you think it is absolutely necessary any tips to go as fast as possible( putty knife , scraper , grinder with wire wheel...?) If you made it to the bottom of this endless rant I commend your dedication to helping others in the do it yourself community. Thanks for your time and I appreciate your opinions .


Last edited by kwikfishron; 08-15-2013 at 03:29 PM. Reason: added spaces
467piper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2013, 03:25 PM   #2
Too Short? Cut it Again!
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 9,635
Default

Paint prep bondo


First off, if you can in the future, paragraph spaces help us read posts. And you might update your profile so we know where you are should it ever matter in responding to threads. Now that I have hall monitor duties out of the way!

Did you use regular autobody bondo or the wood filler product? The latter is acceptable but not my first choice, the autobody filler is really not a good choice for siding. Bondo is fine for fiberglass and metal but expands and contracts differently than wood and could cause you problems down the road.

Most important is that it sounds like you have a cure problem. This could be because you did not mix properly to get a catalytic reaction. Even more likely is that the stuff was not stored properly or you were sold outdated material that will now never cure. For some reason, box stores in particular tend to sell outdated two part systems and it drives me nuts when I come in after the problem. I don't shop in box stores personally. If you check the can and it is a recent purchase I would take it back where you bought it and use some semi bad words in expressing your frustration.

Not much you can do if it refuses to cure. The chemical reaction needed is likely to never happen. You can try priming and painting over it and hope for the best. Ideally, the safest thing to do is dig it out of your way and start over. You could cure something over the top but you would lose your flush surface and if a perfectionist like you mention, I suspect the look would drive you crazy over time.

Next time a filler for wood, or an epoxy paste like that from Abatron (my go to folks for wood restoration resins) would be a better choice. And always check the expiration dates on anything and especially products that have parts that must mix together to cure.

Sort of a sidebar about non curing resin. I and a professor friend once had the bright idea to teach fellow college students how to build fiberglass kayaks. Enthusiasm was extremely high the first weekend we started six with 24 people. My fellow instructor and I alone ended up seaming sides together and finishing them all a few weeks later! One fool forgot catalyst completely and laid up the hull with $150 worth of fiberglass cloth and resin with nothing to cure it. I had no choice but to lay a layer that would cure over it and gel coat the outside when pulled out of the mold. This sealed the goo layer in but that thing weighed what an aircraft carrier does and was not safe on rough water.

I also restored sailboats at one time which is how I learned the lesson about outdated resins and other two part systems firsthand. I do feel your frustration in this.


Last edited by user1007; 08-15-2013 at 03:32 PM.
user1007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2013, 04:20 PM   #3
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7
Default

Paint prep bondo


I used mostly the body filler bondo. I started with the all purpose can that says designed for interior/exterior home use. Wasn't nearly enough so I bought the other stuff because it came in a bigger quantity which made it cheaper and it says it fixes wood and somewhere I can't find it now but it said it will not shrink. My contractor buddy also said the same thing that it will not shrink like say sheet rock spackle that you would put on thick and sand down flush. He said it won't shrink so put on thin and smooth to minimize sanding. As far as can I don't see a date, just a code stamp on too I'm sure I could call and find out how old it is.

As far as not mixing properly like I said I made a few batches with the all purpose stuff with the white hardener and after thoroughly mixing to a consistent color it got hard after only maybe 2 min to the point were it was still plyable but too hard to spread thin and smooth it out with out making it look spongy . So admittedly I started putting a little less hardener in but it always started getting thick and hard after 3-4 min. Still 95% is a shade darker than when it comes out of can before hardener . After using the whole can I have less than 1/4 tube of hardener left. I assume they give you a little more than just enough to do whole can in case you put a little too much in. A few batches I did squeeze out what I thought was too much and applied it as quick as possible but still got hard way to fast but it was pinkish to red so maybe just right.? It was not that warm out so I don't think temp had much to do with it. Although a couple times I had mix sitting in the sun for the 2-3 min I was applying so obviously that didn't help on those batches

As far as the shrinkage goes nothing that I got perfectly smooth and close to flush seamed to shrink but maybe since it did not fully cure it wouldn't shrink ? Any way I have some soul searching to do and see if I have the patience to remove and re apply , or see if I can let my OCD go and hope the look will not bother me. Thanks again for your time and opinions.

I will update profile soon I just registered today to figure this issue out ASAP .
467piper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2013, 04:40 PM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 59
Default

Paint prep bondo


The two-part epoxy fillers cost a lot more but have working times out to an hour; enough time to do a proper job of thorough mixing and still have a decent working time left. MUCH easier to use than the two-minute bondo polyester-resin-based filler.
Pro Painter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2013, 04:47 PM   #5
Too Short? Cut it Again!
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 9,635
Default

Paint prep bondo


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pro Painter View Post
The two-part epoxy fillers cost a lot more but have working times out to an hour; enough time to do a proper job of thorough mixing and still have a decent working time left. MUCH easier to use than the two-minute bondo polyester-resin-based filler.
Yup! I really did start using this stuff repairing sailboat railings. Have used on home restorations now for decades too. Company would never send me outdated components. The liguid fill and resin combination is great for rescuing complex millwork. It is made to work with wood.

http://www.abatron.com/building-and-....html?vmcchk=1

Nothing against 3M universally but I wish they would not force products into categories they do not belong. I think the suggestion silicone is a reasonable general purpose caulking material even more evil than them suggesting Bondo is for wood repair!!!!

Last edited by user1007; 08-15-2013 at 04:52 PM.
user1007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2013, 05:00 PM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 59
Default

Paint prep bondo


Quote:
Originally Posted by sdsester View Post
Yup! I really did start using this stuff repairing sailboat railings. Have used on home restorations now for decades too. Company would never send me outdated components. The liguid fill and resin combination is great for rescuing complex millwork. It is made to work with wood.

http://www.abatron.com/building-and-....html?vmcchk=1

Nothing against 3M universally but I wish they would not force products into categories they do not belong. I think the suggestion silicone is a reasonable general purpose caulking material even more evil than them suggesting Bondo is for wood repair!!!!
Yup; really amazing how wood rots so much faster behind silicone caulk than if the rot pocket is just left open [ventilation!].

Another good wood-restoration product-pair is from Smith & Co.: http://www.smithandcompany.org/products.html

Pro Painter is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Pro Painter For This Useful Post:
user1007 (08-17-2013)
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Zinsser Bathroom Paint canuckjack Painting 7 08-27-2012 08:00 AM
Ceiling paint versus wall paint billyg Painting 6 02-09-2012 07:38 PM
Paint riddle... Please help me fix this? techprincesse Painting 8 08-24-2009 10:00 AM
Paint will not stick in Bathroom! SGTHetland Painting 9 08-17-2008 11:04 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.