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Old 06-18-2008, 11:08 PM   #1
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


After reading all of the Behr paint threads, I feel confirmed in my dislike of Behr paint. I thought that it was just me!

Anyway, it also seems to point to Behr paint as my problem (it has been fine in a child's bedroom, but not in my second application in the master bath).

Here's the story...
Master Bathroom (so, lots of use)
I removed wall paper.
Textured the walls by hand (with wall stuff, not texture paint)
Two coats of Kilz premium primer
One coat of Behr paint (satin or semi-gloss)

I think that it has been two or three years and I don't remember when it started (I thought that it was just condensation from showering), but the walls are "bleeding". It looks like water is dripping down the walls, but it is sticky to the touch and never dries.

Where do I begin? The bathroom isn't too big, but has a vaulted ceiling (16 feet at the highest point) with a high ledge (I had to put the extension ladder in the shower) and was a big undertaking the first time (and my husband didn't like the interruption to his "routine" and my tools all over the bathroom). And I don't like the texture, so if that is obliterated in the process or has to be redone, I won't be upset.

Thanks for your help!

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Old 06-19-2008, 12:03 AM   #2
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


Is this bleeding distinctly brown in colour? And, does anyone smoke in the bathroom? If so, it is condensation, but it's got nicotine and dirt dissolved in it, and that's what's making it sticky.

The only other thing I can think of is something called "surfactant exudation", that that only occurs in latex paints shortly after they've been applied, not years later.

Latex paints contain surfactants (which can be thought of as "soap") which help them wet the surface of whatever they're applied to so they adhere better.

However, if there's high humidity in the air shortly after painting, these surfactants will be drawn to the surface of the paint as it dries and will form sticky streaks that run down the surface of the paint. However, since those surfactants are soluble in water, you should be able to clean them off easily.

Here, go to www.paintquality.com
Click on the grey "Problem Solver" link
In either the Interior or Exterior drop down menus, scroll down to "Surfactant Leaching" and click on it.

Ignore the grain of the wood. Look at the streaks running down the wood.

Is that kinda what your paint bleeding problem looks like?

Here's more info:
http://www.paintquality.com/pdf_file...ntleaching.pdf


Last edited by Nestor_Kelebay; 06-19-2008 at 12:12 AM.
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Old 06-19-2008, 11:30 AM   #3
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


No one smokes in our house.

I looked at your links, and it looks a bit like that, although there isn't any brown. It looks like water that is stuck, but it doesn't dry and is sticky.

It may have occurred right after application, but I just don't remember. I remember noticing it above the shower first (which is pretty high), and I didn't notice it on the wall at eye level. So, I'm guessing that at least that part didn't happen immediately. Now, it seems to be everywhere.

Is there a better paint to use in the bathroom? Even if I clear this up, I wasn't ever able to put on a second coat because the paint just dripped on itself. I thought that this was a semi-gloss/satin issue, but I used AT in another bathroom and I was able to put a second coat where needed.

Thanks for your help.
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Old 06-19-2008, 05:38 PM   #4
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


I wouldn't spend too much time trying to figure out which particular way Behr has failed you. Instead, I would use a nice, strong detergent like a TSP solution to clean the walls, rinse, topcoat with a water-base stain-blocking primer, and then topcoat with two coats of Kitchen/Bath paint from a paint store. (Several here have mentioned that Sherwin's is quite good.)

Do not use that bathroom for showering or hot baths for a week before and after the painting, if possible. This gives the paint more time to cure before subjecting it to lots of steam.

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Old 06-19-2008, 08:28 PM   #5
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


Unfortunately, it doesn't appear the project was done correctly
Your Amityville Horror walls could be a few things
For future reference, it could be the leftover wallpaper adhesive residue leaching through
The walls should have been primed with a solvent based primer before being textured
Kilz Premium isn't enough close to being good enough to handle the task of sealing any residuals
It could be the Behr...they do tend to load up on cheap surfactants which can lead to surfactant leaching (normally an exterior issue)

As it's a big project, and there's not really a "Huh...that didn't work...let's try..." factor involved, I would not trust the re-sealing to anything but a solvent based primer
Scrub it all well...get that goo off
TSP, Spic and Span....Top Job
Whatever works
Seal it with a Ben Moore (Fresh Start), Sherwin Williams (PrepRite), or Zinsser (Cover Stain), alkyd (oil) based primer
Although BM, SW, and Z, all make excellent bath paints, in this case I wouldn't mess around and go straight to the BM Aura (any sheen)

If this doesn't solve the problem, nothing short of bathroom remover will
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Old 06-19-2008, 09:57 PM   #6
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chianti View Post
No one smokes in our house.

Is there a better paint to use in the bathroom?
I use Zinsser's PermaWhite Bathroom paint in all 21 bathrooms in my building, and I've never had any trouble with it. See if any of the stores in your area carry it.
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Old 06-20-2008, 10:32 AM   #7
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


Quote:
Originally Posted by slickshift View Post
Unfortunately, it doesn't appear the project was done correctly
Your Amityville Horror walls could be a few things
For future reference, it could be the leftover wallpaper adhesive residue leaching through
The walls should have been primed with a solvent based primer before being textured
Kilz Premium isn't enough close to being good enough to handle the task of sealing any residuals
It could be the Behr...they do tend to load up on cheap surfactants which can lead to surfactant leaching (normally an exterior issue)

As it's a big project, and there's not really a "Huh...that didn't work...let's try..." factor involved, I would not trust the re-sealing to anything but a solvent based primer
Scrub it all well...get that goo off
TSP, Spic and Span....Top Job
Whatever works
Seal it with a Ben Moore (Fresh Start), Sherwin Williams (PrepRite), or Zinsser (Cover Stain), alkyd (oil) based primer
Although BM, SW, and Z, all make excellent bath paints, in this case I wouldn't mess around and go straight to the BM Aura (any sheen)

If this doesn't solve the problem, nothing short of bathroom remover will
What is the difference...oil-based, alkyd based, solvent based primers? And which SW PrepRite alkyd primer? There seems to be more than one.

If I want to re-texture, after cleaning the walls (and sanding, I'm guessing), do I prime with oil-based, texture, prime (latex or oil?), and paint? Or do I texture, prime (oil-based), and then paint?

I used some rubbing alcohol, and it seems to be removing the goo.

Thanks.
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Old 06-20-2008, 08:04 PM   #8
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Need step by step instructions for fixing walls...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chianti View Post
What is the difference...oil-based, alkyd based, solvent based primers? And which SW PrepRite alkyd primer? There seems to be more than one.
Solvent based is kind of a general term meaning "not water-based"
Solvent based primers include shellacs and oils
Alkyd is a specific type of "oil-based" (and therefore a solvent-based) primer
Most "oil" primers are alkyd these days

Ask the sales people which alkyd is for your use (interior sealer)
There should be a few types
I'm more familiar with Benjamin Moore's line-up
I wouldn't want to accidentally tell you the wrong one
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chianti View Post
If I want to re-texture, after cleaning the walls (and sanding, I'm guessing), do I prime with oil-based, texture, prime (latex or oil?), and paint?
Yes...you want to prime before you texture

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chianti View Post
I used some rubbing alcohol, and it seems to be removing the goo.
Interesting
If it's working then use that
(Alcohol is also used in wallpaper stripping...maybe it is the oldresidue leaching)

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